View Poll Results: Same-sex marriage is wrong because

Voters
113. You may not vote on this poll
  • It isn't, and should be available to all gay couples

    77 68.14%
  • Being gay is wrong, so they can't get married

    16 14.16%
  • The sanctity of marriage. No, I wasn't laughing. I was coughing. *cough* ... see?

    4 3.54%
  • It will set a bad example for Christian youth

    0 0%
  • I don't honestly have a good reason, but I still say no

    1 0.88%
  • Other (please explain)

    15 13.27%
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Thread: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

  1. #1491
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    Anyhow, I think the over abundance of emoticons and ego are using up too much bandwidth here. Besides, no sources have been presented which disproves a single point that I made, nor were specific points properly addressed. ah well..it's a sunny day where I'm at so I guess I'm off to enjoy it. btw, laws concerning whether spouses are required to testify against each other also vary by state.
    LMAO
    More deflection, now you are seriously desperate and the facts still remain, thanks

    "btw, laws concerning whether spouses are required to testify against each other also vary by state."

    And? whats that mean? NOTHING lol Its still a benefit power of attorney cant provide.

    Let me know when you can disprove the legal facts I listed.
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  2. #1492
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    I noticed no facts. Please stop trying to derail this thread. Thanks in advance.
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

  3. #1493
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    I noticed no facts. Please stop trying to derail this thread. Thanks in advance.
    Im already aware that YOU noticed no facts as you keep proving this, but the facts dont need you to notice them neither does the law LMAO

    No derailment here at all, nothing has changed from the original rail I have been on. Im still asking you to disprove the listed legal facts and you keep dodging or offering hypotheticals.

    Again let me know when you can cause Ill gladly discuss them and prove them wrong even though none exist, I don't even understand why you would try to argue against these facts.

    Its like arguing that 2+2=4 isnt actually true if you think about it hypothetically.

    All Im asking is for you to back up your statements with facts, not semantics or hypotheticalls, thats not a derail, its called HONEST debate
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  4. #1494
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    I noticed no facts. Please stop trying to derail this thread. Thanks in advance.
    Nor will there be any facts. Thanks for drawing this back to the actual point of this thread. Those who want to play with the word "wrong" to manipulate this thread...are those very folks who won't offering any type of sources to support their arguments other than biblical references. Empirical arguments are minimal because "as you've so kindly pointed out"...there's really not many.

    Thanks evanescence...

  5. #1495
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Legal Facts 101
    in reality
    "Legal marriage and religious marriage are totally separate"
    "Religion has nothing to do with legal marriage."
    "Legal marriage has nothing to do with Religious marriage"
    "God and RELIGIOUS marriage are connected, God is MEANINGLESS to LEGAL marriage."
    This space is currently owned by The Great Winchester, stay tuned for future messages!
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  6. #1496
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    Besides, no sources have been presented which disproves a single point that I made, nor were specific points properly addressed. ah well..it's a sunny day where I'm at so I guess I'm off to enjoy it. btw, laws concerning whether spouses are required to testify against each other also vary by state.
    Here are some sources to back the point that there is no way that the military is going to accept various legal POAs and/or other legal contracts to determine who is legally married and who is just trying to get certain bennies that come from being a spouse, including the base access.

    Military Marriage Benefits - Ask.com

    For all those who are unfamiliar with the military, a person's spouse affects the person's security clearance and has to be checked out by the US government for security purposes. A person's spouse gets unescorted access to bases. This is an accepted security risk because there are things on base that the spouse needs access to, including the commissary, exchange, medical, dental, gym, childcare, command legal, command personnel dept. to take care of paperwork, college office, and even at times, their spouse's ship or building. This means that the military needs to ensure that a person's spouse is not going to be a security risk. That is why a person who claims they are married in the military must provide the marriage license to prove that so that their spouse can be checked out. In fact, many commands request that anyone planning on getting married, actually request to get married as a formality so that the command can get a security check going on the spouse-to-be early.

    How do you suggest the military determine which relationships are worthy allowing certain privileges and which aren't? And who will pay for the extra security checks involved if we just say that anyone that a servicemember indicates should have access would get those privileges even if neither of them are willing to take on the extra responsibilities of actually being in a relationship that is close to legal marriage? How do we determine if a relationship is worth allowing a servicemember to get the privilege of living off base or not? And, no, we cannot afford to have all servicemembers living off base. Married servicemembers get the privilege because the military understands that these servicemembers have taken on the responsibility of at the very least, another person, their spouse. And the military holds people to that agreement.

    Marriage also comes with some risks being taken, that wouldn't normally be taken in every relationship, on the part of the individuals involved that set up the relationship in a manner where they are agreeing that all money and assets gained during the relationship are considered joint assets. This is so that a person doesn't get screwed over by being a stay at home spouse while the other earns money and the one earning the money decides to leave and claim the money as all theirs because they earned it eventhough the other spouse was taking care of the domestic responsibilities for both of them and possibly their children.

    And spousal privilege is available in all states in one form or another. There are some exceptions to what can be forced, generally dealing with spousal abuse, but it still exists in every state and is only given with legal marriage (as recognized by the state) and some states with same sex partnerships where legal marriage is not allowed for them but such legal partnerships are. All spousal privilege laws are based on the state recognizing that certain relationships deserve protection because of the nature of the relationship and the trust level that each person is willing to legally state they have in the other person.

    https://www.judicialview.com/Law-Art...vilege/22/6020
    Note: I don't agree with the proposal of this article but it does provide some info on spousal privileges.

    The best and simplest way to ensure that we have of ensuring that people have their rights afforded them in relation to the amount of legal responsibility that they are willing to take on when it comes to another adult is a single legal document that sets up that relationship in that manner, i.e. the marriage license. For those who are unwilling to take on such responsibilities, they need to understand that the reason for certain privileges afforded to those in a legal marriage is because of the level of responsibility within that relationship.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  7. #1497
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Here are some sources to back the point that there is no way that the military is going to accept various legal POAs and/or other legal contracts to determine who is legally married and who is just trying to get certain bennies that come from being a spouse, including the base access.

    Military Marriage Benefits - Ask.com

    For all those who are unfamiliar with the military, a person's spouse affects the person's security clearance and has to be checked out by the US government for security purposes. A person's spouse gets unescorted access to bases. This is an accepted security risk because there are things on base that the spouse needs access to, including the commissary, exchange, medical, dental, gym, childcare, command legal, command personnel dept. to take care of paperwork, college office, and even at times, their spouse's ship or building. This means that the military needs to ensure that a person's spouse is not going to be a security risk. That is why a person who claims they are married in the military must provide the marriage license to prove that so that their spouse can be checked out. In fact, many commands request that anyone planning on getting married, actually request to get married as a formality so that the command can get a security check going on the spouse-to-be early.

    How do you suggest the military determine which relationships are worthy allowing certain privileges and which aren't? And who will pay for the extra security checks involved if we just say that anyone that a servicemember indicates should have access would get those privileges even if neither of them are willing to take on the extra responsibilities of actually being in a relationship that is close to legal marriage? How do we determine if a relationship is worth allowing a servicemember to get the privilege of living off base or not? And, no, we cannot afford to have all servicemembers living off base. Married servicemembers get the privilege because the military understands that these servicemembers have taken on the responsibility of at the very least, another person, their spouse. And the military holds people to that agreement.

    Marriage also comes with some risks being taken, that wouldn't normally be taken in every relationship, on the part of the individuals involved that set up the relationship in a manner where they are agreeing that all money and assets gained during the relationship are considered joint assets. This is so that a person doesn't get screwed over by being a stay at home spouse while the other earns money and the one earning the money decides to leave and claim the money as all theirs because they earned it eventhough the other spouse was taking care of the domestic responsibilities for both of them and possibly their children.

    And spousal privilege is available in all states in one form or another. There are some exceptions to what can be forced, generally dealing with spousal abuse, but it still exists in every state and is only given with legal marriage (as recognized by the state) and some states with same sex partnerships where legal marriage is not allowed for them but such legal partnerships are. All spousal privilege laws are based on the state recognizing that certain relationships deserve protection because of the nature of the relationship and the trust level that each person is willing to legally state they have in the other person.

    https://www.judicialview.com/Law-Art...vilege/22/6020
    Note: I don't agree with the proposal of this article but it does provide some info on spousal privileges.

    The best and simplest way to ensure that we have of ensuring that people have their rights afforded them in relation to the amount of legal responsibility that they are willing to take on when it comes to another adult is a single legal document that sets up that relationship in that manner, i.e. the marriage license. For those who are unwilling to take on such responsibilities, they need to understand that the reason for certain privileges afforded to those in a legal marriage is because of the level of responsibility within that relationship.
    Thank you for that, roguenuke. Your last point was very convincing.

    The divorce rate has steadily increased since decades past, and such a serious contract between two people can be swiftly dissolved. People seem to change partners like they change their underwear, and the ideals of marriage has become a lie. To further complicate things, many of the same people who have either served divorce papers to their spouses, or support people's right to a divorce want to prevent gays from marrying. I find the entire institution to be a sham. It would be nice is the government weren't involved, though.
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

  8. #1498
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    It would be nice is the government weren't involved, though.
    I kinda think the judicial branch will have to do something to "make it so" ... but it will more likely be legislative.

  9. #1499
    Educator DemonMyst's Avatar
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    Legal Facts 101
    in reality
    "Legal marriage and religious marriage are totally separate"
    "Religion has nothing to do with legal marriage."
    "Legal marriage has nothing to do with Religious marriage"
    "God and RELIGIOUS marriage are connected, God is MEANINGLESS to LEGAL marriage."
    That is not entirely accurate.. The marraige you get from a JOP is the same as you get in a church.. All the same paperwork is filled out.. Instead of being signed by a judge it is signed by a priest or minister.. But the end result is you are married.. And you will have to go through the same process to get unmarried reguardless of how you got married..

  10. #1500
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    Re: SSM (Same-sex marriage) is wrong because?

    Quote Originally Posted by DemonMyst View Post
    That is not entirely accurate.. The marraige you get from a JOP is the same as you get in a church.. All the same paperwork is filled out.. Instead of being signed by a judge it is signed by a priest or minister.. But the end result is you are married.. And you will have to go through the same process to get unmarried reguardless of how you got married..
    Yes, but the reason that the legal marriage is the same is because the state decided that it is much easier to allow clergy and other people who will perform the ceremony to sign the marriage license, rather than forcing all those couples who choose to have their ceremony done by someone other than the JotP to have to say their "I do"'s twice. It isn't because the ceremonies are the same or that a person has to have a religion to even get married or that religion is involved in anyone's marriage.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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