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Ar15 is meant for Home Defense

In the matter of self-defense in one's home, not much beats a shotgun.

Depends on the shooter. Me? I'm a shotgun shooter. So you would be right. My friend is a marine with lots of shooting and as he says "convoy" experience. A pump shotgun warps his brain. If he were to buy a home defense gun? It would be hard to beat an ar15 in his expert marksman hands.

All comes down the shooter. And ar15 is a viable choice OVER the shotgun if the shooter is a rifle shooter.
 
few weapons are as versatile as a semi auto rifle

easy to use in close quarters

far more accuracy and stopping power over a pistol

better range than a shotgun and unlike a shotgun loaded with buck or bird shot-can be used in a hostage situation

less penetration than slugs

my perimeter defense weapon


View attachment 67202228

As I said in the other thread: I will take it off your hands. I will up the price to a $1. I hope you don't mind if I sell?
 
Tell me more about how anyone would use more arms than can be physically born in order to bear arms. There is a limit to how many weapons you should have. If you own an excessive amount of weapons, that's you're right to be an imbecile and an arms proliferator.

Individual rights should apply to individuals, not stockpiles.

Oh lord. Do you realize that the second amendment right to bear arms was very much about individual ownership of MANY arms? Do you realize that it was frequently rich officers and merchants arming men with arms from personal stockpiles? And now it has become viable for us "commoners" to purchase a variety of weapons. That right applies to all. Not just the rich.
 
No, they come from different jurisprudence.

Brice Harper: Castle doctrine laws in Montana and elsewhere are encouraging rather than deterring violence.



The problem ludin, is that you endorse infinite wisdom in lieu of sensibility. You're just flaming here. Sorry to burst your bubble, but the castle doctrine is relevant. :doh

Castle doctrine encouraging violence hm? Well maybe scumbag piece of **** criminals should stop trying to attack people in their homes and then violence won't matter?

What? Are you like supporting the Breaking and Entering/burglar's/home invader's Union? Trying to keep them safe in their respected occupation? **** Em. If you decide to violate the sanctity of another's home: justice is served if you die or get arrested.
 
You can't recall a time when a religious group killed dozens of people? So...you don't watch a lot of international news, eh? Recommend googling this new group called "ISIL". They're kind of a big deal.

So... you use the 'gun' rubber move the goal posts coz you don't like the playing field YOU set-up??? I don't recall OUR Constitution applying in ISIL held territory... :doh

(The discussion was HERE and what needs a license HERE)

nice try... :peace
 
You can't recall a time when a religious group killed dozens of people?

So...you don't watch a lot of international news, eh? Recommend googling this new group called "ISIL". They're kind of a big deal.

But the good news is that ISIS is swiftly losing it's territory and their funding. Thank God.
 
For the public - yeah. But the San Berandino terrorists modified theirs into full auto. If they hadn't had access to ARs, it might probably never have happened.

To claim that if a particular weapon was unavailable or not modifiable that a couple of terrorists would have said forget it is a wide stretch.
 
For the public - yeah. But the San Berandino terrorists modified theirs into full auto. If they hadn't had access to ARs, it might probably never have happened.

Ummmm.. no.

Government field tests showed that the modification to fully automatic mode was performed but failed, the source said. - Attempt Was Made to Make Gun in San Bernardino Fire Automatic - NBC News

They tried to modify one of the weapons to full auto and it failed. The second rifle had a fixed magazine and that change was successful.

Just a little research goes a long way.
 
Can't recall a time where the two you mention killing dozens of schoolchildren or movie goers... :peace

Because your statement is nothing but a red herring. It has absolutely nothing to do with his premise about rights. Your statement is nothing but emotional hyperbole to demonize.
 
Is .223 the Best Home Defense Caliber? - Guns & Ammo

So with all the discussion about the evils of the ar15 and its baby seeking Bullets, I felt compelled to introduce this topic. The idea that this rifle is unsuitable for the public is hogwash for one simple reason: it is an excellent home defense gun. The caliber is perfect for those who are seeking to reduce over penetration. It is also superb for those who aren't great pistol or shotgun shooters.

And far more importantly owning such a weapon bolsters the fragile 'masculinity' of 'inadequate' gun huggers in front of their mates. :wink:
 
No, they come from different jurisprudence.

Brice Harper: Castle doctrine laws in Montana and elsewhere are encouraging rather than deterring violence.



The problem ludin, is that you endorse infinite wisdom in lieu of sensibility. You're just flaming here. Sorry to burst your bubble, but the castle doctrine is relevant. :doh

first off I am not the one calling people ignorant that would be you. you have no idea what a flame is.
the castle doctrine only goes on to say that people have the right to defend themselves and their property from
someone that would do them harm.

it doesn't say how that is to be accomplished just that they have the right to do it.
at this point you are simply just making stuff up.

your article written by the slate rag is meaningless. it only fosters your anti-gun meme which has
become nothing more than your opinion being claimed as fact.
 
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I'm not going to play into anyone's sick fantasy, but I'm sure with your expertise this is a teachable moment to you. Where children are, in my opinion guns should not be involved.
exactly opinion not based on any fact. therefore irrelevant

You would do just as well to retrieve the child while a woman uses a handgun in self defense. The best choice would involve calling a police officer, so that an officer of the law can exercise their duty to protect you and your family. By all means, self defense is an option. When it comes to firearms, I think it's best to own no more than one.

the average response time of police is 10-15 minutes you are dead along with your family. the cops only show up to clean up afterward.
good you don't have to own more than 1 again your opinion therefore irrelevant.

By the way, don't think I didn't notice your flip on the second amendment. It's ok if you wanna dance around the issue, but just know that bringing a gun into the matter doesn't excuse you from being proved wrong. It seems your use of self defense is a personal right when this is convenient, and a matter of limiting oversight where that is convenient.
So far you haven't proven anything wrong. simply spouting opinion as fact so far. yes self defense is a personal right.

Strictly speaking, the castle defense grants you the right to use force. The second amendment does not speak about the use of force, though it would be useful in showing that you could own a gun which is capable of dispensing deadly justice. I'm not saying you should have to prove that for the purpose of this discussion. Abiding peaceably with a standard tool should be reflected upon with knowledge of how one may conduct oneself at home.

nope the second amendment says that the government shall not fringe on the right to bear arms.
the gun is for the defense of someone not being a vigilante which is what you are implying in this post.

yep a gun is a standard tool in self and home defense.
 
And far more importantly owning such a weapon bolsters the fragile 'masculinity' of 'inadequate' gun huggers in front of their mates. :wink:

Funny that you resort to a disproven ad hom about "masculinity." It isn't the gun owners freaking out about an inanimate object. That would be the anti gun ******s. ;)
 
In the matter of self-defense in one's home, not much beats a shotgun.

Not that I disagree with your choice, but at across the bedroom/living room distances, a shotgun is more like a big rifle than it is a shotgun. At 10-15 feet, your pattern is going to be about the size of a tennis ball.
 
ok so you are clueless about home defense. You are dismissed as being ignorant of this topic and when you claim you should only own one gun-well that's like saying you ought to play 18 holes of golf with one club. I am not going to bother with this sort of nonsense anymore-rather I am merely going to shred future silliness I expect to see from you on this topic.

if someone is in your home seeking to kill those in it-you best be armed when you try to retrieve a child. The PROPER response is the father take a handgun, retrieve the child while the mother barricade a safe room with preferably a shotgun. You see the father might have to carry the child and that makes the handgun the best choice.

BTW a police officer has no duty to protect and serve any specific individual. Look it up-the Supreme court has so ruled. and given the average response time of most PDs in urban areas, you are pinning your hopes on a pipe dream

Your dismissive attitude does not serve the purpose of intelligent debate. I think it follows that I need to make a distinction. Perhaps you have misunderstood my position on gun ownership and home ownership and how home defense works in harmony with both.

First, self defense is not limited to home owners. Homeless people are protected under the second amendment. In the context of this thread, the application of the second amendment to the use of an AR-15 only goes so far as to say that the government will not infringe on your right. The second amendment does not authorize you to use deadly force. The second amendment applies to the relationship between the people who exist within the state's jurisdiction, bearing in mind the necessity of the militia and not home ownership. This is clearly distinct from the castle doctrine, which should be applied according to home ownership.

Your attempt to use fear to promote your agenda does not detract from the consistent logic by which the law may be applied. Your comparison of gun ownership and gun use to recreational activities like reading and sports is facetious. So allow me to ask you a clarifying question.

Do you agree that defense is implicitly actionable, and that an attack must exist in order for someone to defend his home?

Note that I am not saying the attack must be violent. I believe that protection and defense of one's home are both active and not passive. It follows from repeatedly bringing up the concept of an assailant that home defense with a weapon is an armed conflict. To that end, deadly force only rests on the premise that this conflict could be escalated to the point where it becomes a matter of life and death. Gun ownership is not a direct consequence of that premise. Much like the extent of the power of the state being of the capacity that it is not limited by the constitution, the castle doctrine provides limits under which civilians may use force within their homes.

Defending your home does not mean that you only face cloak and dagger tactics, or that your home will at any point be attacked. So in that sense, owning an AR 15 does not cause criminals to appear in your home. The use of any kind of weapon, including the AR-15 does not guarantee that your defense will be successful. Moreover, the use of weapons by only an adult male is a serious limitation on the effectiveness of your defense. Compare and contrast the use of one kind of weapon by an entire family to only one member of a family being able to use weapons. There is just a slight hint of hypocrisy in your argument.

As this thread relates to the superior quality of a particular caliber of firearm, or particular quality of munitions for home defense, I suggest you realize a third component to home defense. The militia may serve its state, however as you pointed out, police response times are very high. It is in the best interest of the militia and others to be consistent and accessible. Therefore, accessibility to adequate defense is an important factor. The AR-15 is very accessible because it is a popular weapon in military and civilian life.
 
Your dismissive attitude does not serve the purpose of intelligent debate. I think it follows that I need to make a distinction. Perhaps you have misunderstood my position on gun ownership and home ownership and how home defense works in harmony with both.

First, self defense is not limited to home owners. Homeless people are protected under the second amendment. In the context of this thread, the application of the second amendment to the use of an AR-15 only goes so far as to say that the government will not infringe on your right. The second amendment does not authorize you to use deadly force. The second amendment applies to the relationship between the people who exist within the state's jurisdiction, bearing in mind the necessity of the militia and not home ownership. This is clearly distinct from the castle doctrine, which should be applied according to home ownership.

Your attempt to use fear to promote your agenda does not detract from the consistent logic by which the law may be applied. Your comparison of gun ownership and gun use to recreational activities like reading and sports is facetious. So allow me to ask you a clarifying question.

Do you agree that defense is implicitly actionable, and that an attack must exist in order for someone to defend his home?

Note that I am not saying the attack must be violent. I believe that protection and defense of one's home are both active and not passive. It follows from repeatedly bringing up the concept of an assailant that home defense with a weapon is an armed conflict. To that end, deadly force only rests on the premise that this conflict could be escalated to the point where it becomes a matter of life and death. Gun ownership is not a direct consequence of that premise. Much like the extent of the power of the state being of the capacity that it is not limited by the constitution, the castle doctrine provides limits under which civilians may use force within their homes.

Defending your home does not mean that you only face cloak and dagger tactics, or that your home will at any point be attacked. So in that sense, owning an AR 15 does not cause criminals to appear in your home. The use of any kind of weapon, including the AR-15 does not guarantee that your defense will be successful. Moreover, the use of weapons by only an adult male is a serious limitation on the effectiveness of your defense. Compare and contrast the use of one kind of weapon by an entire family to only one member of a family being able to use weapons. There is just a slight hint of hypocrisy in your argument.

As this thread relates to the superior quality of a particular caliber of firearm, or particular quality of munitions for home defense, I suggest you realize a third component to home defense. The militia may serve its state, however as you pointed out, police response times are very high. It is in the best interest of the militia and others to be consistent and accessible. Therefore, accessibility to adequate defense is an important factor. The AR-15 is very accessible because it is a popular weapon in military and civilian life.

Do you realize that "bearing arms" means using them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Do you realize that "bearing arms" means using them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is Celebrity even responding to what I said? this appears to be yet another passive-aggressive attempt to attack pro gun positions by a leftist without really coming out and saying what he believes.
 
Your dismissive attitude does not serve the purpose of intelligent debate. I think it follows that I need to make a distinction. Perhaps you have misunderstood my position on gun ownership and home ownership and how home defense works in harmony with both.

First, self defense is not limited to home owners. Homeless people are protected under the second amendment. In the context of this thread, the application of the second amendment to the use of an AR-15 only goes so far as to say that the government will not infringe on your right. The second amendment does not authorize you to use deadly force. The second amendment applies to the relationship between the people who exist within the state's jurisdiction, bearing in mind the necessity of the militia and not home ownership. This is clearly distinct from the castle doctrine, which should be applied according to home ownership.

Your attempt to use fear to promote your agenda does not detract from the consistent logic by which the law may be applied. Your comparison of gun ownership and gun use to recreational activities like reading and sports is facetious. So allow me to ask you a clarifying question.

Do you agree that defense is implicitly actionable, and that an attack must exist in order for someone to defend his home?

Note that I am not saying the attack must be violent. I believe that protection and defense of one's home are both active and not passive. It follows from repeatedly bringing up the concept of an assailant that home defense with a weapon is an armed conflict. To that end, deadly force only rests on the premise that this conflict could be escalated to the point where it becomes a matter of life and death. Gun ownership is not a direct consequence of that premise. Much like the extent of the power of the state being of the capacity that it is not limited by the constitution, the castle doctrine provides limits under which civilians may use force within their homes.

Defending your home does not mean that you only face cloak and dagger tactics, or that your home will at any point be attacked. So in that sense, owning an AR 15 does not cause criminals to appear in your home. The use of any kind of weapon, including the AR-15 does not guarantee that your defense will be successful. Moreover, the use of weapons by only an adult male is a serious limitation on the effectiveness of your defense. Compare and contrast the use of one kind of weapon by an entire family to only one member of a family being able to use weapons. There is just a slight hint of hypocrisy in your argument.

As this thread relates to the superior quality of a particular caliber of firearm, or particular quality of munitions for home defense, I suggest you realize a third component to home defense. The militia may serve its state, however as you pointed out, police response times are very high. It is in the best interest of the militia and others to be consistent and accessible. Therefore, accessibility to adequate defense is an important factor. The AR-15 is very accessible because it is a popular weapon in military and civilian life.

you are talking around and not addressing what I have said

you said that the amount of firearms a person is able to own should be restricted or limited. Most of the other stuff in this tome is complete crap. I never said anything about limiting weapons to adult males. Those who have been on this board longer than a week or two know that I have constantly talked about the training my now 18 year old son has undergone since he was pre-teen
 
Is Celebrity even responding to what I said? this appears to be yet another passive-aggressive attempt to attack pro gun positions by a leftist without really coming out and saying what he believes.

Acknowledging that they wish to ban guns would take away the deniability that they aren't "coming for our guns."


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Do you realize that "bearing arms" means using them?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No, it does not mean that in a literal or figurative sense, except in the following way:

bear arms
phrase of bear
1.
carry firearms.
2.
wear or display a coat of arms.

Idioms
10.
bear arms,
to carry weapons.
to serve as a member of the military or of contending forces:
His religious convictions kept him from bearing arms, but he served as an ambulance driver with the Red Cross.

Is Celebrity even responding to what I said? this appears to be yet another passive-aggressive attempt to attack pro gun positions by a leftist without really coming out and saying what he believes.

I am posting on the topic of this thread in response to what you said. I am not getting involved in your petty baiting or anyone's fantasy. This thread is about home defense and the forum is about gun control. If you can't take the heat,
41fYLDnrG2L._SY300_.jpg

If you can't refute my points, accept that I'm right.
 
No, it does not mean that in a literal or figurative sense.

bear arms
phrase of bear
1.
carry firearms.
2.
wear or display a coat of arms.

Idioms
10.
bear arms,
to carry weapons.
to serve as a member of the military or of contending forces:
His religious convictions kept him from bearing arms, but he served as an ambulance driver with the Red Cross.



I am posting on the topic of this thread in response to what you said. I am not getting involved in your petty baiting or anyone's fantasy. This thread is about home defense and the forum is about gun control. If you can't take the heat,
View attachment 67202247

If you can't refute my points, accept that I'm right.

you are apparently the latest of a pretty steady line of passive-aggressive posters who want to attack pro gun positions but is afraid to do it directly

lets get back to your claim that people ought to be limited in how many firearms they can own. WHY? and how does the second amendment stop operating at a certain number of weapons.
 
Do you realize that "bearing arms" means using them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

you are apparently the latest of a pretty steady line of passive-aggressive posters who want to attack pro gun positions but is afraid to do it directly

lets get back to your claim that people ought to be limited in how many firearms they can own. WHY? and how does the second amendment stop operating at a certain number of weapons.

Feel free to start your own thread on that topic. The castle doctrine relates more directly to discharging a firearm in one's own home. I don't appreciate you calling me passive aggressive, because I have not been passive aggressive. Discrediting me personally does not change the fact that no flaw has been shown to exist in the logical argument I have presented for home defense.
 
Feel free to start your own thread on that topic. The castle doctrine relates more directly to discharging a firearm in one's own home. I don't appreciate you calling me passive aggressive, because I have not been passive aggressive. Discrediting me personally does not change the fact that no flaw has been shown to exist in the logical argument I have presented for home defense.


again why should people be limited in the amount of firearms they merely own?

and we have already explained why the AR 15 is an ideal for home defense. BTW how many AR 15s have you owned? how many firearms do you own merely for self defense?
 
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