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November 22, 1963[W:29]

Re: November 22, 1963

Riveroaks said:
Every Nov 22 everyone who remembers it talks about it. It is still living history.

The Kennedy clan has all but disappeared from politics now, but the living history continues.

2013 was the big 50 year anniversary.

2023 will be the 60th. By then lots of people will still be around who remember it.

2033 the 70th. Less then.

2043 the 80th and almost nobody will remember it by then. People start to seriously lose memories in their 80's especially mid to late 80's. Only a very few will remember it then.

But for now almost everyone knows about it and a whole lot of people can still remember it and everything about it when they heard the news.

I remember the event being told to us kids around lunch at school, school then being cancelled, walking home from school with my two sisters, getting home and turning on the tv, and watching the news. Our parents were not home yet. We were latchkey kids that day. My mother came home in a hurry and came rushing in the door and stopped at the living room tv where I was sitting with my sister. Our baby sister was back in her bedroom playing with dolls. Our mom began crying and then rushed away and made some phone calls from her bedroom, presumably to our dad and her sister in law. Our dad was out of town at the time visiting his sister in Illinois -- several states away -- on family business.

The 3 of us walked home from elementary school together that day because we lived in a neighborhood close to our school. Some parents had to come and get their kids, but most of us lived within safe walking distance.

My next youngest sister was old enough to understand what was going on and it troubled her. She asked me what do I think, and I said I think it was the Russians. She wondered if we were not going to have a big war. The whole nation was wondering it that too.

My very youngest sister was too young to understand. She does not remember the event.
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It changed the country, in a way w lost out innocence. The US was far from perfect before JFK, but for the most part we only got involved in other countries problems and wars when we got dragged into it. After JFK's assassination that seemed to change. We became harder, more of an international bully. That might of still happened even if JFK lived, but we'll never know.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

SenorXm/Sirius said:
It changed the country, in a way w lost out innocence. The US was far from perfect before JFK, but for the most part we only got involved in other countries problems and wars when we got dragged into it. After JFK's assassination that seemed to change. We became harder, more of an international bully. That might of still happened even if JFK lived, but we'll never know.
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Khrushchev and Castro had as much to do with times changing as anyone else did. JFK at best was an amateur compared with Ike.

JFK is mostly famous for facing off against Khrushchev and putting everything on the line, including strategic nuclear war, over the Cuban missile crisis.

I'm not so sure now today that I am happy with JFK gambling with my life like he did then.

Diplomatically the Cuban missile crisis should have been able to be avoided. Agree to withdraw the US missiles from Turkey in exchange for the Russian ones in Cuba.

But no, instead JFK almost annihilated the Northern Hemisphere one day by doing it his way. Navy man. Oh well.

I don't know Ike's take on the Cuban missile crisis. I may look for a bio of him in hardcopy and read it next.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

Riveroaks said:
Khrushchev and Castro had as much to do with times changing as anyone else did. JFK at best was an amateur compared with Ike.

JFK is mostly famous for facing off against Khrushchev and putting everything on the line, including strategic nuclear war, over the Cuban missile crisis.

I'm not so sure now today that I am happy with JFK gambling with my life like he did then.

Diplomatically the Cuban missile crisis should have been able to be avoided. Agree to withdraw the US missiles from Turkey in exchange for the Russian ones in Cuba.

But no, instead JFK almost annihilated the Northern Hemisphere one day by doing it his way. Navy man. Oh well.

I don't know Ike's take on the Cuban missile crisis. I may look for a bio of him in hardcopy and read it next.
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I've never been a huge fan of JFK, or any Kennedy. But JFK handled the Cuban Missile Crisis PERFECTLY. What we know today is that there were many people around JFK who wanted to handle the Crisis much differently than he did, and if they got their own way they would have been DEFINITELY gambling with your, and my life.

I'm not sure how the Crisis could have been avoided diplomatically. Castro especially was in no mood for diplomacy.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

SenorXm/Sirius said:
I've never been a huge fan of JFK, or any Kennedy. But JFK handled the Cuban Missile Crisis PERFECTLY. What we know today is that there were many people around JFK who wanted to handle the Crisis much differently than he did, and if they got their own way they would have been DEFINITELY gambling with your, and my life.

I'm not sure how the Crisis could have been avoided diplomatically. Castro especially was in no mood for diplomacy.
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The first mistake was the US putting missiles in Turkey.

Then it became a game of tit for tat.

And that is the game that risked everyone's lives in the Northern Hemisphere that day in 1962.

It could have gone completely differently.

The Northern Hemisphere could have become the dark side of the moon, and then the Southern Hemisphere would have taken over the world, with Brazil, South Africa, and Australia becoming the lone superpowers. Everyone else would be dead.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

Riveroaks said:
The first mistake was the US putting missiles in Turkey.
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I agree with that. But we're talking about JFK here, and those missiles in Turkey were deployed in 1959. Before JFK.

Many times a president has to deal with poor decisions and messes from previous presidents. IMO Ike was one of the best presidents of the 20th century. But he made mistakes, and Cuba and these obsolete missiles in Turkey were mistakes.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

SenorXm/Sirius said:
Over the past 50+ years the Feds did it, the Mafia, LBJ, the Cubans, The KGB, the CIA, the FBI, etc., etc. In other words maybe 10,000-12,000 people were involved. LOL Another reason I now believe Oswald acted alone. We just don't keep secrets that well in this country.

And people like ballantine are another reason. No matter how much evidence is out there to disprove all, or part of a conspiracy they still believe and stamp their feet and yell louder.







Actually years ago I did see a documentary where a man in his 70's shoot this rifle 3 times in less than 8 seconds. But the age isn't important, the fact that for decades it was said by conspiracy people that this kind of rifle could NOT be fired 3 times by 1 man in 8 secs. has been proven to be wrong. It can be, and even less than 8 secs, and accurately.

A look at the JFK assassination at 50 years - Could Oswald have made the shots? | Examiner.com

And MODS I promise I will NOT talk about this in this thread again. My apologies.
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May I suggest you YouTube some Mark Lane videos. I also thought for the longest time Oswald was the shooter, but watching Mark Lane lay out all the Factual evidence, I no longer have ANY doubts about Lee Harvey.. he was a patsy. Mark Lane personally knew both JFK and RFK and he also was a "higher up" Dem operative. And it's been his mission to actually get to the bottom of this assination, and I believe he does. The Warren Report was nothing more then theater for the American public...Seriously, do yourself a favor and look into what Mark Lane has brought to light.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

Gringo allstar said:
May I suggest you YouTube some Mark Lane videos. I also thought for the longest time Oswald was the shooter, but watching Mark Lane lay out all the Factual evidence, I no longer have ANY doubts about Lee Harvey.. he was a patsy. Mark Lane personally knew both JFK and RFK and he also was a "higher up" Dem operative. And it's been his mission to actually get to the bottom of this assination, and I believe he does. The Warren Report was nothing more then theater for the American public...Seriously, do yourself a favor and look into what Mark Lane has brought to light.
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I'll put him on my reading/viewing lists. But I got to admit I'm pretty fatigued about the whole assassination. Too many books, too many opinions, as I said earlier too many different fingers pointing to 1,000's of different people and dozens of organizations. The people making a case that the Italian Mafia did it make just as much sense as the people pointing to the Cubans and/or the KGB, or CIA, or LBJ or whoever.

But I like to read, I'll look into his writings.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

SenorXm/Sirius said:
I'll put him on my reading/viewing lists. But I got to admit I'm pretty fatigued about the whole assassination. Too many books, too many opinions, as I said earlier too many different fingers pointing to 1,000's of different people and dozens of organizations. The people making a case that the Italian Mafia did it make just as much sense as the people pointing to the Cubans and/or the KGB, or CIA, or LBJ or whoever.

But I like to read, I'll look into his writings.
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If you want to be entertained, watch him debate William F Buckley from I believe it was a Firing Line in 1966, he schools Buckley.
 
Re: November 22, 1963

SenorXm/Sirius said:
I've never been a huge fan of JFK, or any Kennedy. But JFK handled the Cuban Missile Crisis PERFECTLY. What we know today is that there were many people around JFK who wanted to handle the Crisis much differently than he did, and if they got their own way they would have been DEFINITELY gambling with your, and my life.

I'm not sure how the Crisis could have been avoided diplomatically. Castro especially was in no mood for diplomacy.
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He did not handle the situation perfectly, and in actuality, it was far from a crisis, although the testosterone of the prime participants probably obscured this. Kennedy gamboled the fate of the world on a few missiles offshore, something the Soviets had endured for years, and in fact the US would very soon endure itself, permanently, in the form of submarine launched ballistic missiles, indeed a force far surpassing the Cuban installations. This technology was already known, and in production at the time. Kennedy knew all about this. His reactions were those of a young boy slapped in the face, not those of a mature, level headed statesman.
 
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