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Death

Medusa

Medusa

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what is it ? like the loss of consciousness as you can experience while under anaesthesia or a brain death which causes you to lose all brain functions .or a total death that occurs after all body functions stop working ? or going into another dimension ?

some people coming back from the death claim that they saw a bright light when their hearts stopped beating . did your beloved ones whom you lost ever visit you in your dreams ? do dreams always occur because of our id ? or sometimes they may be a sign that our deceased loved ones still feel us ?
 
Medusa said:
what is it ? like the loss of consciousness as you can experience while under anaesthesia or a brain death which causes you to lose all brain functions .or a total death that occurs after all body functions stop working ? or going into another dimension ?

some people coming back from the death claim that they saw a bright light when their hearts stopped beating . did your beloved ones whom you lost ever visit you in your dreams ? do dreams always occur because of our id ? or sometimes they may be a sign that our deceased loved ones still feel us ?
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Well, what did it feel like before you were born? I think that's a pretty good indication of what it's going to feel like after you're dead.

I've had a few operations with general anesthetic and figure that's like death. I'm gone. No dreaming, no nothing. Then, fortunately, when the anesthetic is reversed, I wake up. But while under anesthetic? That's what death is. Nothingness.

Somebody famous said something like (oh! so! completely paraphrased!): I wasn't inconvenienced for the billions of years I wasn't alive, so I don't expect to be inconvenienced in the slightest for the billions I'll be dead.

Or something like that.
 
:shrug: IDK I'm not dead.
 
I agree with Maggie. I think general anesthesia is a pretty good indicator of what death is like. From the time you pass out till the time you wake up, it was a millisecond. Absolutely nothing inbetween.

Life is short and it's fleeting, cherish it.
 
MaggieD said:
Well, what did it feel like before you were born? I think that's a pretty good indication of what it's going to feel like after you're dead.

I've had a few operations with general anesthetic and figure that's like death. I'm gone. No dreaming, no nothing. Then, fortunately, when the anesthetic is reversed, I wake up. But while under anesthetic? That's what death is. Nothingness.

Somebody famous said something like (oh! so! completely paraphrased!): I wasn't inconvenienced for the billions of years I wasn't alive, so I don't expect to be inconvenienced in the slightest for the billions I'll be dead.

Or something like that.
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l experienced that too maggie ,l understand you .it was like a nullity that didnt include you ..you dont even realize that it is nothingness ..

but , maybe because we are still alive under anaesthesia we may not feel anything as long as we dont enter teh other dimensions

l am trying to do brainstorming on how to define it.
 
Medusa said:
l experienced that too maggie ,l understand you .it was like a nullity that didnt include you ..you dont even realize that it is nothingness ..

but , maybe because we are still alive under anaesthesia we may not feel anything as long as we dont enter teh other dimensions

l am trying to do brainstorming on how to define it.
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a few days after i had surgeury i exprienced sleep paralysis dont know if it has any correlation....scary stuff man
 
Medusa said:
what is it ? like the loss of consciousness as you can experience while under anaesthesia or a brain death which causes you to lose all brain functions .or a total death that occurs after all body functions stop working ? or going into another dimension ?

some people coming back from the death claim that they saw a bright light when their hearts stopped beating . did your beloved ones whom you lost ever visit you in your dreams ? do dreams always occur because of our id ? or sometimes they may be a sign that our deceased loved ones still feel us ?
Click to expand...

I used to be a subscriber to the theory that death was lights out; like when a computer is unplugged, only permanently. I found this belief difficult to deal with.

however, since then, I've observed the way things are set up here on earth a little more closely. the sun rises, sets, and rises again. we wake, we work, we tire, we sleep, and then we wake up and do it again. even the seasons bloom, flourish, die, and bloom. the way that i look at it now, if death was the end of existance forever, it would be unlike any other similar event in nature. I think that we cycle on somehow.

I'm still afraid of it, for sure, but I feel a lot better and more hopeful about it.
 
MaggieD said:
Somebody famous said something like (oh! so! completely paraphrased!): I wasn't inconvenienced for the billions of years I wasn't alive, so I don't expect to be inconvenienced in the slightest for the billions I'll be dead.

Or something like that.
Click to expand...

Pretty sure that was the late Christopher Hitchens. My logical brain agrees with him, and my fanciful heart wishes it weren't true.
 
I've ever passed out before (not a drunken pass out), and I saw a white light. It was more like a cloud, but similar to what people describe that have died and came back to life. When the brain shuts down, you loose the ability to see correctly. The brain makes you see white light because it needs the resources your sight uses as it tries to get back in working order. Since your vision can't focus, it can't process the color spectrum correctly, therefore you see all the colors, which happens to be white.
 
Medusa said:
what is it ? like the loss of consciousness as you can experience while under anaesthesia or a brain death which causes you to lose all brain functions .or a total death that occurs after all body functions stop working ? or going into another dimension ?

some people coming back from the death claim that they saw a bright light when their hearts stopped beating . did your beloved ones whom you lost ever visit you in your dreams ? do dreams always occur because of our id ? or sometimes they may be a sign that our deceased loved ones still feel us ?
Click to expand...

Hmmm, difficult to say with any certainly, and it depends on what and who you believe. I figure that if anything survives, it's along the lines of some type of mental and emotional energy. I've read several NDE books, and I've known a few people who claim to have died and had out-of-body experiences which they could recall, and then come back. With a couple of them, some of the things they reported knowing afterward, that they should not have, tends to give it credibility in my mind.
I have a tendency to believe in reincarnation and progress of the soul, and I tend to view humans as souls who have temporary bodies, rather than bodies who happen to have souls. Iow, to me, the "soul" of a person is the real person. It's what defines him/her and makes him worth knowing.
 


:peace
 
Sarcogito said:
Yeah, I'm not the least bit concerned about death. Dying is what I'm not looking forward to.
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Having sat with my father-in-law whilst he died...it doesn't seem so horrific..

I knew by looking at his face that he was dying..because the person you knew was no longer there..it was just a body even though he appeared to be lucid..

He demanded sips of water..and asked me to wash his face (repeatedly)..

Then he said his mother and father were by the door...and his brother who had died when 8..

His breathing became shorter..and for a moment I thought I saw panic in his eyes...and his hand gripped mine really hard..

He then just gave a long sigh..and he was gone...

Not long afterwards.. all the neighbours dogs started howling..

Strange...
 
MaggieD said:
I've had a few operations with general anesthetic and figure that's like death. I'm gone. No dreaming, no nothing.
Click to expand...

I used to subscribe to this view; but I don't any longer. I think this happens to some people, sort-of.

I would point out that there's a problem here: you cannot, at a later time, distinguish between actually experiencing nothing, and being completely unable to recall experiencing nothing.

This seems to be fairly uncontroversial. The problem this generates is that if you really know that there is nothing, then you must have some experience of nothing.

The idea that death is a big experiential blank is what I would call a modern myth. Whether there's a way to know for certain is something I'm still up in the air about.
 
ashurbanipal said:
I used to subscribe to this view; but I don't any longer. I think this happens to some people, sort-of.

I would point out that there's a problem here: you cannot, at a later time, distinguish between actually experiencing nothing, and being completely unable to recall experiencing nothing.

This seems to be fairly uncontroversial. The problem this generates is that if you really know that there is nothing, then you must have some experience of nothing.

The idea that death is a big experiential blank is what I would call a modern myth. Whether there's a way to know for certain is something I'm still up in the air about.
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Death is absolutely no experience at all. There is nothing to experience since there isnt a brain to perceive anything with. I am not even sure how or why you think that there would be anything like experience involved in being dead. Death is purely only something that the living experience in other people who have died. For the person that died they experience nothing at all, the only thing that may have experienced was that last thought before everything went away including them self.
 
 
FreedomFromAll said:
I am not even sure how or why you think that there would be anything like experience involved in being dead.
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I think the main reasons would be:

1) I do not believe that the brain is necessary or sufficient to produce consciousness. I reached this conclusion after a long period of careful study of academic and scientific sources, so I don't think my position is ill-considered.

2) I suspect, and think there are very good reasons to believe, that phenomenal consciousness is the (or at least an) ontological primitive.

FreedomFromAll said:
Death is purely only something that the living experience in other people who have died. For the person that died they experience nothing at all, the only thing that may have experienced was that last thought before everything went away including them self.
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How do you know?
 
Helix said:
I used to be a subscriber to the theory that death was lights out; like when a computer is unplugged, only permanently. I found this belief difficult to deal with.

however, since then, I've observed the way things are set up here on earth a little more closely. the sun rises, sets, and rises again. we wake, we work, we tire, we sleep, and then we wake up and do it again. even the seasons bloom, flourish, die, and bloom. the way that i look at it now, if death was the end of existance forever, it would be unlike any other similar event in nature. I think that we cycle on somehow.

I'm still afraid of it, for sure, but I feel a lot better and more hopeful about it.
Click to expand...

We do cycle on, in the sense that our materials are used to support new life.

Why must out consciousness cycle? And what exactly is the evidence of that?
 
Sarcogito said:
Yeah, I'm not the least bit concerned about death. Dying is what I'm not looking forward to.
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This. The one thing that scares me if having some sort of slow-killing illness, and not being permitted to choose my own time rather than just sit there and suffer and decay.
 
ashurbanipal said:
I think the main reasons would be:

1) I do not believe that the brain is necessary or sufficient to produce consciousness. I reached this conclusion after a long period of careful study of academic and scientific sources, so I don't think my position is ill-considered.

2) I suspect, and think there are very good reasons to believe, that phenomenal consciousness is the (or at least an) ontological primitive.
Click to expand...
I will not argue with your beliefs. But do not expect me to take your assertions on faith. You can tell me until you are blue in the face that you researched and came to a conclusion that doesnt do anything for your claim. Well I take that back it does do something but nothing creditable. So yes I do think that your position is ill-considered and unfounded and entirely faith based.



How do you know?
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The same way that I know that the light in my fridge turns off when I close the door. So in turn I ask you what part of dead do you not understand? Dead is no longer living; deprived of life. Not endowed with life; inanimate. The brain is entirely necessary and to prove that point just show me one instance of a consciousness that requires no brain?
 
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