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Is there such a thing as "bad experience"?

CriticalThought

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I love this story...

[FONT=&quot]"A promising young executive at IBM was involved in a risky venture that lost $10 million for the company. When Tom Watson Sr., the founder and CEO of IBM, called the executive to his office, the executive tendered his resignation. Watson is reported to have said, "You can't be serious. We've just spent $10 million dollars educating you!"

[/FONT]
Which raises the philosophical question of the thread...is it not good to make mistakes as long as you acknowledge them and learn from them?

And if people refuse to acknowledge mistakes or misdeeds can they ever truly learn from them?
 
I love this story...

[FONT="]"A promising young executive at IBM was involved in a risky venture that lost $10 million for the company. When Tom Watson Sr., the founder and CEO of IBM, called the executive to his office, the executive tendered his resignation. Watson is reported to have said, "You can't be serious. We've just spent $10 million dollars educating you!"

[/FONT]
Which raises the philosophical question of the thread...is it not good to make mistakes as long as you acknowledge them and learn from them?

And if people refuse to acknowledge mistakes or misdeeds can they ever truly learn from them?

It depends... if the misdeeds were from others directed at you. There are some things that are so horrendous it can not be ever classified as 'a learning experience'.
 
There are people everywhere that have experienced travesties, losses, and permanent scars where life will never go back to normal for them for the rest of their lives. Many people have happy lives and then lose it all, and they never get back their happiness. Once you cross that river, sometimes you can never go back to the happy side.

So I think the OP is a bit flippant if you think that there's good to be found in every tragedy. Sometimes problems can never be fixed. Sometimes losses can't be regained.
 
It depends... if the misdeeds were from others directed at you. There are some things that are so horrendous it can not be ever classified as 'a learning experience'.

That reminds me of a Star Trek episode where they cured a serial killer of his psychopathology. He learned from his terrible misdeeds but the damage had been done.
 
There are people everywhere that have experienced travesties, losses, and permanent scars where life will never go back to normal for them for the rest of their lives. Many people have happy lives and then lose it all, and they never get back their happiness. Once you cross that river, sometimes you can never go back to the happy side.

So I think the OP is a bit flippant if you think that there's good to be found in every tragedy. Sometimes problems can never be fixed. Sometimes losses can't be regained.

That seems odd to me. There are quadriplegic people who have found happiness in their lives. Humans adapt. It is what we do best. Tragedy happens and we grieve and learn to cope from the loss and possibly become better people from it. In fact, the best people tend to be those who have known suffering and sacrifice because they have grown from it and become stronger and more compassionate from the experience.
 
That reminds me of a Star Trek episode where they cured a serial killer of his psychopathology. He learned from his terrible misdeeds but the damage had been done.

And that is a 'pie in the sky' cure. somethings there is no cure for. There are people out there that can be classified as evil. .. and there are different levels of that evil. I know someone who was a victim of such evil that even Henrin would get disgusted.
 
And that is a 'pie in the sky' cure. somethings there is no cure for. There are people out there that can be classified as evil. .. and there are different levels of that evil. I know someone who was a victim of such evil that even Henrin would get disgusted.

Well the cure didn't do the character much good. As I recall they still executed him.

But yes, there are people who commit truly evil deeds. But isn't what separates the evil doer from the evil being the fact that the former can acknowledge their wrong doing and fix it whereas the latter cannot?
 
In fact, the best people tend to be those who have known suffering and sacrifice because they have grown from it and become stronger and more compassionate from the experience.
I've found the same to be true. But being stronger and compassionate doesn't make one any less miserable.
 
It actually depends on whether the experience gained is greater than the damage caused by the experience.
 
I love this story...

[FONT="]"A promising young executive at IBM was involved in a risky venture that lost $10 million for the company. When Tom Watson Sr., the founder and CEO of IBM, called the executive to his office, the executive tendered his resignation. Watson is reported to have said, "You can't be serious. We've just spent $10 million dollars educating you!"

[/FONT]
Which raises the philosophical question of the thread...is it not good to make mistakes as long as you acknowledge them and learn from them?

And if people refuse to acknowledge mistakes or misdeeds can they ever truly learn from them?

Misdeeds are not the same as bad experiences, but I get your point.
 
I've found the same to be true. But being stronger and compassionate doesn't make one any less miserable.

I think it would be a mistake to equate life experiences directly to happiness. Viktor Frankl managed to find moments of happiness even while experiencing the day to day horrors and suffering of the Holocaust.
 
It actually depends on whether the experience gained is greater than the damage caused by the experience.

That is some strange calculas but possibly valid. I have to test that out in my mind for a bit to see if I can find exceptions.
 
That is some strange calculas but possibly valid. I have to test that out in my mind for a bit to see if I can find exceptions.

Think of it this way...you may learn a valuable lesson by sticking your arm in the mouth of a Great White Shark, but was it worth the loss of the arm? ;)
 
Think of it this way...you may learn a valuable lesson by sticking your arm in the mouth of a Great White Shark, but was it worth the loss of the arm? ;)

Ah, but here is where it gets complicated. Not having the arm may give me new perspective, open me up to new experiences I might not have had, and expose me to people I may not have otherwise ever met. Mistakes can change the entire course of your life because of the opportunity cost factor. Losing the arm may have also have been the only way to keep it from biting off my head but that is more along the lines of your math.
 
Viktor Frankl managed to find moments of happiness even while experiencing the day to day horrors and suffering of the Holocaust.
I'm sure that even a death row inmate can have a small moment of happiness upon getting a letter from his mother.

But your question was "Is there such a thing as a "Bad Experience"?

I can tell you personally that there can be terror and misery and despair and regret and pure unadulterated sadness where nothing good came from ANY of it. So yeah, there can be a "Bad Experience."
 
Well the cure didn't do the character much good. As I recall they still executed him.

But yes, there are people who commit truly evil deeds. But isn't what separates the evil doer from the evil being the fact that the former can acknowledge their wrong doing and fix it whereas the latter cannot?

No. There are those who know it is wrong, but delight in it. And, when it comes to the experience the victim had, like you said, the damage is done.
 
Mistakes are great experience, IF you learn from them. Not everyone does.
 
I love this story...

[FONT="]"A promising young executive at IBM was involved in a risky venture that lost $10 million for the company. When Tom Watson Sr., the founder and CEO of IBM, called the executive to his office, the executive tendered his resignation. Watson is reported to have said, "You can't be serious. We've just spent $10 million dollars educating you!"

[/FONT]
Which raises the philosophical question of the thread...is it not good to make mistakes as long as you acknowledge them and learn from them?

And if people refuse to acknowledge mistakes or misdeeds can they ever truly learn from them?

How would you feel if I made the mistake of driving after having too many drinks and then proceeded to crash my car into your living room, killing most of your family? Would it make you feel better to know that I learned from that mistake? Would my mistake be good because I learned a valuable lesson about drinking?

CaptainAdverse is right that it depends on whether the experience gained is greater than the damage caused. It's unlikely there is any amount of lessons I could have learned that were worth the lives of your spouse and children.

There are mistakes that can cost lives. There are mistakes that can ruin your career or your marriage. There are mistakes that can land you in prison for life or that can leave others permanently crippled. Yes, you can probably learn from all of those mistakes; but not all of those lessons are worth the cost.
 
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Ah, but here is where it gets complicated. Not having the arm may give me new perspective, open me up to new experiences I might not have had, and expose me to people I may not have otherwise ever met.

Or it might do the opposite. You might never meet great people you otherwise would have. Your life might be much worse than it otherwise would have been. You're conflating "the loss of an arm" with positive consequences that losing an arm doesn't necessarily entail.

Besides, I don't think you're being honest with yourself here. If I told you to go get a wood saw and cut off your arm, you won't do it. Because - whether you consciously acknowledge it or not - you know very well that's an experience that's not worth having.
 
Or it might do the opposite. You might never meet great people you otherwise would have. Your life might be much worse than it otherwise would have been. You're conflating "the loss of an arm" with positive consequences that losing an arm doesn't necessarily entail.

Besides, I don't think you're being honest with yourself here. If I told you to go get a wood saw and cut off your arm, you won't do it. Because - whether you consciously acknowledge it or not - you know very well that's an experience that's not worth having.

True, but from a Buddhist perspective what would bring me suffering is not the actual arm but the emotional attachment I have to it. Albeit, the pain of cutting off my own arm would not be a walk in the park. Perhaps experience is purely existential and its value is whatever meaning I ascribe to it. I doubt most people, if given the choice, would change what has happened to them in the past, good or bad, because it has made them who they are today.
 
True, but from a Buddhist perspective what would bring me suffering is not the actual arm but the emotional attachment I have to it. Albeit, the pain of cutting off my own arm would not be a walk in the park. Perhaps experience is purely existential and its value is whatever meaning I ascribe to it. I doubt most people, if given the choice, would change what has happened to them in the past, good or bad, because it has made them who they are today.

I would change a lot of things. Nothing is meant to be. It's largely random.

The loss of an arm is not a blessing in disguise. What I would miss most is the physical use of that arm, not any supposed emotional attachment to it. I may or may not adapt to it. Not every life story has a happy ending.
 
On the mortal level, there's no such thing as a bad experience as long as you can recover from it and integrate it. Unfortunately some people experience traumas that undo them in deep and permanent ways. It's not something that society likes to hear about, nor is it a comment on weakness vs. strength. Some people spontaneously recover from horrific experiences and transmute it into an integrated understanding, while others just unravel and are lost forever. There's no way to predict it.

On the soul level (if you believe in it), all experience is integrated into the process of perfection. I believe that life is setup with a mix of mandatory learning interwoven with free will as to how we carry it out, in order to accomplish certain lessons in this lifetime. Temporal experiences, even hard ones, are ultimately less important than the greater contributions such experiences add to the progression of the soul. I acknowledge that these are subjective beliefs so please don't ask me to prove why I believe what I do. But in this sense, there is no such thing as a bad experience, only learning.
 
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