View Poll Results: Do you support plastic surgery for children to lessen the "look" of Down's Syndrome?

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  • Yes

    9 34.62%
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    12 46.15%
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Thread: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

  1. #31
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    What?? Oh, hell no! Plastic surgery on a child for purely comestic reasons, and not to repair a facial flaw like cleft palette that severely affects the child's health is absolutely horrible. Facial surgery is extremely painful, the recovery takes (I understand) many weeks. To inflict this on a child just to make them "prettier" is the epitome of parental betrayal and frankly is child abuse. The "coverage" it provides of the child's condition is purely superficial, since a Down's Syndrome child will always have learning disabilities to varying degrees, which anyone who spends a moment conversing with them will immediately perceive.

    This is not something that is being done for the good of the child. It's being done for the good of the parents. It should be illegal.

  2. #32
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad View Post
    I don't see how being so ashamed of the way your child looks that you force them to have cosmetic surgery sends the message of acceptance. In their parents eyes, their child is SO defined by their disability that they need to hide it by any means necessary, even at the risk of their lives.

    Perhaps more schools should have the sort of mentor program mine had. It's simple and probably saves the school money. And it teaches kids not to act like jerks towards people who are different.

    I know most schools don't have that. So obviously there isn't enough of it going around for you to say it's "not working."
    The treating disabled people like freaks thing comes from unfamiliarity with those people.
    Inside schools, most kids with disabilities become sort of like mascots, because the kids become familiar with them on a daily basis.

    It's the people in public, that you do not know where the majority of the problems come from.

    I do agree, that manners should be more widely taught, but if it isn't reinforced at home, it's for naught.
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    The treating disabled people like freaks thing comes from unfamiliarity with those people.
    Inside schools, most kids with disabilities become sort of like mascots, because the kids become familiar with them on a daily basis.

    It's the people in public, that you do not know where the majority of the problems come from.

    I do agree, that manners should be more widely taught, but if it isn't reinforced at home, it's for naught.
    I switched school districts at the end of elementary. The district I wound up in didn't have a program like my previous school did. And I did see more bullying. Obviously it makes some sort of a difference if kids really spend time around these people.

    DiAnna makes a good point as well. Trying to "fix" them physically doesn't change that their disability is noticable in other ways. Perhaps how they move, how they speak, etc. Most people pick up on this pretty quickly, even in passing. It doesn't even really work to "hide" the disability. It's purely symbolic. So even if it wasn't just a terrible thing to do to a child, it also probably doesn't work.

  4. #34
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad View Post
    I switched school districts at the end of elementary. The district I wound up in didn't have a program like my previous school did. And I did see more bullying. Obviously it makes some sort of a difference if kids really spend time around these people.

    DiAnna makes a good point as well. Trying to "fix" them physically doesn't change that their disability is noticable in other ways. Perhaps how they move, how they speak, etc. Most people pick up on this pretty quickly, even in passing. It doesn't even really work to "hide" the disability. It's purely symbolic. So even if it wasn't just a terrible thing to do to a child, it also probably doesn't work.
    While many clef pallets are only cosmetic in nature, they can prevent the guttural and nasty reactions of ignorant people.
    The same goes for many other bodily disfigurements and disabilities.

    I just don't think you can understand, until you experience it.
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  5. #35
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad View Post
    You're acting as though Downs kids are hideously deformed or something. They really aren't that weird-looking. They're identifiable as "not quite like normal people" but it's not like they have an arm growing out of their head.
    And I think that many people who didn't look quite like a "normal person" would be self-conscious about their appearance, and likely to be treated differently.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad
    You're failing to recognize educating people has worked. Does anyone here freak out when they see a Downs person? Does anyone here think they would bully a Downs kid? I'd be shocked if anyone here would react very differently at all to meeting someone with Downs. I bet most of you probably do now and then. And I bet it's absolutely nothing special.
    Are you talking about when we're adults or kids? If you're talking about kids, yes, kids do ostracize those with Downs syndrome. I remember in my school growing up, we had several kids who were mentally retarded. Some of them "looked" like it and others didn't (possibly due to a condition other than DS). The ones who looked like it were often excluded, whereas the ones who didn't had friends who were "normal." They may have been teased for being dumb, but for the most part they were treated more or less like anyone else.

    As for adults, no, they wouldn't "freak out" or "bully" someone who has Downs syndrome. But they would most definitely prejudge them and treat them differently.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad
    And I know we can teach this to kids pretty young, because I went to a school were we did that. And I know kids can be taught to leave disabled people alone, and they do more so than they leave each other alone, because that's how things were.
    But that's my point. They're being treated differently and isolated from their peers. Because of their appearance, you can automatically assume that they're disabled and that therefore it would be wrong for kids to treat them the way that they normally treat one another.

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad
    And I doubt a family that can afford to force cosmetic surgery on their kids for no valid reason is shy on resources.
    I don't know what their wealth has to do with anything. Unless they're billionaires, one family can't educate the world, but they can make their kid look "normal" if that's what they want.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 05-31-11 at 12:16 AM.
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  6. #36
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    What I meant by "leave them alone," which I think was the contingent upon which you based that, is that they didn't get bullied. They got bullied less than the "normal" kids did.

    But because we had time in school dedicated specifically with getting to know them, they really weren't that ostracized. People would play with them, and they got teased less than I did.

  7. #37
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I don't disagree with you necessarily, but I think an argument could be made that the parents just don't want their child pre-judged by her appearance.
    Absolutely, it'll be much better for the childs self esteem for people to approach them as a normal person, and then react with shock and pity when they find out that they have Down Syndrome.
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  8. #38
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Absolutely, it'll be much better for the childs self esteem for people to approach them as a normal person, and then react with shock and pity when they find out that they have Down Syndrome.
    Hardly think so. If Down kids talked and looked like everyone else, then they would be like small kids. Cosmetic surgery can't make them less strange and they will still talk funny, but they will be considered cute and adorable. That will make more people approach them and they will be treated better.

    You may think it is shallow, but our society judges people by looks. I understand the parents decision.

  9. #39
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    The tongue correction with DS could correct speech problems.
    My god daughter has Downs Syndrome. There are a few physical indications of it with regards to her face (eyes, nose, forehead) that look slightly off. However, the main thing is her tongue.

    She's actually very smart for someone with Downs, and has the capacity to fall within the normal range of IQ for a healthy person. However, even now with her getting into her early elementary school years, her biggest issue is communication. She gets very angry and has social issues because she can't communicate clearly what she's thinking and thus she lashes out. Its much the same way and reason that many babies/toddlers will get angry because they know what they want but can't fully express it and it frustrates them.

    I wouldn't begrudge her parents if they wanted to get her cosmetic plastic surgery for her face. While I don't think its necessary, I can't fault a parent for doing something honestly due to the feeling it'll give their daughter a better and less troubled life. However, I wouldn't personally suggest it or support it. However, when it comes to the tongue, I would absolutely support action taken with that. I think that if it would allow her to communicate better it would be a godsend, allowing her to interact socially far better and to learn far better as well.

  10. #40
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    Re: Plastic Surgery for Children With Down's Syndrome.

    I would consider a severe speech problem a medical problem. Speech is a major component of functioning as a human being. If speech therapy has failed to give her an acceptable level of speech competence, then considering surgery to correct that is somewhat different than considering it to make her "prettier." Especially considering her high IQ, which probably means she has a lot of drive to communicate. This is, after all, how kids learn.

    But another aspect may be speech delay, or a gap in understanding speech vs. knowing how to communicate it, both of which can also be issues with Downs. I don't claim to know whether her main problem is speech impediment, delay, or understanding, but if it's the latter 2, surgery won't help, and becomes cosmetic once again.

    I just think that considering what will actually and truthfully help the child is the most important thing to consider. There's no evidence cosmetic surgery does. I had a bit of a read about this - apparently it's happened before, and independent raters didn't seem to notice much difference - indicating the ability to pick out "differences" is not deterred by plastic surgery. And how would it be? Differences in stature, movement, head shape, etc are all still there. There's no evidence it actually improves the child's quality of life.

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