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WTF Is Up With Atheists Lately?

jamesrage said:
Atheist have this self victim mentality, that is why they feel the need to bash those who believe in deities. The truth is they are not free thinkers, they just want you to adhere and subscribe to their beliefs and practices just as much as any extreme church wants you to subscribe to their beliefs.
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Could be. Dunno why, though...it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If there's no God yet you believe that there is, how does that affect your neighbor (assuming everyone is able to maintain some privacy and civility)?
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
I suppose I could understand it if you were acting that way towards theists that had given you a hard time or insulted or belittled you, but that isn't what's happening. I've seen videos of people who literally say that they have no intention of respecting the religious preferences of others because -- to a man -- the religious are all idiots and deserve to be ridiculed.
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What if you met someone who really, truly believed in Santa Claus? How would that impact your opinion of them? You wouldn't necessarily try and argue them out of believing Santa, but you would still be thinking, "Wow, this guy's kind of an idiot," even if they were normal in all other respects.
 
jamesrage said:
Atheist have this self victim mentality, that is why they feel the need to bash those who believe in deities. The truth is they are not free thinkers, they just want you to adhere and subscribe to their beliefs and practices just as much as any extreme church wants you to subscribe to their beliefs.
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Yes, we do want more people to subscribe to our practices. It's called rational thought.
 
atrasicarius said:
What if you met someone who really, truly believed in Santa Claus? How would that impact your opinion of them? You wouldn't necessarily try and argue them out of believing Santa, but you would still be thinking, "Wow, this guy's kind of an idiot," even if they were normal in all other respects.
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No. Why should it?
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
Being better than that means not stepping down to that level.
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Sorry but for far too many, the only way not to go down to that level is to never mention the subject at all. They take offense if someone even mentions the fact in passing that they don't believe what others believe. You cannot solve problems by not talking about them, sorry.
 
Pinkie said:
Never been on facebook or youtube, Deuce?
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I wouldn't be caught dead on Farcebook, but if you scan YouTube, there are many, many, many, many times more theists trying to convert people than atheists. Funny how you ignore that part.
 
Cephus said:
Sorry but for far too many, the only way not to go down to that level is to never mention the subject at all. They take offense if someone even mentions the fact in passing that they don't believe what others believe. You cannot solve problems by not talking about them, sorry.
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Whether they do or do not take offense to your lack of belief is irrelevant -- how you behave is relevant.

Your bad behavior isn't going to rectify someone else's bad behavior. It's just going to reinforce their bad behavior by making bad behavior more socially acceptable. You are not solving any problem, you are only contributing to it.
 
Pinkie said:
Could be. Dunno why, though...it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If there's no God yet you believe that there is, how does that affect your neighbor (assuming everyone is able to maintain some privacy and civility)?
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Because like it or not, our beliefs inform our actions. People don't tend to keep their religious beliefs to themselves, they tend to promote them loudly, vote based on them, treat others differently because of them, etc. When people have inherently irrational beliefs, their actions tend to be inherently irrational. That alone is a good reason to promote rationality.
 
atrasicarius said:
What if you met someone who really, truly believed in Santa Claus? How would that impact your opinion of them? You wouldn't necessarily try and argue them out of believing Santa, but you would still be thinking, "Wow, this guy's kind of an idiot," even if they were normal in all other respects.
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I understand your point, but it doesn't consider the various family, social, and emotional needs that can be met -- in both healthy and unhealthy ways -- by practicing a religion, especially the religion of your family.

Even I had my baby baptized. I was also married in a church, although not a RCC one. Rational? Not at all.

But it meant a great deal to me.
 
radcen said:
Sometimes I think people who do that are trying more to convince themselves rather than other people.
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Convince themselves of what, exactly?

bowerbird said:
Read an article a while back which talked of the psychology/sociology of this. The article split atheism into two groups - "strong" and "passive". Strong atheists were aggressive in arguing religion and more likely to be found in countries where there is a strong religious belief - i.e. Some parts of the USA. Passive atheists on the other hand are more likely to be very laissez faire about religion and were likely to come from countries where religion is simply not discussed much - like Denmark and Australia
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Interesting, and that makes sense. If people have an opposite view crammed down their throat, they will be more aggressive. I wonder how many of the so called "militant atheists" live in the Bible Belt? lol

And btw, that term is nonsensical. I'd love to see an example of a real, modern day militant atheist. Having strong views doesn't fit the actual description of the word.

atrasicarius said:
What if you met someone who really, truly believed in Santa Claus? How would that impact your opinion of them? You wouldn't necessarily try and argue them out of believing Santa, but you would still be thinking, "Wow, this guy's kind of an idiot," even if they were normal in all other respects.
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True. Not much of a difference if you ask me. :shrug:
 
Cephus said:
Because like it or not, our beliefs inform our actions. People don't tend to keep their religious beliefs to themselves, they tend to promote them loudly, vote based on them, treat others differently because of them, etc. When people have inherently irrational beliefs, their actions tend to be inherently irrational. That alone is a good reason to promote rationality.
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I'm in favor of rationality, Cephus. At least most of the time. Other times, I think humans have emotional needs that rationality alone cannot fulfill.

But what is rational about a rant on youtube about how stupid it is to believe in God? What's rational about about trying to bully people into attending an atheist convention (still can't understand WTF that is for) or shaming people because they aren't "pure" atheists?

All behaviors I have personally observed and in some cases, experienced.

Christ onna cracker, even Madalyn Murray O'Hair only wanted separation of church and state -- not the forced elimination of all religious practices.
 
Cephus said:
I don't think that it has anything to do with being "better than this". Atheists have gotten abused for centuries, it's only in the last few years that atheists have been able to stand up for their rights without being physically or financially harmed. Can we blame them for taking the opportunity that has been denied to them all this time? Certainly, nobody is complaining about the religious going around trying to get converts, mostly for their money, why is it now somehow bad for atheists to be able to open their mouths and speak out against something that most of us view as a social evil?

Personally, I look forward to the day when atheists have no need to make a case against religion because religion is extinct. We are better than that, sometimes we have to stoop down to the level of the lowest common denominator to be heard at all.
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Humans have a spiritual dimension or at least a natural inclination for one. Mainstream religions might eventually morph into a more personal, individual spirituality, but I doubt very much that religion will ever be extinct. I have no doubt that atheism will keep rising, so I'm really not too worried about not being heard. All I know is that I didn't become an atheist because someone stooped down a few notches to tell me about it, but because the intellectual works of countless atheist authors and philosophers echoed my own conclusions.
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
Whether they do or do not take offense to your lack of belief is irrelevant -- how you behave is relevant.

Your bad behavior isn't going to rectify someone else's bad behavior. It's just going to reinforce their bad behavior by making bad behavior more socially acceptable. You are not solving any problem, you are only contributing to it.
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There's nothing bad about it, any behavior no matter how it's done is viewed as bad by the true believer. Atheists existing reinforces their bad behavior because in this country, we have Christian privilege, they get special rights just because they exist and one of their perceived rights is the right to criticize everyone else because their imaginary friend in the sky demands it. It's not a problem that can be solved, only one that can be addressed head on.

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dont-doorknock-for-atheism.jpg
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
That they don't believe in a higher power. Sort of like homophobes who use their rhetoric and behavior to mask and/or bury their homosexual impulses.
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Maybe it's nothing more complicated than the Atheist experience.

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I did once encounter a group called the "Brights" who seemed terribly keen on having an organisation for non-believers.

I found it. They're terribly terribly earnest, with a host of new recruits testifying to their relief at having found an oasis which shares their worldview.

http://www.the-brights.net/
 
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Pinkie said:
I understand your point, but it doesn't consider the various family, social, and emotional needs that can be met -- in both healthy and unhealthy ways -- by practicing a religion, especially the religion of your family.

Even I had my baby baptized. I was also married in a church, although not a RCC one. Rational? Not at all.

But it meant a great deal to me.
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Sure, but you acknowledge that it's not rational. People aren't rational, and sometimes we do things for emotional reasons that don't make a lot of sense. I do it too sometimes. I'm talking about people who say their belief is rational, and Santa Claus actually exists and actually keeps a list of who's been naughty and nice. I don't care if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, you're still an idiot if you believe that.
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
That they don't believe in a higher power. Sort of like homophobes who use their rhetoric and behavior to mask and/or bury their homosexual impulses.
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So really, Atheists believe in God, but they are attempting to deny those beliefs. Seriously?

lol Cephus, what do you think?
 
Cephus said:
There's nothing bad about it
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You don't think that making fun of someone else because of their beliefs constitutes bad behavior? Well, that explains a lot.

Cephus said:
any behavior no matter how it's done is viewed as bad by the true believer.
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Again, and I'm not sure why I have to repeat myself, whether they do or do not take offense to your lack of belief is irrelevant -- how you behave is relevant.
 
evanescence said:
So really, Atheists believe in God, but they are attempting to deny those beliefs. Seriously?

lol Cephus, what do you think?
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It would be a perfectly rational explanation for the level of venom I've seen out of some people.

I'm sure there are plenty of atheists who are genuinely atheist, I'm talking about the especially vitriolic ones.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Maybe it's nothing more complicated than the Atheist experience.

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And if that's all the especially nasty atheists did, I wouldn't have a problem with it -- but they also make fun of people who believe in a higher power whether or not those people have gotten in their face before.
 
Manc Skipper said:
I did once encounter a group called the "Brights" who seemed terribly keen on having an organisation for non-believers.

I found it. They're terribly terribly earnest, with a host of new recruits testifying to their relief at having found an oasis which shares their worldview.

The Brights' Net - Home Page
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Pretty much everyone in the atheist community thinks the Brights have it wrong. Mostly, they're trying to use a word that's less emotionally charged than atheist, but as far as I'm concerned, words have meanings for a reason, let's use the words we have instead of making up new words that mean essentially the same thing. The whole "Bright" movement flared and largely died a while back, not many take it seriously anymore.
 
atrasicarius said:
Sure, but you acknowledge that it's not rational. People aren't rational, and sometimes we do things for emotional reasons that don't make a lot of sense. I do it too sometimes. I'm talking about people who say their belief is rational, and Santa Claus actually exists and actually keeps a list of who's been naughty and nice. I don't care if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, you're still an idiot if you believe that.
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So the guy's an idiot. Does that mean we have to go out of our way to point and laugh loudly at him in public or go tell him to his face that he's a moron? No. Just live and let live. He's not hurting anyone by thinking he's being perfectly rational. My day wouldn't get any better by walking up to him and saying "Dood, you're delusional in the extreme."
 
Cephus said:
I wouldn't be caught dead on Farcebook, but if you scan YouTube, there are many, many, many, many times more theists trying to convert people than atheists. Funny how you ignore that part.
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Once again, same question: why would atheists adopt the slimeball behavior they detest in religious people?

And WTF difference does it make how many atheists are around? Is there a critical mass to be reached, where all religious BS suddenly stops?
 
evanescence said:
So really, Atheists believe in God, but they are attempting to deny those beliefs. Seriously?

lol Cephus, what do you think?
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It's ridiculous, but there really are people out there who think that. They cannot imagine anyone not embracing their beliefs so they are convinced that everyone, no matter what they say, is actually their brand of theist and is refusing to acknowledge it.

Those kind of people are extremely annoying, there's one right now in the Abortion forum who tells everyone what they really believe. :roll:
 
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