RatedPanda

Should a teacher be required to be bilingual if their not teaching a foreign language? More reasons why the school system are also deteriorating, but thats a whole different argument.

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UtahBill

Get a mirror, read my post, watch your lips, read your lips. I clearly said that I cannot speak for all states, but for Arizona, Utah, Idaho, and many other western states, no teacher gets laid off except for the one instance I noted, and they just went to another nearby district. So what I said was accurate for my situation. So far nobody else has gotten their hackles up over my statement. But if YOU want to have a hissy fit, go for it...

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The Age of Reason doesn't have to be a thing of the past.
Being judgemental is the prime directive of some evangelicals.
No success can compensate for failure in the home.

1069

Bill, even the amended statement that no 'good' teacher gets laid off in Arizona, Utah, Idaho, and "many other western states" is simply preposterous, on the face of it.
It defies credulity.
Of course teachers get laid off occasionally, and you'd have to present some mighty compelling evidence to convince me that they are all "bad".

But you've explained enough about your personal situation that I understand how important it is for you to believe this. I trust the idea that lay-offs are an impossibility affords you much peace of mind.

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"I do love this idea that one can scream and scream and scream, with that utopia just one more scream away."
~ Scucca

1069

A sizable percentage of schoolchildren in the district are not fluent in English, especially at the elementary school level, and are better served by bilingual teachers, while the English speaking students are equally well-served by bilingual or monolingual teachers.
This means bilingual/ multilingual teachers are more versatile than teachers who speak only one language.
Fairly simple.

RatedPanda

Catering to their deficiencies won't solve the problem. Are the English speaking students equally well served by the bilingual staff? I hardly believe that, since plenty of the English only speaking staff are just as qualified, and sometimes more experienced, then their bilingual coworkers. The staff shouldn't have to learn Spanish, the students be learning English.

For something so simple you seem to desire complicating it.

UtahBill

What the hell do you want? Can you read my mind? Did I use an emoticon to indicate that I have an issue with bad teachers or laid off teachers? Where the hell did I even remotely indicate that I think that all of those that may have gotten laid off were bad? My wife was a teacher, my son is a teacher, my MIL was a teacher, and we have many friends who are teachers or have been teachers. They will tell you that some are bad, most are good, some are exceptional. I have experience with many teachers, how about you?
You are making stuff up. My patience with you on this thread is exhausted.
Remember the topic of the OP? We are nowhere near it. If you want to start a topic on laid off teachers, hop to it.

edited to add, I now know how Romney must have felt when the little liar McCain kept insisting that Romeny was pro timetable for Iraq. McCain made stuff up and kept at it even tho the moderator of the debate and even McCain supporters said that John was lying. If it is your intent to pick apart every statement I and others make and have a hissy fit over it, then you get to be on my short ignore list...

John1234

Actually this is a myth or at the very least its a matter of perspective.

Typically the average illegal worker works in large groups with 1 guy who knows a few words of English who negotiates the price.
They do work hard. Taking very few breaks aside from lunch.
They also work longer hours generally.

What they also typically do is provide poor quality work.
I've seen them use the wrong nails, not use enough, or use too many.
I can't say I have ever once in my life looked at one of their paint jobs and had it meet my expectations of quality.
Not in the coverage, the lines, or the neatness.
They basically do exactly what they are told without thinking for themselves or truly caring for the job they are doing.

And hey, I am not blaming them at all.
If thats all i got paid i would not even show up to begin with.
But its also important that the myth of superior workers is debunked.

Even aside from the quality, they are not working fast, there are simply 3 times more of them on the job working longer hours for less money.
And that money is not much of an issue when 10 families rent 1 apartment and take turns using it while the rest sleep at state parks and in vans.

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We are not only driving millions of Americans into sub poverty so that the rest of Americans can have services and goods cheaper, but we are also accepting lesser quality goods and services.

Every time a person says something along the lines of "Americans don't want the job" it always leads to one thing. Greed.
There is no job in existence in this country that an American would not want for the right pay.
Its almost as though the greedy elite class in this country has found a new toy.
First it was servants, then slaves, then under paid workers. Now that things started to balance out pretty well, they are switching to Mexicans and leaving the American work force in the cold.

This is not about global competition. The products and services that we use the Mexicans for are mostly things we consume right here in America.

Consider that one for a moment.
If its mostly things we consume here in America, why do we need to under cut our work force for "Global Competition"?
There is nothing global about that.

tryreading

What about the legal hispanics that work for less? They exist. I know several of them, they work on my crew. What if legal immigrants are working a job you get $16 an hour for, and they do it for $8? Then you have no argument.

Are you sure all of the Hispanic people who came to work in your area were illegal? If they were, a well placed phone call might have protected your job security and income. If certain people come around asking questions, a lot of your competition just disappears.

Now, the guys that work for me aren't actually working for less. They get the same $10 an hour anybody would get. But the people I've hired who are non-Hispanic don't stick around. To a person that has been true for me. That doesn't prove overall that they are doing a job no white/black American would do, but that's the situation on the ground in my experience. I have an all Hispanic crew (4 guys), not because that's what I want, but because they are the people who stayed on.

John1234

Your paying your crew only 2/3rds of what everyone makes in your area, yet you wonder why only immigrants stick around?
I used to start my unskilled helpers that toted buckets around at $12.
Your paying skilled tradesmen $10?

For me, this completely validates my argument that Americans do want the jobs, they are simply not willing to work for the same wage that the high school kids make in their part time job at burger king.
Burger King starts at $9.00 per hour.
You train for decades to learn and master a skill and you would think that you should make a bit more than a job someone can fully master in 5 minutes.

Your situation is a bit different though.
You clearly stated that your workers are legal.
So you are clearly not doing anything wrong in a legal way.
But when you operate a business with only 2/3 the over head of your competition I still have to wonder if your putting out the same level of quality or service.

You also live a lot closer to areas that have large amounts of legal immigrants.
In my area there are no clusters of legal immigrants.
Most all of them were illegal. My city bussed out thousands after rounding them up. To where they bused them to, i have no idea.
Now they are mostly all gone. But the housing crisis wont allow us to recover.
It will take many years if not a full decade just to sell all of the empty homes.
Empty homes with leaky roofs and terrible paint jobs.

Awesome!

Yes, adapt. You started your own business so you have a brain obviously. Your business was always on the brink even before the illegals came so maybe you need to work on marketing your business better, etc. Don't mean to sound harsh, but adapting is the reality for any business or industry, which always happens. Look around in your house, how many products are made in america? They used to at one time or another I would bet. Were so comfortable here and fail to recognize that we need to stay hungry like the legal and illegal immigrants from other countries. I live in southern california, and mexicans are getting into everything: landscaping, construction, garbage, post office etc. etc. A lot of them are legal and a lot are illegal, but they are all hungry and starting their own businesses. I would argue that they are adapting. Adapting to the American dream. We recently looked at home care facilities and 99% of them are run and owned by filipinos. Why? Because they have that desire, they are then new entrepreneurs just like you when you first started your business. Get off your soap box and get hungry again and stop complaining.