Atheist Self Identification

Frank Apisa said:

Sorry you are not intelligent enough to understand the argument,

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Then why don't you draw me a picture like a Venn Diagram to help me understand? That's exactly what they are used for. Or are you afraid that if you try it's going to prove you wrong?

MrWonka said:

Then why don't you draw me a picture like a Venn Diagram to help me understand? That's exactly what they are used for. Or are you afraid that if you try it's going to prove you wrong?

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Aha...okay.

So all I will ask, since you suggest that doing that is "fundamental to all philosophical arguments"...

...is for you to show me that it, in fact, IS fundamental to ALL philosophical arguments.

But being a reasonable guy myself, MrWonka, I will not ask your to show that it applies to ALL. of those arguments...or not even to a majority of them.

We've had thousands upon thousands of philosophical arguments right here in DP over the years...and I won't even ask you to furnish proof that more than half of those involved Venn diagrams.

Hell no...because I am, as I said, a reasonable guy.

So...just show me two, three dozen examples where they were used over the years.

I'm not going to ask for thousands...just two or three dozen...so I can be sure you are not just blowing smoke when you suggest that such a thing is FUNDAMENTAL to ALL philosophical arguments.

I await your examples...which you should find in the hundreds. Just pick out the few dozens you think to be especially good as examples.

Frank Apisa said:

I won't even ask you to furnish proof that more than half of those involved Venn diagrams.

Hell no...because I am, as I said, a reasonable guy.

So...just show me two, three dozen examples where they were used over the years.

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Venn Diagrams are only necessary when people like yourself struggle to understand English sentences put before them and need pictures to help. I would not expect Venn Diagrams to be necessary all that often on here. However if you've taken some rudimentary classes in philosophy and formal logic you would have been taught how to draw them.

MrWonka said:

Venn Diagrams are only necessary when people like yourself struggle to understand English sentences put before them and need pictures to help.

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My understanding of the English language has allowed me to be published in some of the top media of the United States and Great Britain. For you to suggest I need help in that area is as absurd as your denial of the fact that the two statements are NOT identical...and are actually VERY different.

I would not expect Venn Diagrams to be necessary all that often on here.

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Then why on Earth would you suggest, "...they are FUNDAMENTAL to ALL philosophical arguments?"

However if you've taken some rudimentary classes in philosophy and formal logic you would have been taught how to draw them.

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I had majors in both in Economics and philosophy, MrWonka. I have taken 300 level courses in logic.

If you want to draw Venn diagrams...draw them. But do not instruct me to draw them just because you are unable to understand an argument that a grammar school kid should be able to understand by now.

How long are you guys going to kick poor ole Frank around?

It is funny though to watch people come to the exact same conclusions about Franks argument over and over again. And Frank just keeps repeating himself giving nothing new. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll. Apparently Franks thinks he can just make any claim that he wants and not back it up, then scoff at everyone that thinks he's a troll.

FreedomFromAll said:

How long are you guys going to kick poor ole Frank around?

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Lots of people have just put Frank on ignore because he is a troll, even if he doesn't know it. But I guess the answer is, so long as he continues to make a fool of himself. There are plenty of people on these forums who are one-trick ponies, who say stupid things because they are fanatically convinced that those things have to be true, to the point that they are incapable of stepping back and evaluating their arguments rationally, or even considering what anyone else is saying. Frank is not alone in this, he's just one of the most persistent.

Cephus said:

Lots of people have just put Frank on ignore because he is a troll, even if he doesn't know it. But I guess the answer is, so long as he continues to make a fool of himself. There are plenty of people on these forums who are one-trick ponies, who say stupid things because they are fanatically convinced that those things have to be true, to the point that they are incapable of stepping back and evaluating their arguments rationally, or even considering what anyone else is saying. Frank is not alone in this, he's just one of the most persistent.

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LOl Frank is actually on my ignore list. I hate it when I get baited and caught. sigh...

I can see many reasons people want and need to believe there is a god. I have seen no evidence that would suggest a god exists.

William Rea said:

It appears that self identifying as 'atheist' has become synonymous with making a positive assertion regarding the existence of deities.

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Wrong.

Atheism is the rejection of claims of divine existence without proof.

Atheism is not making any claim, even though some atheists may say that they are certain that no gods exist. That's irrelevant to the generally accepted definition of "atheism".

Generally, people are ignorant and stupid, and when they are confronted with a negative assertion they think that's a positive assertion of a negative idea.

... say that 3 times fast! ...

Atheists don't have to claim or assert anything... they just demand proof from anyone asserting the existence of the supernatural.

No human ever was, is or will be able to prove the supernatural because we already know how religion was developed in human societies.

Therefore, atheism is just claiming the obvious, not making an assertion that needs any kind of support. Reality is all the support atheism needs to have.

FreedomFromAll said:

LOl Frank is actually on my ignore list. I hate it when I get baited and caught. sigh...

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Why ignore when you can just read, laugh and walk on past the train crash.