View Poll Results: Same-sex marriage is wrong because

Voters
113. You may not vote on this poll
  • It isn't, and should be available to all gay couples

    77 68.14%
  • Being gay is wrong, so they can't get married

    16 14.16%
  • The sanctity of marriage. No, I wasn't laughing. I was coughing. *cough* ... see?

    4 3.54%
  • It will set a bad example for Christian youth

    0 0%
  • I don't honestly have a good reason, but I still say no

    1 0.88%
  • Other (please explain)

    15 13.27%
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Thread: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

  1. #251
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Alright, I'm gonna put my serious hat on and say this:

    I think X has a point. When marriage is available to everyone and any two individuals who want to get together purely for the financial benefits, then yes, at that point the value of marriage would become significantly degraded.
    I assume when you say "value" you're talking about the value of commitment between two people that marriage traditionally represents, but why should this value be preserved by the government? Why does it matter if marriage is just a legal contract? Shouldn't that "value" be reserved for religious ceremonies where that commitment is the sole purpose of marriage?

  2. #252
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The only way to effectively cut back on marriage being done for benefits alone though is to instill the belief within the culture that marriage should be for love. The government cannot legally determine that same sex couples are more likely to be in it for the benefits than opposite sex couples, not without getting into how to legally define "love".
    100% agree.

    Edit:

    My basic outline for how love should defined

    If a girl loves her man she will be 100% willing to do two things: make him a sandwich, and get down on her knees and suck his dick.

    If a man truly loves his girl, he will be man enough to go down on her

    Last edited by StillBallin75; 05-30-11 at 02:19 PM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  3. #253
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    I raised the following questions in another thread topic.

    I'm simply trying to understand all of the horrible detrimental fallouts, social backlashes, drops in moral standards in non-homosexual homes or anyplace where the socialization process exists, which will result because of gay marriage in our nation (or elsewhere).

    Gay marriage: Negative social impacts on the U.S. Society?

    Is there a genuine list of negative impacts on the overall fabric of our nations diverse cultures along with its common values, traditions, etc...

    As I asked before...

    Since homosexuality has been out of the social closet for about mega bunches of years, how many heteros have come forward to tell their horrid stories of becoming homosexual because of being expose to information about homosexuality?

    How many kids that have been raped by priest and ministers, who would by all knowledge, considered themselves to hetero...and turned homo because of being raped?

    How many heterosexuals have made the claim that they turn homosexual from hearing about kids who have been raped by the clergy?

    There are almost endless question, but I don't see any genuine answers any where in DP.

    Surely something is going to take our nation straight to hell as a result of homosexual and gay marriage. But what is it...or they?

    Nothing I've read so far indicates anything sincerely damaging aspects of homosexuality or gay marriage that has lasting effects on our social fabric.

  4. #254
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    I assume when you say "value" you're talking about the value of commitment between two people that marriage traditionally represents, but why should this value be preserved by the government? Why does it matter if marriage is just a legal contract? Shouldn't that "value" be reserved for religious ceremonies where that commitment is the sole purpose of marriage?
    All very good questions.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  5. #255
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The only way to effectively cut back on marriage being done for benefits alone though is to instill the belief within the culture that marriage should be for love. The government cannot legally determine that same sex couples are more likely to be in it for the benefits than opposite sex couples, not without getting into how to legally define "love".
    Exactly, which is why getting into the discussion about "the value of marriage" is like a black hole because by making that a factor in the SSM discussion, you give government the entirely new power and responsibility of determining "love" and "value" that it should not have and cannot handle.

  6. #256
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Interesting, I thought a hetero marriage that wasn't consummated could be annulled. So, if that's the case, you're imposing something on opposite married folks (to fulfill the contract) that wouldn't be imposed on same sex couples.
    Depends. There has to be a physical and incurable inpotence at time of marriage and the other spouse couldn't have known about it.

    Annulment Laws > Procedures > Nullification of Marriage

    I don't see why the same exact annulment process wouldn't apply equally to same sex couples and opposite sex couples.
    Last edited by roguenuke; 05-30-11 at 02:22 PM.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  7. #257
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    And they can already just as easily adopt children by moving to another state instead of bothering with marriage.

    Most pedos are not going to bother to get married just to get children to molest, especially since, they would have to actually deal with the children and be responsible for them, not just molest them and leave. I highly doubt that most pedos would prefer to adopt their victims rather than just find them, molest them, and not have the responsibility of raising them.

    Wanna show some evidence that this should be a major concern that couldn't be dealt with by just thorough background checks for anyone trying to adopt children, no matter their sexuality or marital status?
    As I said, I hadn't considered these possibilities before, so I'm just putting them out there. You're the one that's saying "Naw, that could never happen because no pedo ever would think of it."

    To be clear I'm also not arguing that the risks of something like that occurring are enough of a reason to oppose SSM.


    Family is a part of most marriages. There is a small percentage of couples who marry with the belief that it is just for benefits, since most people don't want to be bothered with the hassle of divorce procedures when/if they meet someone that they would prefer to be actually in a married relationship with.
    Why would someone leave a financially beneficial marriage in order to marry someone else for love? You're the one who's ok with taking family out of marriage, right? If marriage is not to be anything other than a consideration of financial benefit, why would anyone desire to be married for any other reason.

    The best way to limit abuse of marriage for benefits alone is to keep the number of marriages limited or the number of marriage partners limited. I am not completely against polygamy, but this is a valid concern for that particular issue, since the majority of people prefer monogamy but could also see the benefit of not having to choose between love or benefits.
    Why do you call marrying for benefits "abuse"? I'm genuinely confused. I thought you didn't believe marriage really meant much more than a legal contract anyway?
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mahatma Gandhi


  8. #258
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Exactly, which is why getting into the discussion about "the value of marriage" is like a black hole because by making that a factor in the SSM discussion, you give government the entirely new power and responsibility of determining "love" and "value" that it should not have and cannot handle.
    So, in order to support gay marriage, you have to cast aside all notions on the value and meaning of marriage? I just don't think I can do that (and no I'm not saying my opinion means all that much).
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
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  9. #259
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Depends. There has to be a physical and incurable inpotence at time of marriage and the other spouse couldn't have known about it.

    Annulment Laws > Procedures > Nullification of Marriage

    I don't see why the same exact annulment process wouldn't apply equally to same sex couples and opposite sex couples.
    Well, I guess it would depend on what the legal definition of "sexual intercourse" is.
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mahatma Gandhi


  10. #260
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    As I said, I hadn't considered these possibilities before, so I'm just putting them out there. You're the one that's saying "Naw, that could never happen because no pedo ever would think of it."
    Where did I say that it wouldn't happen? I have never said anything like that. I said that it wasn't likely. There is a difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Why would someone leave a financially beneficial marriage in order to marry someone else for love?
    Most marriages for benefits deal with benefits due to the marriage (that I know of anyway), such as marrying to get married BAH or base housing or educational benefits for spouse or medical benefits, plus others. These are things that can be gotten for many different marriages and are not limited to a specific person, but rather what job a person has.

    Plus, there are a lot of young people who want to put off marriage for love til they are older but decide they will settle for a mutually beneficial marriage until love comes along or they are ready for that type of commitment.

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You're the one who's ok with taking family out of marriage, right? If marriage is not to be anything other than a consideration of financial benefit, why would anyone desire to be married for any other reason.
    No, I don't think it is any of my business if others want to take family out of marriage because it doesn't affect my marriage or what I am going to teach my children about marriage. I am not going to judge others on their love or lack of, it isn't my place. What is love to me, may not be love to another person.

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Why do you call marrying for benefits "abuse"? I'm genuinely confused. I thought you didn't believe marriage really meant much more than a legal contract anyway?
    That is how others call it. It is actually how the military refers to a marriage that they can prove is for benefits.

    You are twisting my argument. You need to stop. I have said several times that it can be just for benefits to some, but that my marriage is not and I don't believe that most people's marriages are.

    Legal marriage is usually tied to a personal marriage. Legal marriage is just a contract. Personal marriage is the actual love and commitment part. The government has no business deciding who is and isn't in love, so the government needs to view marriage as a contract, to avoid doing so.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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