View Poll Results: Should drug tests be required to get welfare benefits?

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  • Yes

    42 66.67%
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Thread: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

  1. #151
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    There are circumstances in which individuals find themselves on welfare, not because they can't hold down a job but because of the circumstances around the industry and economy. Not everyone is on welfare for life, which is really how you make it sound.
    Oh, for crying out loud. I never said there were no outside circumstances. If they are on welfare, they don't have a job. If they don't have a job, they can't hold down a job. It is that simple. Don't try to muddy the waters with this victimism b.s.
    You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love.For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”

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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    It's an offered social program to help those incapable of currently helping themselves. It isn't money for whoever wants it. You have to apply and seek approval, meet qualifications to receive the money. Any qualification they want to put in place that does not discriminate on the basis of race, sex, sexual orientation, age, or religion is completely justified.
    So you can say, for instance, no one on welfare is legally allowed to own a gun? They cannot protest at political events? They cannot redress the government? They may not freely associate?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  3. #153
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by SE102 View Post
    Aside from the loaded moral point we're making here... that check still stimulates the economy. The dealer likely buys munchies or other completely useless things to society that keep the economy rolling.
    The added debt from giving the moocher the money hurts us far worse than any gain by the spending of the free money. If it didn't, we could all stop working, and just get free-stuff.

  4. #154
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by ksu_aviator View Post
    Oh, for crying out loud. I never said there were no outside circumstances. If they are on welfare, they don't have a job. If they don't have a job, they can't hold down a job. It is that simple. Don't try to muddy the waters with this victimism b.s.
    It's pretty much worthless. These people deserve everything handed to them on a silver platter because they're poor and downtrodden, didn't you know? It should be hard, there shouldn't be restrictions, and we shouldn't require them to behave in any specific way...we should just give it out because they "need" it.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So you can say, for instance, no one on welfare is legally allowed to own a gun? They cannot protest at political events? They cannot redress the government? They may not freely associate?
    Those actions violate rights. Pissing in a cup does not violate their rights. If private employers can do it without ACLU protest and law suits then the government can do it as well
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  6. #156
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by ksu_aviator View Post
    Oh, for crying out loud. I never said there were no outside circumstances. If they are on welfare, they don't have a job. If they don't have a job, they can't hold down a job. It is that simple. Don't try to muddy the waters with this victimism b.s.
    If they can't hold down a job, then they cannot get off of welfare. If they cannot get off of welfare, then they are there for the long term. Are people on welfare always there for the long haul? Or is that only a subset of the welfare recipients? It's not always they cannot hold down a job as sometimes there being no job to hold down.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  7. #157
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Those actions violate rights. Pissing in a cup does not violate their rights. If private employers can do it without ACLU protest and law suits then the government can do it as well
    The People have the right to secure themselves, their effects, and their property from unreasonable search and seizure. Without reasonable suspicion to a crime, there is no reasonable means to search a person for that crime. Pissing in a cup is a search of one's person. The 4th clearly states we have the RIGHT to secure against unreasonable searches. You said:

    Any qualification they want to put in place that does not discriminate on the basis of race, sex, sexual orientation, age, or religion is completely justified.

    Everything that I listed followed those restrictions. How can you now have a problem with it when you said that it is completely justified previously?
    Last edited by Ikari; 06-06-11 at 05:30 PM.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  8. #158
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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    If they can't hold down a job, then they cannot get off of welfare. If they cannot get off of welfare, then they are there for the long term. Are people on welfare always there for the long haul? Or is that only a subset of the welfare recipients? It's not always they cannot hold down a job as sometimes there being no job to hold down.
    And when one becomes available but they fail to qualify because they test positive for drugs, we'll continue to foot the bill, right? Because it's okay for them to do drugs on our dime, even though most employers wouldn't allow it on their payroll.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The People have the right to secure themselves, their effects, and their property from unreasonable search and seizure. Without reasonable suspicion to a crime, there is no reasonable means to search a person for that crime. Pissing in a cup is a search of one's person. The 4th clearly states we have the RIGHT to secure against unreasonable searches.
    You've said that over, and over, and over again. You have not provided any legal basis for the insistance that a government-mandated drug test for anybody voluntarily applying for welfare is a violation of that right. Further, you would then have to explain why pirvate employers are allowed to violate the privacy and perform "unreasonable searches" against potential job candidates, but the government is not allowed to require such for those who are seeking a handout.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: Should Drug Tests Be Required to Get Welfare Benefits?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    And when one becomes available but they fail to qualify because they test positive for drugs, we'll continue to foot the bill, right? Because it's okay for them to do drugs on our dime, even though most employers wouldn't allow it on their payroll.
    Private business and government have different sets of restrictions. Maybe if you said that someone in general goes to a job, takes a test, fails; that the result of that test can be reported to the Welfare office and subsequent penatlies can be assessed. It's then not a general "test everyone" clause. It's at the very least slightly better than what is being currently passed/proposed.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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