View Poll Results: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

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  • Okay as it is/make only minor changes

    7 25.00%
  • Take away all government financial incentives

    1 3.57%
  • Make some specific changes only

    0 0%
  • Take government out of marriage completely

    13 46.43%
  • Other

    7 25.00%
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Thread: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

  1. #21
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by MistressNomad View Post
    Are you aware that divorce often improves the child's life? It was certainly the case with me. Even when there is no explicit "abuse" going on, living in a home where your parents obviously don't like each other sucks. Kids aren't stupid. They can tell.

    You can have whatever your personal morality to the sanctity of marriage is, but enforcing it on others to the detriment of their own lives is pretty selfish and short-sighted.
    This has nothing to do with sanctity, there is no sanctity in marriage. If you make marriage harder to get into and harder to get out of, more people are going to stop and think about the issue seriously before they get married, thus reducing the number of divorces and bad marriages to begin with. The reason there are so many bad marriages is because anyone with $50 in their hand can go get a license and get married tomorrow and get divorced the day after.
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  2. #22
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    A marriage is a contract entered into by two adults. Why would the government have to be involved at all?
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    A marriage is a contract entered into by two adults. Why would the government have to be involved at all?
    Arbitration in court

  4. #24
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Eliminate all government goodies you get from being married and get the state out of marriage entirely because its not the business of the state nor the business of scumbag busy bodies what two consenting adults do with each other.
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  5. #25
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    A marriage is a contract entered into by two adults. Why would the government have to be involved at all?
    Government is involved in *ALL* contracts, how do you think contract arbitration and enforcement is done?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Arbitration in court
    Which is different from arbitration whenever there is a contract dispute of any kind?

    Does the government have to approve of a contract to buy or sell, or to provide service for remuneration?
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Which is different from arbitration whenever there is a contract dispute of any kind?

    Does the government have to approve of a contract to buy or sell, or to provide service for remuneration?
    The question was what should the gov's involvement be. thats my answer

  8. #28
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    In a perfect world, no government involvement would be ideal.

    Unfortunately this just isn't practical. There are divorces, taking place in government courts, along with estate disputes about who gets what because X was married to Y and then Z and has children by both, etc.

    The State has a vested intrest in promoting family, as it is one of the fundamental building blocks of civilization. Without structures to support and raise and civilize children, the next generation will grow up to be a pack of barbarians and civilization will collapse. Therefore some kind of incentives to build families is in the State's intrest. This has been the case for millenia.

    The details, of course, are up for grabs...

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  9. #29
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    In a perfect world, no government involvement would be ideal.

    Unfortunately this just isn't practical. There are divorces, taking place in government courts, along with estate disputes about who gets what because X was married to Y and then Z and has children by both, etc.

    The State has a vested intrest in promoting family, as it is one of the fundamental building blocks of civilization. Without structures to support and raise and civilize children, the next generation will grow up to be a pack of barbarians and civilization will collapse. Therefore some kind of incentives to build families is in the State's intrest. This has been the case for millenia.

    The details, of course, are up for grabs...
    The state is not doing a very good job of promoting family one of the fundamental building blocks of civilization. 41% of babies are born to unwed mothers.

    That statistic is, of course the root of many of our societal ills, no question. How, though, does the state being involved in marriage contracts help promote family?

    Without structures to support and raise and civilize children, the next generation will grow up to be a pack of barbarians
    Absolutely true. So, it would seem that the next generation is, in fact, growing up to be a pack of barbarians, or at least a large percentage of them are.
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  10. #30
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    Re: What should be the government's involvement in marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    The state is not doing a very good job of promoting family one of the fundamental building blocks of civilization. 41% of babies are born to unwed mothers.

    That statistic is, of course the root of many of our societal ills, no question. How, though, does the state being involved in marriage contracts help promote family?
    To answer your last question first, by guaranteeing property rights and inheritances, and by tax incentives.

    To answer why 41% are born outside wedlock, the single biggest reason is that a woman gets more Welfare/foodstamps/etc if she has lots of kids and no husband. At least, no husband-of-record.

    The second biggest reason is that forty years of applying "critical thinking" to all the traditional institutions that formed the building blocks of our society have resulted in a loss of respect for all those institutions, including the institution of marriage and family. Granted, some of those institutions (like seperate but equal) were bad and needed to be destroyed, but we've thrown the baby out with the bath water.

    Once upon a time, divorce and pre-marital pregnancy were heavily stigmatized and most children were born IN wedlock. How far we've come, eh?





    Absolutely true. So, it would seem that the next generation is, in fact, growing up to be a pack of barbarians, or at least a large percentage of them are.
    Absolutely. Erosion of the family unit, erosion of traditional values, erosion of parental authority, erosion of the moral authority of the values our society once held to.
    Last edited by Goshin; 05-30-11 at 11:10 PM.

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