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I'll give a nod of approval to President Obama.

Howler63

Howler63

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Howler63 said:
Probably not a bad idea, but typical liberal 'feel good' pablum.
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A fine idea, if the global structure of security is correct. Given the present structure, it would increase the probability of global war and the use of nuclear and other weapons of mass destruction. So speaking of nuclear disarmanament is dangerous, as it awakens desires that are not safe and demands by other powers to disarm stupidly.
 
Howler63 said:
I had claimed earlier that he would apologize to Japan for the A-Bombs, but he did no such thing. He was a perfect statesman today without being a toady of the politically correct contingent.

Sympathy for victims but no apology as Obama makes historic Hiroshima visit

He expressed sympathy, but offered no apology. Well done, Mr. President.
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I tend to agree, all things considered this was a well handled event. I do not even mind Obama using the opportunity to call for ending nations having these sort of weapons (even though we know that is not going to happen anytime soon.)
 
It's very possible that Hiroshima/Nagasaki actually saved Japanese lives versus the cost from an invasion. And it certainly saved American lives. So an apology would not make much sense in this situation.
 
DifferentDrummr said:
It's very possible that Hiroshima/Nagasaki actually saved Japanese lives versus the cost from an invasion. And it certainly saved American lives. So an apology would not make much sense in this situation.
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Absolutely. Plus the Japanese were really nasty SOB's in WWII. Luckily for them, the Germans were worse. But the Japs were brutal and vicious and deserved whatever they got.
 
Fletch said:
Absolutely. Plus the Japanese were really nasty SOB's in WWII. Luckily for them, the Germans were worse. But the Japs were brutal and vicious and deserved whatever they got.
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What they deserved was an enemy that attempted to maximize their casualties, just like in any other war. No more, no less, and nothing personal.
 
DifferentDrummr said:
It's very possible that Hiroshima/Nagasaki actually saved Japanese lives versus the cost from an invasion. And it certainly saved American lives. So an apology would not make much sense in this situation.
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Fletch said:
Absolutely. Plus the Japanese were really nasty SOB's in WWII. Luckily for them, the Germans were worse. But the Japs were brutal and vicious and deserved whatever they got.
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It is bigger than that. The US issuing an apology for using atomic bombs ignores how we all ended up at that decision. It ignores Japan's actions throughout and it also ignores ours up to that point. It takes one event, removes all context, and by apology re-qualifying the event in today's standards.

I would argue it would be a meaningless apology, what we should be focusing on is how quickly we went from that sort of total hatred of the enemy to economic and diplomatic conditions of today between the US and Japan. We do that and no one has to apologize for anything that we really cannot go back and make changes for anyway.
 
Agreed. If the PM of Japan was to issue an apology for Pearl Harbor or Bataan or Nanking, would it have any real meaning at this point? No.
 
Howler63 said:
Probably not a bad idea, but typical liberal 'feel good' pablum.
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And that's all it is.
There is NOTHING wrong with a liberal expressing a desire to rid the world of nuke weapons.
Conservatives would not be faulted for the same wish either.
And isn't it amazing that most on both sides regretfully acknowledge that it is all but impossible.

Still, it's noble for him to call for such a thing anyway.
He's just expressing what any peace loving leader wishes for fellow human beings.
 
DifferentDrummr said:
What they deserved was an enemy that attempted to maximize their casualties, just like in any other war. No more, no less, and nothing personal.
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No, they deserved far worse. They simply lucked out that the enemy they surrendered to was America.
 
joG said:
A fine idea, if the global structure of security is correct. Given the present structure, it would increase the probability of global war and the use of nuclear and other weapons of mass destruction. So speaking of nuclear disarmanament is dangerous, as it awakens desires that are not safe and demands by other powers to disarm stupidly.
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It awakens them on a purely spiritual level so it's not dangerous.
Maybe, just maybe it might spur other leaders to reflect on working for peace a lot more.
That's about it, because most leaders, liberal and conservative alike, recognize that the global structure of security is nigh well F**KED.
 
But hey, thanks to everyone for recognizing that Barack is just doing normal diplomatic stuff.
That really is all he's doing. Japan has some important work to do, and all of it had already been discussed in numerous prior meetings, so this was just a formal state visit to plant seeds in the minds of the people.
When Japanese people see a foreign leader express gentle and compassionate thoughts on peace, it's a helpful thing.
We're in a world where present and possible future leaders are all too eager to publish nonsensical bombast, so on our part, the notion of putting away the so called "Ugly American" tropes has a beneficial effect on our neighbors.

It is doubtful that anything he said or did will be inflated into anything more than just a civil exchange of pleasantries as he leaves office.
 
I'm sure Mr. Obama had the white house's press secretary constantly refreshing the forum for the past two days waiting for this thread.
 
Fletch said:
No, they deserved far worse. They simply lucked out that the enemy they surrendered to was America.
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Their 'luck' was more a case of our 'ally' The Soviet union was seen as a bigger threat than the two crushed nations- Germany and Japan.

How quickly we went from hating the genocidal nazis and sneaky dirty japs to hating our WWII ally- the one who broke the nazi military strength- the USSR with Germany and Japan now being out strong 'friends' and allies for decades... :peace
 
Checkerboard Strangler said:
And isn't it amazing that most on both sides regretfully acknowledge that it is all but impossible.
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Of course they 'regretfully' acknowledge such a thing.
The collective ego of world leaders would never allow them to relinquish the stranglehold they have on our planet and our species via this MADness.
 
Abbazorkzog said:
Of course they 'regretfully' acknowledge such a thing.
The collective ego of world leaders would never allow them to relinquish the stranglehold they have on our planet and our species via this MADness.
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Ironically, without MAD the world probably never would have lasted this long. :)
 
Tigerace117 said:
Ironically, without MAD the world probably never would have lasted this long. :)
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The magazine? lol

And kudos to the President. I'll have to take back what I said in another thread though which I think I can still blame him for that evil man!!!
All kidding aside, I'm glad his visit to Japan went better than Cuba.
 
Ntharotep said:
The magazine? lol

And kudos to the President. I'll have to take back what I said in another thread though which I think I can still blame him for that evil man!!!
All kidding aside, I'm glad his visit to Japan went better than Cuba.
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Mutually Assured Destruction, as you well know :roll:
 
Tigerace117 said:
Have you known humanity to not use a weapon in their arsenal if they knew they could get away with it without retaliation?
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No, and that is exactly why President Obama is absolutely right about disarmament.
 
notquiteright said:
Their 'luck' was more a case of our 'ally' The Soviet union was seen as a bigger threat than the two crushed nations- Germany and Japan.

How quickly we went from hating the genocidal nazis and sneaky dirty japs to hating our WWII ally- the one who broke the nazi military strength- the USSR with Germany and Japan now being out strong 'friends' and allies for decades... :peace
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The US and USSR were shotgun partners to begin with.
 
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