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Who is doing better against ISIS? US vs Russia

JANFU said:
Turkey now allows the US and others to use their bases now???
The A 10 is not a viable platform to use against ISIL??
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I don't know how Turkey is cooperating in this fight, if at all. I saw a report months ago that it had opened the airbase at Incirlik to U.S. aircraft again, and if so, it is close enough to Kobani that A-10's might have operated out of there in that battle. I can't read the minds of our military commanders, but it would make sense for the ability to rescue any downed pilots to be an important concern in their planning. The only practical base for search-and-rescue for operations around Kobani would have been across the border in Turkey.

I'm sure the A-10 would be very effective against the kind of forces ISIS has. The problem is that even though it's armored, and even though it uses flares and other devices to defend against surface-to-air missiles, the fact it flies low and slow makes it vulnerable. The Russians are using a similar but somewhat faster plane, the SU-25, but in Syria, it is easier for them to arrange for friendly forces to be nearby to help in case one is shot down.
 
JANFU said:
The air war against ISIL has not been as successful as many think.
Look to the ISIL siege of Kobane as one example. ISIL had the place surrounded, outside the city were plenty of targets, ISIl was present in large numbers and moving men and supplies. A target rich environment.
Perhaps the A 10 could have been more useful then the strikes made by the US and others.
And the A 10 is highly effective at taking out a variety of targets.

o
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Kobane is the biggest victory over ISIS in the entire war so far. The YPG, despite holding as little as 40% of the city at certain points, not only managed to drive ISIS completely out of Kobane but also was able to liberate the surrounding area and connect with their comrades in the east. A PKK fighter (who, considering the US' attitude towards his organization, has little reason to praise us) who was in Kobane did an AMA on Reddit a few months ago where he outright stated that the Kurds would still be fighting in Kobane (if they were lucky) were it not for the airstrikes. Kobane is an example of how effective and valuable American air power is to fighting a quasi-conventional armed group like ISIS.
 
Helix said:
if Russia wants to put Iraq and Syria on their plate, let them.
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Russia isn't asking for US permission. Russia is serving it's client (assad) and killing the "Syrian moderates" we support.
Russia is doing deals with Egypt,Iran/ Russia isactively working to get Iran ain troops into Syria, not just Hezbollah,
but forces like in Iraq.

Russia is a growing regional power due in large part to Obama's incompetence. The Iran / Iraq / Lebanon / Syrian axis.

Before you dismiss this as "so what", it's important to understand every president since Nasser has been in agreement to
keep Russia bottled up out of the ME. All that's changed under Obama
 
annata said:
Russia isn't asking for US permission. Russia is serving it's client (assad) and killing the "Syrian moderates" we support.
Russia is doing deals with Egypt,Iran/ Russia isactively working to get Iran ain troops into Syria, not just Hezbollah,
but forces like in Iraq.

Russia is a growing regional power due in large part to Obama's incompetence. The Iran / Iraq / Lebanon / Syrian axis.

Before you dismiss this as "so what", it's important to understand every president since Nasser has been in agreement to
keep Russia bottled up out of the ME. All that's changed under Obama
Click to expand...

Let's not overplay the significance of Russia's intervention. Despite Putin's posturing, Russia is still a second-rate power at best, and even if we don't respond in a manner geared towards undermining the Russian effort, the Gulf states will. There are a maximum of 40 Russian planes in Syria (along with Hinds), and that number could very well decrease when Saudi MANPADs start reaching the rebels. Russian support for Putin may be high now, but if Russians start coming home in body bags, that will probably begin to change (hence the dubious claim of a Russian soldier "committing suicide" in Syria). As far as Obama's attitude goes, I can understand his preference for a non-confrontational approach to situations like this, but he's not afraid to up the ante if need be - and it is Russia who ultimately cannot afford to escalate.
 
annata said:
Russia isn't asking for US permission. Russia is serving it's client (assad) and killing the "Syrian moderates" we support.
Russia is doing deals with Egypt,Iran/ Russia isactively working to get Iran ain troops into Syria, not just Hezbollah,
but forces like in Iraq.

Russia is a growing regional power due in large part to Obama's incompetence. The Iran / Iraq / Lebanon / Syrian axis.
Click to expand...

save me the Obama bull****. people on both sides act like he's a ****ing wizard or something. he's a middle of the road corporatist who generally focuses on the wrong issues, like gun control. his health care law was lukewarm, he extended the patriot act, and now he's getting us even more involved in the Middle East when we should be pulling out. as for Russia, like i said, if they're stupid enough to get bogged down in Syria trying to help their buddy, let them. Putin is supposed to be a USSR fan, but he sure must not have given much thought to one of the major reasons that the state failed. we should be smarter than that. our goal should be replacing oil and fossil fuels, and then we can get out of the Middle East.

annata said:
Before you dismiss this as "so what", it's important to understand every president since Nasser has been in agreement to
keep Russia bottled up out of the ME. All that's changed under Obama
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the Middle East is Saudi Arabia's problem. we shouldn't be acting as regional hegemon for free, or even for hire. once we pull out, it's someone else's job. sounds good to me.
 
Helix said:
save me the Obama bull****. people on both sides act like he's a ****ing wizard or something. he's a middle of the road corporatist who generally focuses on the wrong issues, like gun control. his health care law was lukewarm, he extended the patriot act, and now he's getting us even more involved in the Middle East when we should be pulling out. as for Russia, like i said, if they're stupid enough to get bogged down in Syria trying to help their buddy, let them. Putin is supposed to be a USSR fan, but he sure must not have given much thought to one of the major reasons that the state failed. we should be smarter than that. our goal should be replacing oil and fossil fuels, and then we can get out of the Middle East.



the Middle East is Saudi Arabia's problem. we shouldn't be acting as regional hegemon for free, or even for hire. once we pull out, it's someone else's job. sounds good to me.
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we pull out we lose influence, Russia sets the agenda. this is what Obama has accomplished.
If you think Russian support of Hezbollah/Iran ( largest state sponsor of terrorism) and loss of Sunni partnerships is a good idea
so be it.
Every president before Obama disagrees.
 
MadLib said:
Let's not overplay the significance of Russia's intervention. Despite Putin's posturing, Russia is still a second-rate power at best, and even if we don't respond in a manner geared towards undermining the Russian effort, the Gulf states will. There are a maximum of 40 Russian planes in Syria (along with Hinds), and that number could very well decrease when Saudi MANPADs start reaching the rebels. Russian support for Putin may be high now, but if Russians start coming home in body bags, that will probably begin to change (hence the dubious claim of a Russian soldier "committing suicide" in Syria). As far as Obama's attitude goes, I can understand his preference for a non-confrontational approach to situations like this, but he's not afraid to up the ante if need be - and it is Russia who ultimately cannot afford to escalate.
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how is he going to "up the ante?" he has no cards to play in Syria, with due respect he's shut out of any influence there.
Russia's "2nd rate power" is more then enough to support Assad. It might be 2nd rate compared to the US, but it's still a superpower.

Gulf states are making deals with Russia,same as Egypt. They don't trust the US anymore, we sell them out for no strategic reason.
Obama is a dithering fool.
 
annata said:
we pull out we lose influence, Russia sets the agenda. this is what Obama has accomplished.
If you think Russian support of Hezbollah/Iran ( largest state sponsor of terrorism) and loss of Sunni partnerships is a good idea
so be it.
Every president before Obama disagrees.
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We should work to replace oil instead. That would have a greater impact on the region than Russia. As for wars, I support ending them and bringing the troops home.
 
todua_n said:
Okay, so Russia was recently involved in Middle East conflict against ISIS. There were several about Russian successful air strikes. For example,
Russian Army General Staff: Russia conducted more than 600 sorties against 380 ISIS positions in Syria since Sep 30 - News Front

In this article it is said that since 30th September there were made 600 sorties against 380 ISIS positions. For two weeks.

There are different on Russia's performance in Syria. US says Russia is not fighting against ISIS:
'More than 90%' of Russian airstrikes in Syria have not targeted Isis, US says | World news | The Guardian

US experts claim that Russia is not ready to lead the war against ISIS:
Harsh conditions are foiling Russian jets in Syria » Bulletin Leader

However, Iraq is willing to request Russia's military help:
Isis in Iraq: Shia leaders want Russian air strikes for battle against militant threat | Middle East | News | The Independent
So, these are contradictory data on Russia's performance against ISIS. US says Russia can't cope, while there are messages in the press about successful air strikes. Moreover, people, who live in that area are admitting Russia's ability to fight against ISIS.

On the other hand, US is being at war with ISIS for more than a year. And throughout this period ISIS grew, acquiring more territory. However, there could be reasons for that. So who is better?
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Kind of a ridiculous question considering that the Islamic State formed and has strengthened because of the policies of two US presidencies! Should be obvious that Russia is doing more/better.
 
annata said:
we pull out we lose influence, Russia sets the agenda. this is what Obama has accomplished.
If you think Russian support of Hezbollah/Iran ( largest state sponsor of terrorism) and loss of Sunni partnerships is a good idea
so be it.
Every president before Obama disagrees.
Click to expand...

However, Syria has always been Russia's agenda by virtue of being their ally. It seems to me that Obama never received an authorisation to use force in Syria from the UNSC, nor did he receive it from congress or the American people. It makes far more sense that the US does get itself out of where it does not belong.
 
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Obama's policies are a fail.
 
annata said:
how is he going to "up the ante?" he has no cards to play in Syria, with due respect he's shut out of any influence there.
Russia's "2nd rate power" is more then enough to support Assad. It might be 2nd rate compared to the US, but it's still a superpower.

Gulf states are making deals with Russia,same as Egypt. They don't trust the US anymore, we sell them out for no strategic reason.
Obama is a dithering fool.
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Howdy annata! Russia is indeed a power in the ME, but the US hasn't been trusted for some time now, we're a shrinking superpower, it's what comes with abuse of power and it includes, but certainly isn't limited to Obama.
 
American said:
original.gif


Obama's policies are a fail.
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USFP has been a failure in the ME for a few decades. It's been a bi-partisan effort but one must be objective to notice.
 
Montecresto said:
USFP has been a failure in the ME for a few decades. It's been a bi-partisan effort but one must be objective to notice.
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That may be true to varying degrees, but there is no gif like this to represent it. :lol:
 
Montecresto said:
Howdy annata! Russia is indeed a power in the ME, but the US hasn't been trusted for some time now, we're a shrinking superpower, it's what comes with abuse of power and it includes, but certainly isn't limited to Obama.
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hey . how's it going?
 
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