View Poll Results: Should US Currency be pinned to a standard like weights and measures?

Voters
15. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes. Then money would always have exactly the same value.

    5 33.33%
  • No. Because then the government would not be able to print money it does not have.

    6 40.00%
  • Don't know. This is way to complicated for me.

    1 6.67%
  • Hmmm. What is a "standard"?

    3 20.00%
Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 49

Thread: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

  1. #31
    Basketball Nerd
    StillBallin75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Vilseck, Germany
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 07:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    21,896

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    It was only an example.
    point taken.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  2. #32
    global liberation

    ecofarm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Miami
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    66,359

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Great quote.
    Reminds me of this:

    "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see."

  3. #33
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    12,437
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Adam Smith struggled with the same issue. He even made very similar argument. You are in very good company. I have pondered it as well. He suggested grain, such as wheat, because it retained its value from year to year. It is clear to me that any chosen item will vary its value over time.


    I do not have a solution. But the idea of currency whose value remains fixed is interesting.
    This subject fascinates me, but reasonable discussion is rare.

    I only kind of get this subject, I believe its the "weights and measures" concept would be great but is impractical due to shifting values of various commodities upon which it might fixed, right? (More or less)

    Is there a reason that it couldn't be pinned to an amount of "work"? Or "energy"?

    When I designed my hot rod ebike, I commuted to work on a stock model for a year. I became very familiar with the amount of work I could expect from about 300 watts. (2 x 12v x 12 ah).

    I'm pretty sure that one of the natural functions of currency is to carry energy, so would a currency based on a unit of energy address the unstable value of commodities issue?

    A watt hour is a watt hour, fixed and agreed upon. Could we base a currency on this? Would it still have the issues of other "hard" currency proposals?
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

  4. #34
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Last Seen
    03-03-17 @ 10:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,813

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    This subject fascinates me, but reasonable discussion is rare.
    So far so good. Here. And now. But we are only 33 posts deep.

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    I only kind of get this subject, I believe its the "weights and measures" concept would be great but is impractical due to shifting values of various commodities upon which it might fixed, right? (More or less)
    Do we agree, in principle, that the idea has merit? Adam Smith proposed it in 1775. So it is clearly a hard problem to solve.

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Is there a reason that it couldn't be pinned to an amount of "work"? Or "energy"?
    A. Smith initially described it pinned to an amount of one's daily necessities one could purchase with a given amount of currency. So if my daily salary was originally sufficient to buy three loaves, tow fishes, and a bottle of fine wine, then tomorrow the same salary should continue to buy the same amount of the same things.
    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    . . .
    I'm pretty sure that one of the natural functions of currency is to carry energy, so would a currency based on a unit of energy address the unstable value of commodities issue?
    A watt hour is a watt hour, fixed and agreed upon. Could we base a currency on this? Would it still have the issues of other "hard" currency proposals?
    It is a hard problem. I sense a Nobel prize in Economics for the one who solves it.

  5. #35
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    12,437
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    So far so good. Here. And now. But we are only 33 posts deep.


    Do we agree, in principle, that the idea has merit? Adam Smith proposed it in 1775. So it is clearly a hard problem to solve.


    A. Smith initially described it pinned to an amount of one's daily necessities one could purchase with a given amount of currency. So if my daily salary was originally sufficient to buy three loaves, tow fishes, and a bottle of fine wine, then tomorrow the same salary should continue to buy the same amount of the same things.

    It is a hard problem. I sense a Nobel prize in Economics for the one who solves it.
    I think its worthy of discussion.

    And from the perspective of the Constitution, isn't the govt supposed to control the money supply and issue currency backed by gold and silver?

    Those two things are the only economic instructions in the Constitution, right?

    And both effectively gone as well if I understand correctly.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

  6. #36
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Last Seen
    03-03-17 @ 10:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,813

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    I think its worthy of discussion.
    And from the perspective of the Constitution, isn't the govt supposed to control the money supply and issue currency backed by gold and silver?
    Those two things are the only economic instructions in the Constitution, right?
    And both effectively gone as well if I understand correctly.
    This:
    To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;
    To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

    Yes. Congress has the authority to regulate the value of our money. In the second amendment well regulated means well trained or capable of hitting their mark. So the authority to regulate the vale of money might mean the authority to make sure that the value of the money ought to be consistent. But it could mean something else entirely.

  7. #37
    Sage
    Khayembii Communique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Milwaukee, WI
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,883

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis
    I do not have a solution. But the idea of currency whose value remains fixed is interesting.
    Currency by its very nature cannot have a fixed value because of its position as a univeral representation of the individual values of every commodity in existence. In other words, value in this sense does not make sense as it is a relation between two commodities and not an absolute, independent, thing.

    You are basically begging the question as to how this exchange value is determined, which What If...? came pretty close to solving in his post above, namely, labour time as a representation of value.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

  8. #38
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    12,437
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Currency by its very nature cannot have a fixed value because of its position as a univeral representation of the individual values of every commodity in existence. In other words, value in this sense does not make sense as it is a relation between two commodities and not an absolute, independent, thing.

    You are basically begging the question as to how this exchange value is determined, which What If...? came pretty close to solving in his post above, namely, labour time as a representation of value.
    I was actually aiming at "work" in the engineering sense.

    A kilowatt hour will run 10 100 watt light bulbs for one hour. Everywhere, all the time.

    I think they do measure labor in some disciplines this way.

    I think a loaf of bread could be "converted" to a number of kilowatt hours of energy, allowing for differences in commodity values without necessitating alteration of the basic dollars/kilowatt hours ratio.

    I understand that this model would undermine currency trading, etc in our current structure. And that much of capitalism is the buying, selling, renting of money/debt. But wouldn't the recent financial crisis have been smaller if currency was more "fixed"?
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

  9. #39
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Last Seen
    03-03-17 @ 10:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,813

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Currency by its very nature cannot have a fixed value because of its position as a univeral representation of the individual values of every commodity in existence. In other words, value in this sense does not make sense as it is a relation between two commodities and not an absolute, independent, thing.
    That just makes it a hard problem. Sometimes the best way to solve a hard problem is to solve a similar, simpler problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    You are basically begging the question as to how this exchange value is determined, which What If...? came pretty close to solving in his post above, namely, labour time as a representation of value.
    We trade something of value for a measure of that value. I trade my ability to solve other people's problems for currency, which is a measure, or store, of the value of my abilities to the people I work for. I think, so far, most people who have viewed this thread agree that maintaining currency at a constant value is a good thing. The easy question of "how" has a difficult answer. Or maybe no answer at all.

  10. #40
    Sage
    Khayembii Communique's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Milwaukee, WI
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,883

    Re: Should the US Currency be pinned to a Standard like Weights and Measures are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis
    That just makes it a hard problem. Sometimes the best way to solve a hard problem is to solve a similar, simpler problem.
    Squaring a circle is not a hard problem, it's impossible. Money doesn't have an absolute value, so it can't be "set".
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •