Awesome!

They work their brains hard too going to college, working admin jobs. A great example in my opinion. I like immigrants.

NatoREal

I only try as hard as the situation merits.

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"The individual act of obedience is the cornerstone not only of the strength of authoritarian society but also of its weakness."

Rogue

Well, these, future Democratic voters if amnestied, illegals are poor, mostly Mexican poverty rejects, uneducated, low skilled, don't speak English and most certainly fit a Democratic demographic voter block. Most, future Democratic voters if amnestied, illegals work unskilled jobs and are below the poverty level and, most, certainly would qualify for welfare if amnestied. Up to 20 million, future Democratic voters if amnestied, illegals would fully embrace the welfare promises offered by hispandering Democratic politicians, which would bankrupt welfare as we know it.

Rogue

Which one is gnat?

talloulou

I don't think the answer is a simple yes or no nor is it a constant. The further people get in life the less willing they are to move backwards. So it's all about negotiating and whether you'll negotiate to do this for that greatly depends on whether that moves you forward or backwards.

So if you can get paid said amount of $$$ for said amount of hard work and this is a step up for you it's likely you will accept that and be happy about it. However if the negotiated price is a step down for you then you won't be happy about it and might not accept it which is how you should be.

So conflict arises when you have groups where negotiations lead to steps up for some populations but great steps backwards for others. The people moving forward aren't harder workers than the other guy per se they are just situated on the ladder in a manner that they're moving up thus they're more content with doing more for less. The guy expected to move down, and he will have to move down the ladder to compete with the guys coming up, will be stressed and wondering how it is that someone stole his cheese. His best bet is to go find new cheese and keep moving up the ladder, never looking back but often there's lots of biatching involved.

It's human nature. If you clean toilets for $10 dollars a day and a population of folks move in who only got say $3 a day where they use to live these folks are gonna negotiate to happily clean toilets for $6 dollars a day. They are gonna win every competition with you provided they clean toilets as well as you do and they're gonna take your job. You'd be a fool to go from making $10 a day to $6 a day. Of course it's gonna make you mad. But you can't do anything about it so you might as well view it as bygones and broaden your horizons. I can no longer move up cleaning toilets so what am I going to do now?

This doesn't just apply to manual labor. My husband deals with this. He's had to constantly adjust and adapt because computer programmers in other countries are getting better and driving the cost of what he does down. He can't compete with them because they're moving up and he refuses to move backwards. So he has to come up with new ways to continue going in an upwards direction. Sitting around biatching about Indians in India doing programming on the cheap might make him feel better but it doesn't help his situation.

Do guys in India work harder than my husband? Not really. They just are happy and content with negotiations that he wouldn't be because they are moving up and their forward momentum forces him to have to adapt or risk being brought down.

Bodhisattva

Is it hard walking uphill your entire life?

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Kali

This whole crap about illegals take jobs legal citizens will not take is one of the biggest lies being spread because it is total bull****.

Bodhisattva

It is not only NOT one of the biggest lies...
ILLEGAL Immigrants also devalue the monetary value of a job by taking jobs at a lessar than market rate.

It has been documented by no less than 60 Minutes.

Awesome!

That is the reality of globalization. What's worse an entire industry going to China that pays .30 cents an hour or illegals that keep the cost of produce down because they will work for minimum wage or less than minimum wage?Yes, I know they are illegal which is wrong and the government needs to control it. That's not what I'm talking about.

My point is that most Americans will not work these jobs even with a fair wage. I've asked many times to name your wage to pick fruit or landscape, or work in a meat packing plant. Not you personally, but to say that Americans what these jobs is absurd, and why would you want these jobs in the first place when labor is one of the biggest things that will be outsourced? Get an education if you already don't have one. The days of working a labor union job to take care of your family are gone or are at risk due to globalization.

And the main governing fact is you can STILL work hard in America like these illegal immigrants and make something of yourself if you try.

Gipper

I'm an educated, skilled white-collar worker. Illegals down here help me out. As Awesome states, their cheap labor keeps costs low, and it is absolutely true that they do jobs that have employment gaps created by our own populace. You could very easily hire a teenager on summer vacation from school at minimum wage to do the jobs that Mexicans do down here. Trouble is that they don't want to. They want to work at the mall or the cell phone store or even at the Wal-Mart. Picking tomatoes and beans is beneath them.

What Awesome has said is pretty much spot-on.

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A government big enough to give you all you want is big enough to take it all away. - Barry Goldwater