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North Carolina is no longer classified as a democracy

Looking forward to when the republican senate, house, and president pass a bill outlawing gerrymandering. :lamo:lamo:lamo
 
I guess the democrat party is the democratic party
 
OpportunityCost said:
You act like gerrymandering is specific to Republican leaning states. It isn't, at all. Learn to see malfeasance on both sides of the aisle.
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Democrats have gerrymandered before, therefore republicans should gerrymander now? Pretty awful logic there.
 
Phoenix said:
I read this piece a few days ago. I get what he is saying BUT I think this is exactly what democracy looks like. 50%+1 wins. They make the rules and the minority be damned. People who want to abolish the electoral college should use NC as a case study and figure out why it would be a bad idea.
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That doesn't address voter disenfranchisement or the petty partisan legislative power grab.
 
Absentglare said:
Democrats have gerrymandered before, therefore republicans should gerrymander now? Pretty awful logic there.
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No, I'm not excusing EITHER side. Nor am I blind to both sides doing it.

Speaking of logic, you should try using some.
 
OpportunityCost said:
No, I'm not excusing EITHER side. Nor am I blind to both sides doing it.

Speaking of logic, you should try using some.
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NIMBY was claiming that republicans did it three times more, that's acknowledging a quarter measure worth of democrats doing it.

So that doesn't qualify as being "blind" to it. In essence, it was a distraction. Sorry i did not make that more clear.
 
Absentglare said:
NIMBY was claiming that republicans did it three times more, that's acknowledging a quarter measure worth of democrats doing it.

So that doesn't qualify as being "blind" to it. In essence, it was a distraction. Sorry i did not make that more clear.
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There isn't a measure of how much. A political party is either doing it or they aren't. That's just a semantics game to make the other party look more guilty and its a childish argument.
 
OpportunityCost said:
There isn't a measure of how much. A political party is either doing it or they aren't. That's just a semantics game to make the other party look more guilty and its a childish argument.
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You've never heard of counting them and evaluating the resulting inequality?
 
Absentglare said:
You've never heard of counting them and evaluating the resulting inequality?
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Since Republican control more states at the moment, we know how its going to turn out. I would suggest that every state does it to some degree whether its Democrat or Republican.

Crying about how much it happens is less of a remedy than preventing it altogether. I know efforts to amend the process have been blocked in numerous states. It seems fairly futile, politicians are going to scheme for advantage, its the way they are, more or less.
 
OpportunityCost said:
Since Republican control more states at the moment, we know how its going to turn out. I would suggest that every state does it to some degree whether its Democrat or Republican.

Crying about how much it happens is less of a remedy than preventing it altogether. I know efforts to amend the process have been blocked in numerous states. It seems fairly futile, politicians are going to scheme for advantage, its the way they are, more or less.
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Since it's inevitable, we should embrace it? Sorry, no, i disagree. It's shameful when democrats do it, that's the republicans game: lie, cheat, steal- subvert democracy.
 
American said:
The difference between you and I is that I know we're not a democracy.
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Exactly. I can't understand why people continue to believe the states or the US is a democracy....
 
Ockham said:
Exactly. I can't understand why people continue to believe the states or the US is a democracy....
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It was never meant to be a democracy. The USA is a Constitutional Republic with inalienable rights that even the majority cannot take away.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Taking punitive actions to undermine the results of an election or when the democratic environment is not fair is not how a free and fair democracy operates.
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Tell that to Barack Hussein Obama as he tries to sabotage the USA's relationship with Israel prior to Trump taking office.
 
Absentglare said:
Since it's inevitable, we should embrace it? Sorry, no, i disagree. It's shameful when democrats do it, that's the republicans game: lie, cheat, steal- subvert democracy.
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Ref - Dehumanization.jpg

You HAD to go there. I tried agreeing with you in essence but the partisan hackery force was too strong for you and you had to voice it. Congratulations. 15 yards to goal, 1st down.
 
Absentglare said:
That doesn't address voter disenfranchisement or the petty partisan legislative power grab.
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What disenfranchisement?

I agree it's petty and as soon as the other party takes power it will be reinstated. Then when it changes again it will be repeated probably even worse. That doesn't change the fact that this is a democracy.
 
Phoenix said:
What disenfranchisement?

I agree it's petty and as soon as the other party takes power it will be reinstated. Then when it changes again it will be repeated probably even worse. That doesn't change the fact that this is a democracy.
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From the OP:

"Second, democracies do not limit their citizens’ rights on the basis of their born identities. However, this is exactly what the North Carolina legislature did through House Bill 2 (there are an estimated 38,000 transgender Tar Heels), targeted attempts to reduce African-American and Latino access to the vote and pernicious laws to constrain the ability of women to act as autonomous citizens."

Read more here: Point of View: North Carolina no longer a democracy | News & Observer
 
Absentglare said:
From the OP:

"Second, democracies do not limit their citizens’ rights on the basis of their born identities. However, this is exactly what the North Carolina legislature did through House Bill 2 (there are an estimated 38,000 transgender Tar Heels), targeted attempts to reduce African-American and Latino access to the vote and pernicious laws to constrain the ability of women to act as autonomous citizens."

Read more here: Point of View: North Carolina no longer a democracy | News & Observer
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HB2 has been attempted to overturn several times now and was basically a stunt between Charlotte and Raleigh to get a Democratic governor elected. Telling people which bathroom to use isn't restricting their rights.
The voter ID law was certainly enacted based on race but was subsequently overturned in court. I have no idea what he is eluding to with the women as autonomous citizens statement.
 
Absentglare said:
From the OP:

"Second, democracies do not limit their citizens’ rights on the basis of their born identities. However, this is exactly what the North Carolina legislature did through House Bill 2 (there are an estimated 38,000 transgender Tar Heels), targeted attempts to reduce African-American and Latino access to the vote and pernicious laws to constrain the ability of women to act as autonomous citizens."

Read more here: Point of View: North Carolina no longer a democracy | News & Observer
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https://ballotpedia.org/File:North-carolina-congressional-map-2010.gif

North Carolina just elected 13 House representatives, 10 GOP and 3 DEM. When you look at the map, you'll easily be able to see that DEM CDs are 1, 4, and 12.

As for the 50 states, 21 are GOP gerrymandered and 7 are DEM. The GOP seats add up to 167-57 and the DEMs 93-32. The other 22 states are either too small to be GM or are not GM, such as AZ and those seats are 44-42 DEM.
 
Phoenix said:
HB2 has been attempted to overturn several times now and was basically a stunt between Charlotte and Raleigh to get a Democratic governor elected. Telling people which bathroom to use isn't restricting their rights.
The voter ID law was certainly enacted based on race but was subsequently overturned in court. I have no idea what he is eluding to with the women as autonomous citizens statement.
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Female autonomy often refers to laws regarding topics like rape and abortion.

In this case, i believe the author intended abortion:

https://www.google.com/amp/mobile.n...es-abortion-battle-in-north-carolina.amp.html
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Read more @: North Carolina is no longer classified as a democracy

North Carolina is the GOP's dream. Undermine the powers of the democratically elected governor, gerrymander the state congressional districts to a point where most of them are not even competitive, and ignore the voice of the people. North Carolina is essentially on its way to becoming a one party state where democratic values are
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Good post.

What you're seeing here, is dictatorial government usurping the will of the people! Third world Banana Republic stuff!
 
Chomsky said:
Good post.

What you're seeing here, is dictatorial government usurping the will of the people! Third world Banana Republic stuff!
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When anyone wonders how the GOP intends to stay viable while national demographics trend against them over the next decade or two or three, this presidential election and the events in North Carolina should provide bright shining flashing arrow as to just how they intend to do it over the will of the people.

Eventually, its going to hit the fan - and the fan could well break. And that is going to be very very ugly.
 
haymarket said:
When anyone wonders how the GOP intends to stay viable while national demographics trend against them over the next decade or two or three, this presidential election and the events in North Carolina should provide bright shining flashing arrow as to just how they intend to do it over the will of the people.

Eventually, its going to hit the fan - and the fan could well break. And that is going to be very very ugly.
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What just hit the fan was the liberal bigotry overshoot and gleefull arrogance tooted much too loudly and obnoxiously.

It is such a pity. They were onti some really important issues, but then they succeeded and it went to their heads just at the moment they had nothing left to do other than some marginal corrections. And so they went overboard with overkill.
 
joG said:
What just hit the fan was the liberal bigotry overshoot and gleefull arrogance tooted much too loudly and obnoxiously.

It is such a pity. They were onti some really important issues, but then they succeeded and it went to their heads just at the moment they had nothing left to do other than some marginal corrections. And so they went overboard with overkill.
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Can you provide some specific examples of this claim?
 
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