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White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland[W:97]

RogueWarrior

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https://www.facebook.com/peter.jarrettschell/posts/10153568341817146
Calvary Episcopal Church, Washington, DC | Episcopal Church

Any effing excuse to pull you over, hoping for drugs.
Not sure which state this is. Virginia or North Carolina I guess.



While driving on the first leg of our road trip to Florida, with my wife, my son and my brother-in-law, I noticed a white dodge charger in my rear view, tailgating me. After a couple minutes, I moved into the left lane to let him pass. He followed me. Then he turned on the flashing lights of the, now revealed undercover car. I pulled to the shoulder. I've been stopped by police before (always for traffic violations that were my fault.) However, several things immediately seemed unusual about this stop.
One. Two officers emerged from their car, and approached ours from the passenger side, where my brother was sitting. The lead officer knocked at his window, and asked first for his license, not mine.
Two. After checking my license as well, and the registration of our rental car, and after the officer informed me he was only giving me a warning for changing lanes without signalling (He was correct,) he asked me to step out of the car. While his partner stood by our car, he walked me back to their patrol car, and asked me what I had in my pockets (keys, a wallet, and my phone.)
Three. He asked me to take a seat in their car, and closed the door behind me. He took his seat on the driver's side, turned and began to ask me questions:

"How do you know the other people in that car?"

"They're my family: my wife, son, and brother in law."
"Where are you going?"
"To Florida on vacation. We might stop in Augusta, Georgia, to visit my wife's father."
"Where does he live in Augusta?
"Honestly, I couldn't tell you."
"Where did you come from?"
"Washington."
"What time did you leave out?"
"Around eleven, I think."
"Why did it take you so long?"
"There was traffic all the way from Quantico to Norfolk."
"Where did you rent the car?"
"In Maryland."
"From which rental company?"
"I don't know, my brother rented it."
"Are you driving straight through to Florida?"
"No, we're stopping in Fayetteville for the night."
"Why?"
"My son is two. He needs a break."
"Is your license valid?"
"Yes."
"If I checked your vehicle, would I find anything illegal?"
"No."
"No marijuana, or cocaine?"
"No."
Four. As I answered, I noticed his partner was leaning in the rear passenger side window, where my son was sitting. His hand was on his belt.
Five. After asking me these questions, he left the car, and went to talk with my family. I checked the door handle, to see if I could open it from the inside and get out, in case... of something. In retrospect, this could have been a mistake. Thankfully nothing happened. It wouldn't open, anyway.
Six. After talking with Ron and Rondesia, he conferred with his partner for several minutes. The gestured vaguely to me, and to our car.
Seven. He came back to the car. He wanted to talk again.
"Well, I'm confused. I talked to your "wife" and her story doesn't match yours."
I could hear the quotation marks in his voice.
"She just said you were going to Florida. She didn't mention her dad, or Georgia."
"We haven't decided if we're stopping on the way down, or the way back."
"She also said she was visiting her cousins in Fayetteville. You said you were just going to stop for the night."
"We are just stopping for the night. She has family there, so we're having dinner with them."
He paused.
"You seem nervous. Why are you nervous?"
"I'm nervous because you separated me from my family. I'm nervous because your partner is hovering over them. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but there have been a lot of high profile incidents of police killing black people in the last few months. And you partner has his hand resting on his belt, near his pistol. So yes, I'm nervous."
That's what I thought. That's what I wanted to say. But the angels of discretion (or perhaps those of cowardice) kept me quiet.
"No, I'm not nervous."
"Hm."
He checked our information on the computer for several minutes in silence. Then he called in the details to double check. Finally, he said I could go, and reminded me to signal when I change lanes.
"Thank you officer."
I walked back to the car, and waited for the police car to pull away. We compared details, analyzed, and then drove in silence until we arrived at the hotel.
We unloaded the car. I held my son. Rondesia and I hugged.
"I love you."
"I love you too."
"I was so scared for you."
"I was scared for you."
I don't remember who said which words. But my wife spoke last.
"Well" she said, "welcome to the club."

And then I realized. None of these things were unusual. Not even a little bit.

Love the bolded part. Just wait your time is coming too.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

'Meruca land of the free to answer needless questions on command.
Notwithstanding your abbreviated nonsense ...

Those type of questions happen to be very successful in helping to weed out those who are not deserving of further attention.
So no, they are not needless.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

https://www.facebook.com/peter.jarrettschell/posts/10153568341817146
Calvary Episcopal Church, Washington, DC | Episcopal Church

Any effing excuse to pull you over, hoping for drugs.
Not sure which state this is. Virginia or North Carolina I guess.

Love the bolded part. Just wait your time is coming too.
Why do fathers of black families have to be white men? Why can't black men fulfill this roll?

Anyway, notice he didn't assault and/or run from the cops, and everything turned out fine. Blacks should take note.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

So the good pastor is going to file a complaint (according to the subsequent comments). Could a law$uit be too far behind?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

https://www.facebook.com/peter.jarrettschell/posts/10153568341817146
Calvary Episcopal Church, Washington, DC | Episcopal Church

Any effing excuse to pull you over, hoping for drugs.
Not sure which state this is. Virginia or North Carolina I guess.

Love the bolded part. Just wait your time is coming too.

On the fence on this one.

Best I can tell from the story the officer broke no laws, the line of questioning is rather common in trying to determine if this is a simple traffic stop or something else, and the usual tactic is to separate those in the car to see if everyone's story matches.

That does not mean that it cannot be a little unnerving to deal with a couple of officers looking for criminal activity.

Usually I would be critical of officers who have the mindset that everyone they pull over is a criminal, everyone is suspect no matter how they answer questions, and because this nation's police officers kill so many people yearly in comparison to other nations you generally are not safe.

However here it looks like a routine traffic stop ended in no citation, no harm, and no actions that question someone's civil liberties. The questions the officer asked are not unreasonable and it does not appear like they were detained for all that long. The kids were not trapped by questioning, nor did anyone appear from the story to be physically harmed, nor does it sound like either officer drew their weapons.

Unless there is more to the story, what is wrong here?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

On the fence on this one.

Best I can tell from the story the officer broke no laws, the line of questioning is rather common in trying to determine if this is a simple traffic stop or something else, and the usual tactic is to separate those in the car to see if everyone's story matches.

That does not mean that it cannot be a little unnerving to deal with a couple of officers looking for criminal activity.

Usually I would be critical of officers who have the mindset that everyone they pull over is a criminal, everyone is suspect no matter how they answer questions, and because this nation's police officers kill so many people yearly in comparison to other nations you generally are not safe.

However here it looks like a routine traffic stop ended in no citation, no harm, and no actions that question someone's civil liberties. The questions the officer asked are not unreasonable and it does not appear like they were detained for all that long. The kids were not trapped by questioning, nor did anyone appear from the story to be physically harmed, nor does it sound like either officer drew their weapons.

Unless there is more to the story, what is wrong here?

I agree. The officer broke no laws. Seems a tad excessive for failing to signal. And one wonders if the pastor had exercised his 5th ammendment right....
Every time I have ever been stopped for a moving violation, it is license, registration and proof of insurance. You <broke this rule>, sit tight I will be back in a few minutes. The LEO comes back hands me my stuff. End of story.

It seems to me that certain people always get extra. Is it racism? Is it profiling? Is it bullying? Is it quotas? Is it promotional giveaways (no joke here)?

All the posters so far don't seem to mind that everything else they asked is none of they damned business. And there would have been consequences to exercising your 5th ammendment right; and there shouldn't be...
except in LEOland where no answer means you are not giving them the respect they have been taught that they deserve.

I hate bullies.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Notwithstanding your abbreviated nonsense ...

Those type of questions happen to be very successful in helping to weed out those who are not deserving of further attention.
So no, they are not needless.

Assuming the story is true. Really? Is it necessary to separate family members and grill them after a simple lane change violation? Ummm, no. There is absolutely no reason to grill them about where they are going, where they are coming from, and every detail of the rest of their trip. If the officer notices anything out of the ordinary while approaching the car, and while running the license and registration, then fine, proceed further. If not, the rest of that mumbo jumbo is none of his ****ing business. We do still have freedom to move about in this country without being interrogated and hassled by the cops. Not sure why you would advocate such nonsense.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Why do fathers of black families have to be white men? Why can't black men fulfill this roll?

WTF? None of your business. What an utterly idiotic thing to say.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

WTF? None of your business. What an utterly idiotic thing to say.
If it's a private matter then I don't know why OP made a thread about it.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

If it's a private matter then I don't know why OP made a thread about it.

It was still an idiotic, racist comment on your part. The racial makeup of a family is none of your business.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

It was still an idiotic, racist comment on your part. The racial makeup of a family is none of your business.
Then why is race in the thread title?

Why does OP highlight the wife saying "welcome to the club"?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Then why is race in the thread title?

Why does OP highlight the wife saying "welcome to the club"?
What does that have to do with your unrelated comment?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

What does that have to do with your unrelated comment?
The only thing this thread is about is race. You seem to have missed that so I'm trying to gently guide you back on topic. So, since OP thinks the race of the father as compared to the rest of the family is very relevant, why does the father of black families have to be a white man? Why do black men have such a difficult time filling that roll? Do you think their absence is in any way related to the amount of blacks in prison as compared to other races? Do you think the absence of black fathers is related to the higher black-on-black crime as compared to other races? Why is it so difficult for black men to simply....not assault cops...resulting in their death? All they have to do, is don't. It's so simple, but black men can't do it, so white men have to become the fathers of these black families.

And when these white fathers of black families get pulled over, guess what? They don't assault, or run from, the cops. And they live to continue being the white father of the black family.
 
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Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Does it say anywhere that they were looking for someone matching this guy's description?
I understand that this can be very annoying, even more so when you are on the road and tired. But what? Do we know what the cops are looking for, do we know all circumstances or are we raking the cops over the coals by this man's account alone?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

I could never be that accommodating to a LEO, even if I did have family still sitting in the car. When he asked "what do you have in your pockets?", I believe that was item two, I would have stopped talking.

When pulled over, you do not have to agree to have your person, or your car searched. They can only do that after arresting you and bringing you to the jail house.

Of course, they can drum up an idiot charge, run you in, and hold you for 48 hours. That gives you two whole days to plot out the assassination of officer Doe. I'd wait a couple of years. Revenge dish served cold.

The only proper response to "what do you have in your pockets?", is "Am I free to go"?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

I will note that the stretch of i95 between SC and NC is TERRIBLE with this kind of stuff. I hear it all the time. It is also a route for drugs (pills especially).

Anyway. When driving 95 I'm always careful about this, but I'm sure there is more to this story. I know that rental cars are stolen frequently...especially in that area. I wonder if that is part of it?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

I could never be that accommodating to a LEO, even if I did have family still sitting in the car. When he asked "what do you have in your pockets?", I believe that was item two, I would have stopped talking.

When pulled over, you do not have to agree to have your person, or your car searched. They can only do that after arresting you and bringing you to the jail house.

Of course, they can drum up an idiot charge, run you in, and hold you for 48 hours. That gives you two whole days to plot out the assassination of officer Doe. I'd wait a couple of years. Revenge dish served cold.

The only proper response to "what do you have in your pockets?", is "Am I free to go"?

So you would plot out killing cops. Sigh

You realize you still have a legal avenue, and that avenue is getting stronger? As far as what your potential responses might be:

After Cops Cross "Thin Blue Line," City Shuts Down Entire Corrupt Police Department - The Anti-Media

Stow it. They shut the whole **** hole down. I drove that area a lot and they were a pain in the ass and scumbags.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

He admitted to the traffic violation, cooperated and nothing happened. Go figure.

At what point should we, American citizens, start resisting in your opinion?
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

I will note that the stretch of i95 between SC and NC is TERRIBLE with this kind of stuff. I hear it all the time. It is also a route for drugs (pills especially).

Anyway. When driving 95 I'm always careful about this, but I'm sure there is more to this story. I know that rental cars are stolen frequently...especially in that area. I wonder if that is part of it?

Hah! They featured that stretch on one of the drug interdiction shows on Nat Geo. The police look specifically for rental cars.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

At what point should we, American citizens, start resisting in your opinion?

Resisting what? Absolutely nothing happened to these folks.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Notwithstanding your abbreviated nonsense ...

Those type of questions happen to be very successful in helping to weed out those who are not deserving of further attention.
So no, they are not needless.

He was not obligated to answer those questions.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

So you would plot out killing cops. Sigh

You realize you still have a legal avenue, and that avenue is getting stronger? As far as what your potential responses might be:

After Cops Cross "Thin Blue Line," City Shuts Down Entire Corrupt Police Department - The Anti-Media

Stow it. They shut the whole **** hole down. I drove that area a lot and they were a pain in the ass and scumbags.

I was seriously hoping that my refusal to tell what was in my pockets would not result in my arrest. Yeah, that's the way it would have gone down.
 
Re: White pastor pulled over just like Ms Bland

Resisting what? Absolutely nothing happened to these folks.

Maybe I should restate, because clearly you didn't understand the question.

At what point do we start refusing to do what law enforcement is requesting of you to do?
 
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