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Flattery—Is it Wrong?

Wake

Wake

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What do you think about flattery?

Some use it profusely to wrap many people around their fingers.

At times it is genuine, othertimes... not so much. Whatever the case it's always strategic.

Is it dangerous? What happens when a man... or woman... flatters a boat-load of people? Sometimes it's simply used as a means of self-preservation, while othertimes it's all about power, influence, and control.

I've read a book. It's called You're too Kind by Richard Stengel. Cover to cover. It highlights the history, concept, the everything about flattery. There was a person I knew here who was very adept in this, so I took interest in her behavior and sought to study more of it. Some of the things I can say is that it may actually be part of who we are as animals: chimpanzees definitely exhibit behaviors of flattery whether to woo a female or appease a dominant male. The Athenians despised it iirc and practiced parhesia, which is very blunt, frank speach.

Is it bad? From Plutarch:

"Of all wild animals, the tyrant is the worst; of all tame ones, the flatterer."

Do you think flattery is a social lubricant that is part of the social contract? "If I say something nice about you, you say something nice about me."

What do you honesly think about flattery?
 
Wake said:
What do you think about flattery?

Some use it profusely to wrap many people around their fingers.

At times it is genuine, othertimes... not so much. Whatever the case it's always strategic.

Is it dangerous? What happens when a man... or woman... flatters a boat-load of people? Sometimes it's simply used as a means of self-preservation, while othertimes it's all about power, influence, and control.

I've read a book. It's called You're too Kind by Richard Stengel. Cover to cover. It highlights the history, concept, the everything about flattery. There was a person I knew here who was very adept in this, so I took interest in her behavior and sought to study more of it. Some of the things I can say is that it may actually be part of who we are as animals: chimpanzees definitely exhibit behaviors of flattery whether to woo a female or appease a dominant male. The Athenians despised it iirc and practiced parhesia, which is very blunt, frank speach.

Is it bad? From Plutarch:

"Of all wild animals, the tyrant is the worst; of all tame ones, the flatterer."

Do you think flattery is a social lubricant that is part of the social contract? "If I say something nice about you, you say something nice about me."

What do you honesly think about flattery?
Click to expand...

I don't see flattery as a tit-for-tat play. If I like something someone is wearing, I'm very likely to comment on it. I would be very surprised if they flattered me right back.

I think you used the exact right words for judicious and honest flattery: a social lubricant.
 
MaggieD said:
I don't see flattery as a tit-for-tat play. If I like something someone is wearing, I'm very likely to comment on it. I would be very surprised if they flattered me right back.

I think you used the exact right words for judicious and honest flattery: a social lubricant.
Click to expand...

Googled 'flattery':

Excessive and insincere praise, esp. that given to further one's own interests.
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Anyway, flattery is only bad if the person realizes that you're doing it , and/or it's not funny.
 
MaggieD said:
I don't see flattery as a tit-for-tat play. If I like something someone is wearing, I'm very likely to comment on it. I would be very surprised if they flattered me right back.

I think you used the exact right words for judicious and honest flattery: a social lubricant.
Click to expand...

No.. flattery is strategic praise aimed at influencing people for selfish motives. Sometimes flatterers appease unknowing targets by lavishing them with small gifts... or using opinion conformity... or buttering them up with over-the-top compliments.

One of the easiest ways to spot a flatterer is a person who treats people he/she perceives as superior better than others, while acting like an ogre to those perceived as inferior.

Flattery is never purely honest. There's always a motive. There's a term the ancient civilizations used for those who went a step above flattery.... outright/constant manic nicenesss... that was considered pathetic.
 
Flattery is the perfect crime, because it leaves no trace. It's not like you can get in trouble for it. And even if the guy discovers he's being flattered, he might think.... "well, at least he thinks I'm worth enough to be flattered."
 
Wake said:
Flattery is the perfect crime, because it leaves no trace. It's not like you can get in trouble for it. And even if the guy discovers he's being flattered, he might think.... "well, at least he thinks I'm worth enough to be flattered."
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Sure, it's the perfect crime, the only victim is yourself, your own dignity.
 
Wake said:
Flattery is the perfect crime, because it leaves no trace. It's not like you can get in trouble for it. And even if the guy discovers he's being flattered, he might think.... "well, at least he thinks I'm worth enough to be flattered."
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Flattery seems to be simply the reverse of constructive criticism. As you said, it is the motive for it that requires questioning.
 
Guy Incognito said:
Sure, it's the perfect crime, the only victim is yourself, your own dignity.
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Hey, now, let's not judge. While I cannot bring myself to flatter others, mostly because I couldn't give a crap, I like to follow the Golden Rule on this. I appreciate all complements.
 
Wake, you're saying you saw someone here who used "flattery" (and I think I know who you mean). How do you know that's what it was, rather than her just expressing sincere appreciation?
 
ecofarm said:
Hey, now, let's not judge. While I cannot bring myself to flatter others, mostly because I couldn't give a crap, I like to follow the Golden Rule on this. I appreciate all compliments.
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I don't know about you but I judge constantly. And if I'm applying the golden rule I'd prefer not to get false compliments designed to curry favor.
 
Guy Incognito said:
Sure, it's the perfect crime, the only victim is yourself, your own dignity.
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True. However, it's also true that flattery can get you everywhere.

ttwtt78640 said:
Flattery seems to be simply the reverse of constructive criticism. As you said, it is the motive for it that requires questioning.
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The motive is always disingenuous. There's always some other selfish motive attached to it.
X Factor said:
Wake, you're saying you saw someone here who used "flattery" (and I think I know who you mean). How do you know that's what it was, rather than her just expressing sincere appreciation?
Click to expand...

I can answer that via PM.
 
Wake said:
What do you think about flattery?

What do you honesly think about flattery?
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To me, it depends on the motivation. Flattery, if it's honest and heart-felt is fine. Flattery, if it's because you are trying to gain special favors, is sleazy.
 
That's because the most fabulous human being on Earth and anywhere else in the galaxy. I just love your new sweater also.
:roll:

ecofarm said:
Hey, now, let's not judge. While I cannot bring myself to flatter others, mostly because I couldn't give a crap, I like to follow the Golden Rule on this. I appreciate all complements.
Click to expand...
 
lizzie said:
To me, it depends on the motivation. Flattery, if it's honest and heart-felt is fine. Flattery, if it's because you are trying to gain special favors, is sleazy.
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Flattery can never be honest and genuine. With genuine kindness there's no need for honest flattery. When you butter someone up, you do so for a reason.
 
specklebang said:
That's because the most fabulous human being on Earth and anywhere else in the galaxy. I just love your new sweater also.
:roll:
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See, that's the best response I ever got from you. Thanks.
 
You guys really should read You're too Kind by Richard Stengel. It's an excellent read.

Flattery is an incredible part of history, from ancient Egypt, Rome, the Dark Ages, Carnegie, etc.
 
'When he saw that many leaned towards him, Melkor would often walk among them, and amid his fair words others were woven, so subtly that many who heard them believed in recollection that they arose from their own thought'.

- The Silmarillion
 
Wake said:
Flattery can never be honest and genuine. With genuine kindness there's no need for honest flattery. When you butter someone up, you do so for a reason.
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Of course it can. If someone looks particularly beautiful on a specific day, as compared to usual, and I tell them how good they like, it is genuine flattery.
 
Not sure if I get the full connotation of the English word "flattery", but I think it depends on the motive, as was said before: When it's sincere, honest and without a bad motivation besides showing someone your own admiration and/or love, I think it's fine.

Why not give women you like a compliment about their looks sometimes? Of course, only if you really mean it (and what big crime is exaggeration anyway)? Basically, all you are saying is "I really like you, and care enough to recognize your efforts". That's not a bad message to communicate, or is it? Likewise with buddies you like, though the compliment wouldn't typically about looks in most cases.

When it becomes a tool to manipulate people, though -- you are not sincere, but abuse the vanity of the respective person to make him or her more fond of you --, I agree that's bad. But the bad thing about it would be the implicit lie, the false message you communicate.
 
Flatterers have a penchant of creating little gifts to "hook" the attention of others, in order to manipulate them. A little gift here, a little gift there, a compliment here, a larger compliment there, it's the trade of the flatterer. They can be discerned if you know what to look for.
 
Wake said:
True. However, it's also true that flattery can get you everywhere.
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Maybe. It depends on what you mean by "you." What are you without dignity?
 
lizzie said:
Of course it can. If someone looks particularly beautiful on a specific day, as compared to usual, and I tell them how good they like, it is genuine flattery.
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Wouldn't that simply be niceness or kindness?

Flattery can be honest.... but is always strategic. There's no strategy or motive involved when it comes to simply being nice, kind. It can't be flattery if there's no motive, no strategy, etc.
 
German guy said:
Not sure if I get the full connotation of the English word "flattery", but I think it depends on the motive, as was said before: When it's sincere, honest and without a bad motivation besides showing someone your own admiration and/or love, I think it's fine.

Why not give women you like a compliment about their looks sometimes? Of course, only if you really mean it (and what big crime is exaggeration anyway)? Basically, all you are saying is "I really like you, and care enough to recognize your efforts". That's not a bad message to communicate, or is it? Likewise with buddies you like, though the compliment wouldn't typically about looks in most cases.

When it becomes a tool to manipulate people, though -- you are not sincere, but abuse the vanity of the respective person to make him or her more fond of you --, I agree that's bad. But the bad thing about it would be the implicit lie, the false message you communicate.
Click to expand...

If there is any motive attached to the flattery, it's disingenuous. If you're genuine, you can say something nice to someone else and have no desire to manipulate the person or gain from him.

A compliment isn't always flattery. A compliment doesn't always have a motive or selfish interest attached to it.

Flattery is always a means to manipulate someone. You can do this by either flattering them with something you genuinely feel about them, or some lie. Whether heartfelt or not, if it has a motive, it's flattery. If you flatter someone with something you truly like about them, it makes it even easier to manipulate that person, because there's less to have to remember. (That's included in the book.)
 
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