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Two things I don't get about Caitlyn Jenner

Middleground

Middleground

2-Lipped Beaver!
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Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...

Not sure about number 1.

But number 2 sure does puzzle me, especially that she endorsed Cruz.

Look, being transgender is ONE aspect of her personality, it doesn't define everything she is, so the fact that she's conservative is not a worry for me, nor should it be.

However... It is... Noteworthy.

It is interesting.

It is a worthy point of discussion to ask why someone, from the LGBT community would endorse the MOST anti LGBT candidate left in the race.

I mean, I believe all sorts of things from conservative and liberal leanings and I have to make a difficult choice at times with which party will best represent those beliefs, but if a party came along and had every single belief I hold dear set in stone and would implement them, if a foot note said that

"P.S we will work to take rights away from immigrants originating from Africa" (of which I am one).

I MIGHT GIVE THEM A MISS.
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...

What "rights" are we talking about? Transgenders have the same rights as everyone else and republicans care about all of those rights. As im sure you know we do have a transgender on this forum that is a staunch conservative, Im sure she can answer the question better than I ever could.
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...

What I don't get is why is this important to you or anyone else for that matter?

What does it matter if this individual, like any other individual, has conflicting socio-political views? Who cares if S/he claims to like men now, or still supports the republican party? Hell, who cares if ANY "celebrity" has personal likes or dislikes that one may personally find confusing?

I don't live my life vicariously through the exploits of others. I just try to live my own life, and accept that others will also be doing so. :shrug:
 
Captain Adverse said:
What I don't get is why is this important to you or anyone else for that matter?

What does it matter if this individual, like any other individual, has conflicting socio-political views? Who cares if S/he claims to like men now, or still supports the republican party? Hell, who cares if ANY "celebrity" has personal likes or dislikes that one may personally find confusing?

I don't live my life vicariously through the exploits of others. I just try to live my own life, and accept that others will also be doing so. :shrug:
Click to expand...

Is this not a discussion forum? I have a natural curiosity... so what is the big deal? If the topic is not up your alley, bowl somewhere else.
 
Crovax said:
What "rights" are we talking about? Transgenders have the same rights as everyone else and republicans care about all of those rights.
Click to expand...

They do? Got any links?



As im sure you know we do have a transgender on this forum that is a staunch conservative, Im sure she can answer the question better than I ever could.
Click to expand...

Yup. That one puzzles me, too.
 
Middleground said:
Is this not a discussion forum? I have a natural curiosity... so what is the big deal? If the topic is not up your alley, bowl somewhere else.
Click to expand...

Well, if you have a "natural curiosity" why not write the subject of your curiosity a letter? Then you'll get your answers from the horse's mouth.

What's to debate? Might as well debate why YOU are the way you are. Although since you are a member at least we'd get some clear answers :roll:
 
Your question number 2 is easy. You have just been mislead as to the Republican party and have fallen for the propaganda against it. Occam's razor. There are numerous individuals who support the Republican party despite generalizations about the special interest groups that they may also belong.
 
1. Lots of women are attracted to women. And while you can change what you look like on the outside but you aren't likely going to change whom you are attracted to.

2. She spent most of her life as a privileged white man. And she is still rich. It isn't surprising she is a Republican.
 
Eric7216 said:
Your question number 2 is easy. You have just been mislead as to the Republican party and have fallen for the propaganda against it. Occam's razor. There are numerous individuals who support the Republican party despite generalizations about the special interest groups that they may also belong.
Click to expand...

Prove to me the Republican party supports gay/transgendered rights. The onus is on you, if you make the claim.
 
BrewerBob said:
1. Lots of women are attracted to women.
Click to expand...

Really? How many, as in %? Because -- if I am not mistaken -- roughly 5-10% of people are gay. Does that quantify "lots?" But you're still missing the point. Jenner has been always attracted to women. But now, as a woman, he wants to date men. Can we turn off what we are attracted to just like that?

And while you can change what you look like on the outside but you aren't likely going to change whom you are attracted to.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's exactly what I don't understand re. Jenner.

2. She spent most of her life as a privileged white man. And she is still rich. It isn't surprising she is a Republican.
Click to expand...

I can understand the tax angle. I am sure the last few years have been good for her fiscally. Still, is it worth it teaming up with a party that does not believe in your rights as a person?
 
Number 2 puzzles me also. It's like a black man supporting the KKK.
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?
Click to expand...
It's not uncommon for transgender MTF after continuous hormones to have have a shift in their feelings. It doesn't happen to everyone, but some. Some lied about it to themselves, to others pre-transition and early transition as well as they tried to cope with everything going on with them.


Middleground said:
2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...
Because MG, some of us don't agree with your view of conservatives views of LGBT issues. At this point, most just don't care about it anymore. You're gay, great, and? Is a common sentiment.
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...

Republicans do not care about gay rights? Get out much?
 
Renae said:
It's not uncommon for transgender MTF after continuous hormones to have have a shift in their feelings. It doesn't happen to everyone, but some. Some lied about it to themselves, to others pre-transition and early transition as well as they tried to cope with everything going on with them.



Because MG, some of us don't agree with your view of conservatives views of LGBT issues. At this point, most just don't care about it anymore. You're gay, great, and? Is a common sentiment.
Click to expand...

Thank you. What you wrote makes perfect sense. At least the hormone part. And I am sure there are Republican moderates who are cool with equal rights. I just don't see it in the leadership right now.
 
Middleground said:
Thank you. What you wrote makes perfect sense. At least the hormone part. And I am sure there are Republican moderates who are cool with equal rights. I just don't see it in the leadership right now.
Click to expand...

I've read, talked and explored the issue. So far, honestly, for me Men are pigs. And ugly. If that changes I'll let you know ;P

It's not that they are against equal rights, they are against making special rules for groups of people. It separates people, causes division, isn't the place of the Federal Government. It's not out of malice or hate. I won't lie and say there are not RIGHT wing homophobes, but they are being more and more marginalized
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...
What I don't understand about #2 is why everybody is so baffled by it. There's more to a person's ideology than a single issue. A lot more.

But, to be fair, she does have an advantage as a generally popular high-profile person to help smooth out any negativity in her life. Sure, there are many people figuratively crapping on her, but there are also many people openly encouraging and supporting her, too. That has to help.
 
Where in the republican platform does it say it doesn't support the rights of a person?


Middleground said:
Really? How many, as in %? Because -- if I am not mistaken -- roughly 5-10% of people are gay. Does that quantify "lots?" But you're still missing the point. Jenner has been always attracted to women. But now, as a woman, he wants to date men. Can we turn off what we are attracted to just like that?



Yeah, that's exactly what I don't understand re. Jenner.



I can understand the tax angle. I am sure the last few years have been good for her fiscally. Still, is it worth it teaming up with a party that does not believe in your rights as a person?
Click to expand...
 
So when you say "rights of a person" you mean gay marriage. You should just say that instead of attempting to make the issue bigger than it is. Its like when some say "anti-woman" or "war on women" when what they really mean is opposing abortion on demand or support any limit on abortion.

As far as I know, Kasich, Rubio, probably rand paul do not oppose gay marriage. They may not provide a ringing endorsement of it but tolerance doesn't require embracing.

Middleground said:
Who is in favour of gay marriage?
Click to expand...
 
Middleground said:
Let me just start by saying I am empathetic to her plight. Though I have not walked in her shoes, I can understand that she felt awkward in a man's body. That was a huge burden to carry for all of those years and I am happy she had the courage to come out.

What I don't get is the following:

1) She has apparently been attracted to women all her life. Attraction is natural -- something one is born with. So then, now that she is out as a female, why is she considering dating men? This I don't get. Can anyone help me understand something that I am not getting, or do you see this as ****ed up as I do?

2) Why the hell is she being so outspoken as a staunch Republican, a party that does not give one flying **** about her welfare and rights as a transgendered person? Why want a government that does not hold dear matters that are hugely important?
Click to expand...

AFAIK the dating men thing is experimental, as she feels she may be more bisexual now. I only know this from a brief interview I saw.

As for the GOP thing... there are lots of LGBT Republicans out there who vote Repub because of various values. To me it makes as much sense as as a poor person voting for Trump but hey, they have free will.
 
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