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For Atheists

Logicman said:
Read the Gospels. Other than that I'm content to let you find out at the end of the age.
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Bible isn't proof that the bible is true.

But it's interesting that you give either circular argument or apathy, pretty telling. No proof, no knowledge.
 
Logicman said:
To pay for our sins. Then God raised him from the dead.
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Why did an omnipotent being allow for original sin? Why did an omnipotent being need to have us kill his "son" in order to reverse it?

These don't sound like works of an omnipotent being.
 
Logicman said:
The delusion is yours.

Christ is Risen!
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Zombie_1c5a85_1002350.jpg
 
Kal'Stang said:
For those that are atheist...you claim that there is no god/s/ess/es. You claim that there is no proof of such and therefore there is none. You claim that those that believe in such are "loons", "looney", "crazy", "delusional", etc etc etc.
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No, you are presenting a strawman argument.

May the halloween demons devour your soul. :)
 
Ikari said:
Bible isn't proof that the bible is true.

But it's interesting that you give either circular argument or apathy, pretty telling. No proof, no knowledge.
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That's your myth that you've bought into.
 
Logicman said:
That's your myth that you've bought into.
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Bwwaahahahahahahahahahah

Circular arguments and apathy, nice. Well have fun with your illogical and irrational arguments.
 
Unrepresented said:
Why did an omnipotent being allow for original sin? Why did an omnipotent being need to have us kill his "son" in order to reverse it?

These don't sound like works of an omnipotent being.
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Have you ever really studied it? Let's say you are God. How do you do the following without creating pre-programmed robots that can only do good?

How do you create man with free will and not allow him to sin if he wants?

Satan in the Garden of Eden « The Righter Report
 
Logicman:

Have you ever really studied it? Let's say you are God. How do you do the following without creating pre-programmed robots that can only do good?

How do you create man with free will and not allow him to sin if he wants?
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Unrepresented said:
You can't create man with free will as an omniscient, omnipresent being. It's illogical.
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I didn't say man was to be created as an omniscient, omnipresent being. Just like you and I are today.

So try with a better answer and look at my question again?
 
Logicman said:
I didn't say man was to be created as an omniscient, omnipresent being. Just like you and I are today.

So try with a better answer and look at my question again?
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You're misreading.

How can an omniscient creator not know the results of his actions?
 
Unrepresented said:
You're misreading.

How can an omniscient creator not know the results of his actions?
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Who says he doesn't know? But foreknowledge is NOT determinism. He can know the future but still allow people like you and I to make our own decisions.

Now, back to my question which you have yet to really answer:

Assuming you are God, how do you do the following without creating pre-programmed robots that can only do good?

I.e. How do you create man with free will and not allow him to sin if he wants?
 
Logicman said:
Who says he doesn't know? But foreknowledge is NOT determinism. He can know the future but still allow people like you and I to make our own decisions.
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If god makes the universe, and god knows the outcome of all things, god has determined the outcome of all things.
Logicman said:
Now, back to my question which you have yet to really answer:

Assuming you are God, how do you do the following without creating pre-programmed robots that can only do good?

I.e. How do you create man with free will and not allow him to sin if he wants?
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You can't. If you are god and you created the universe, and have omniscience, you can only give the creations the illusion of free will.
 
Unrepresented said:
If god makes the universe, and god knows the outcome of all things, god has determined the outcome of all things.
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Nope. Like I said, Foreknowledge is not determinism. God can know your future without making your decisions for you.

Unrepresented said:
You can't. If you are god and you created the universe, and have omniscience, you can only give the creations the illusion of free will.
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God already did make the universe, and you are making your own decisions.
 
Logicman said:
Nope. Like I said, Foreknowledge is not determinism. God can know your future without making your decisions for you.



God already did make the universe, and you are making your own decisions.
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Let me simplify this for you:

Let's pretend I write a number on a piece of paper. Does the piece of paper have free will?
 
Logicman said:
That's an inanimate, non-moral agent. People are created different.
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How are people created differently? If we're designed by an all knowing deity that builds us in the same fashion I built my marked paper, where does free will arrive?
 
Unrepresented said:
How are people created differently? If we're designed by an all knowing deity that builds us in the same fashion I built my marked paper, where does free will arrive?
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You have free will, don't you? You're your own person doing what you think is right (or wrong). Nobody is forcing you to do things, are they?
 
Ikari said:
He's the one inspiring all this writing, yes? There you go.
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Well, people CLAIM that he's inspiring things, there's no actual evidence that's so. It's just more empty claims from the theists.
 
Logicman said:
Sure, but none that the kneejerk denial crowd will ever accept.

But just in case, start reading this:

Answering Islam, A Christian-Muslim Dialog and Apologetic
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I got as far as "Peter Beinart addressed the recent argument between Bill Maher and blaah blah blah bla blah blah blah..." then refused to read any further. Did you even know that Bill Maher is just a comedian? And he's not even a very good comedian. He's nothing but a twerp.
 
Logicman said:
Sure, but none that the kneejerk denial crowd will ever accept.
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In other words, you do not have any evidence that "Christ has risen". You are simply lying to the forum.

You claim to have evidence, well... we're waiting for it.

Can you provide the evidence for all of us to scrutinise, or are you merely logically challenged?

Personally, I think it's the latter.
 
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