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Why don't cops render first aid to suspects?

Skeptic Bob

Skeptic Bob

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Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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Good question. Ask their union reps.
 
They do just let them bleed out since an ambulance is on the way.

I guess like sending flowers to someone you ran over with your car is an expression of guilt, thus can be used against you, police must feel rendering aid might be an act of trying reverse the shooting bringing into question if it should have happened at all.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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If you shoot someone and they survive, chances are you will be taken to the cleaner, sued and lose the house.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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Unsure, but theoretically they should all be given some amount of basic emergency response training to maybe help stabilize an individual before the bleed out in front of them and the duty to render aid when safe for them to approach a wounded suspect.

But essentially, the People are not considered human, just a perp, just a guy who needed to be shot for some reason, and then such flippant regard given to their humanity after being shot by government agent. However, we are no longer in a world where the government considers our humanity or dignity.
 
The shooter is probably too amped up and emotionally wrought to focus their attention on something like that.
 
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BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects?
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1) They are trying to secure the scene

2) Adrenaline rush = not exactly attentive to injured suspect, can result in ignoring the harm

3) It is one more thing they have to do

4) Most of the time, they'd have to work on gunshot wounds; that is not standard First Aid and requires speciality training (which is easy to forget if you don't do it all the time)

5) Lots of officers get First Aid training once, with few repeats

6) It's not policy

7) They don't have the proper equipment (esp. for gunshot wounds)

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/22/u...g-in-the-moments-after-a-police-shooting.html
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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I used to think they were required but they're not. It makes sense to me because you don't know who has communicable diseases. I wish they were required to call for first aid ASAP. Many times with these shootings the cops will just stand around for a few minutes shouting at dying people to "drop their weapon". Then after they're done cuffing a slowly dying person they'll hang around and talk sometimes even to make sure they get their stories straight. Then they'll call for help after nearly 15 minutes or so.
 
backpacker said:
The shooter is probably too amped up and emotionally wrought to focus their attention on something like that.
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It's most likely steroids they cops are amped up on.
 
Dead people don't testify against you
 
backpacker said:
The shooter is probably too amped up and emotionally wrought to focus their attention on something like that.
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I can understand that but so often cops who weren't involved in the shooting or who show up before the ambulance do nothing either.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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I'm willing to hazard a couple of reasons that probably lay that the core of the issue.

1. They have to keep the scene secured (which may not be an issue if there are multiple officers present).

2. They are operating in an official capacity. They are not properly trained experts to be treating serious injuries, which may result in more harm than help. Further we live in a very litigious environment so those who are operating in an official capacity, who are not fully fully trained, would probably result in in a law suit, no matter how it turns out.
 
BrewerBob said:
I can understand that but so often cops who weren't involved in the shooting or who show up before the ambulance do nothing either.
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Fishking said:
I'm willing to hazard a couple of reasons that probably lay that the core of the issue.

1. They have to keep the scene secured (which may not be an issue if there are multiple officers present).

2. They are operating in an official capacity. They are not properly trained experts to be treating serious injuries, which may result in more harm than help. Further we live in a very litigious environment so those who are operating in an official capacity, who are not fully fully trained, would probably result in in a law suit, no matter how it turns out.
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Lack of training and lack of equipment seem to be a factor as well. I guess other than press on the wound, there isn't a whole lot the officer could do. Police involved shootings in my area are pretty rare to begin with, but the fire department first responders can be in most places in a matter of a few minutes which is somewhat reassuring. Unlike a lot of cities, our FD runs a top-notch medical side to their operations with lots of equipment/tools/drugs/training at their disposal. They are not jerk and run types. I have heard an ER doctor say that if the FD couldn't revive them, then odds are they wouldn't be able to either.
 
Probably for the same reasons EMTs don't conduct drug raids. In the same way the citizenry is often encouraged to rely on and call the police in every situation rather than rely on themselves, it very well could be department policy to call the people specially trained to handle injuries. I don't think that it has only to do with suspects either.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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" I have seen it again and again and again and again and..."
Nonsense. You sound like Donald Trump with your fantasies aobut what you've seen. Police officers are not EMTs and don't have extensive training in first aid but I have certainly seen them help injured people.

Of course, if they do help an injured person they will almost certainly receive a notice of intent to sue.
 
BrewerBob said:
Why aren't police required to render First Aid to suspects? I have seen it again and again and again and again and...

Police have an altercation with a suspect and the suspect is badly wounded, perhaps shot. The police handcuff the person (understandable) and then just leave the person there on the ground bleeding out for minutes. If a police officer walks up on a person who is NOT a suspect who is in immediate need of first aid the cop renders it until the paramedics show up.

Why is this allowed? People are bringing it up in regards to the Tulsa shooting but it happens ALL the time. Once the suspect has been subdued what is the reason for standing there watching them die while the ambulance en route? Cops are trained in first aid, after all.
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Watch the body cam video released by Charlotte-Meck Police.... the officer wearing the body cam did indeed begin to render first aid to the suspect.

So.., I am uninterested in your claim that this doesn't happen because in a few shootings you have seen it didn't happen.
 
X Factor said:
Probably for the same reasons EMTs don't conduct drug raids. In the same way the citizenry is often encouraged to rely on and call the police in every situation rather than rely on themselves, it very well could be department policy to call the people specially trained to handle injuries. I don't think that it has only to do with suspects either.
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Well, requiring them to do something could mean little more than requiring them to keep pressure on gunshot or stab wounds, or give CPR to someone who stopped breathing, for example. One doesn't need much in the way of expertise for that.
 
Police are trained to give aid to the injured.

But if a guy just shot you or at you, you're pretty amped up. Your adrenaline shoots through the roof. The officer is usually in shock and needs his own medical help.

And every police academy teaches to handcuff the suspect after he's down. Even if his head is missing, you handcuff him. It's their training and the media makes a big deal of it. The same media that can't understand why the police just didn't try to shoot the pistol out of his hand.
 
Patrickt said:
" I have seen it again and again and again and again and..."
Nonsense. You sound like Donald Trump with your fantasies aobut what you've seen. Police officers are not EMTs and don't have extensive training in first aid but I have certainly seen them help injured people.

Of course, if they do help an injured person they will almost certainly receive a notice of intent to sue.
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People attempting to give aid are protected by the Good Samaritan law which offer legal protection to people who give reasonable assistance to those who are, or who they believe to be, injured, ill, in peril, or otherwise incapacitated.

I can't believe the police don't have some emergency training as they sometimes are the first one on to an injured person. As Backpacker stated above about the great training the FD has, I would be shocked if there isn't some type of emergency medical training for the police.
 
Crosscheck said:
I can't believe the police don't have some emergency training as they sometimes are the first one on to an injured person. As Backpacker stated above about the great training the FD has, I would be shocked if there isn't some type of emergency medical training for the police.
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Every police academy teaches first aid and CPR. The police are first responders.

But after a shooting, the officers' heads may not be in a a capable state. I've been in some terrifying situations, and you lose focus afterwards. You're in a daze. In shock.
 
Hmmm, I keep hearing everyone comment on the original question/claim as if it is true. Strange since I have seen cops personally render aid to those they just had to shoot or were injured while fighting or running. Heck watch some of the many filmed cops chases and incidents and you will see them helping the perps on a regular basis. Do all of them do it, no, I would think they have other duties to be attended to and often the injuries are not something they are trained or equipped to deal with. Is the suggestion that cops become Cops/EMT's? Ludicrous.
 
Casper said:
Hmmm, I keep hearing everyone comment on the original question/claim as if it is true. Strange since I have seen cops personally render aid to those they just had to shoot or were injured while fighting or running. Heck watch some of the many filmed cops chases and incidents and you will see them helping the perps on a regular basis. Do all of them do it, no, I would think they have other duties to be attended to and often the injuries are not something they are trained or equipped to deal with. Is the suggestion that cops become Cops/EMT's? Ludicrous.
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I wouldn't expect cops to perform an intubation on a person but they should be able to do very simple first aid such as stopping bleeding or basic CPR.
 
Crosscheck said:
I wouldn't expect cops to perform an intubation on a person but they should be able to do very simple first aid such as stopping bleeding or basic CPR.
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And many do. Your point, to force them to render aid?
 
I was walking from court and a car hit a bicyclist ten feet from me. She flew in the air and crashed to the pavement. Her wrist was obviously broken. I knew an ambulance would arrive in a couple of minutes so I comforted her and enouraged her not to move. A lot of "first aid" instruction is predicated on no medical care being available. That is never the case with police officers.

I investigated a case where the coroner listed the cause of death as improperly applied chest compression when police officers were administering CPR to an accident victim. Lawyers were already giving each other high-fives when the coroners report was known. A quick investigation revealed that no police officers did CPR. No ambulance personnel did CPR. CPR was only done in the emergency room when the patient's heart stopped. So, of course, the coroner changed the cause of death.
 
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Liability issues mainly.


I've been out of LE a rather long time so I don't know what current policy is, and no doubt it varies from dept to dept, but liability is probably at the root of it.


TMK every police officer receives training and certs in CPR and First Aid. If you're certified, then once you begin treatment on an individual you are LIABLE for proper care.


Problem is, having a first aid and cpr course at the Academy and an occasional refresher does NOT make you an EMT or a Paramedic. Rendering medical aid is not the primary mission of most LE agencies. You really don't get enough training and practice to be actually competent at it.


Thus, the liability risks are high. I imagine some dept's discourage rendering first aid if EMS is one the way for this reason.
 
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