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San Francisco mayor wants police to use stun guns instead of firearms

NonoBadDog

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We have discussed this in the forum but I didn't think anyone was dumb enough to actually try it. It is San Fran. It will be interesting to see how this works out after a cop dies chasing a guy with a real gun. I wonder how many cops quit the force. It will be an interesting social experiment.

San Francisco Mayor Ed Lee is pushing for officers to use stun guns instead of firearms following the police shooting of Mario Woods, who was wielding a knife when he was fatally shot by police on Dec. 2.
“I told the commission that I want this done immediately,” Mr. Lee said last week about the stun gun proposal.

Police Chief Greg Suhr appears to be behind the idea and is already is looking into other changes, such as using shields and implementing new rules aimed at slowing officers down when they draw their guns, the San Francisco Chronicle reported.
The mayor is already receiving some pushback for the proposal.
“The last thing you want is to fast-track something like that. You have to look at the entire operation of the S.F. police department,” said Supervisor David Campos, a former police commissioner. “I think the Board of Supervisors will rightly say, ‘Mr. Mayor, that doesn’t cut it.’ “
Police Commissioner Petra DeJesus agreed that officials need to “stop, look and listen to the community” before making a decision, he told the San Francisco Chronicle. He said officers already have pepper spray, bean bags and batons, arguing that they “don’t need another weapon.”
Police Officers Association President Martin Halloran said, “I do not want to see any of my members hesitate to draw their fire in a situation where it is necessary.”
The mayor’s goal is to have the issue resolved within a couple of weeks. Even if the commission votes “yes,” the debate is likely to continue, the San Francisco Chronicle reported.

Ed Lee, San Francisco mayor, wants police to use stun guns instead of firearms - Washington Times
 
We have discussed this in the forum but I didn't think anyone was dumb enough to actually try it. It is San Fran. It will be interesting to see how this works out after a cop dies chasing a guy with a real gun. I wonder how many cops quit the force. It will be an interesting social experiment.



Ed Lee, San Francisco mayor, wants police to use stun guns instead of firearms - Washington Times

I am reminded of the Robocop mini series called Prime Directives.It is set ten years after the first film and crime has skyrocketed due to the strict no kill policy for the police.They show a news broadcast talking about the no kill policy and list all the police officers who died defending the no kill policy as though it was a good thing.
 
I am reminded of the Robocop mini series called Prime Directives.It is set ten years after the first film and crime has skyrocketed due to the strict no kill policy for the police.They show a news broadcast talking about the no kill policy and list all the police officers who died defending the no kill policy as though it was a good thing.

They can make anything can happen in a script. Bruce Willis killed a helicopter with a car.
 
We have discussed this in the forum but I didn't think anyone was dumb enough to actually try it. It is San Fran. It will be interesting to see how this works out after a cop dies chasing a guy with a real gun. I wonder how many cops quit the force. It will be an interesting social experiment.



Ed Lee, San Francisco mayor, wants police to use stun guns instead of firearms - Washington Times

It would be nice if we could develop reliable, less-than-lethal first response weapons for the police. Or maybe shooting people trying to get out of a wrecked car is just good ol' American fun.
 
It would be nice if we could develop reliable, less-than-lethal first response weapons for the police. Or maybe shooting people trying to get out of a wrecked car is just good ol' American fun.

Would you really prefer that stunning folks after car crashes become the standard police policy? ;)
 
Would you really prefer that stunning folks after car crashes become the standard police policy? ;)

Well actually for that one, I would rather "render aid" be the standard police policy. But stunning may be better in the long run than shooting, if we had to pick between the two only.
 
Well actually for that one, I would rather "render aid" be the standard police policy. But stunning may be better in the long run than shooting, if we had to pick between the two only.

That assumes a sane, controlled decision based on threat assessment (which was absent in your example). Most police already have less than lethal means to deal with moderate threats. The assumption that an officer who would shoot someone and not even admit to having purposefully done so would choose a different option is just plain silly.
 
The problem isn't the tools, it is the training. In places like the UK they are trained to use lethal force when absolutely necessary. Here it seems they are trained to use it if they are just in fear. Yes, waiting to see if the person is pulling a gun before shooting instead of shooting if their hand just moves down toward their waistband might be a little riskier. But if you are risk adverse than you shouldn't be a cop.
 
I am reminded of the Robocop mini series called Prime Directives.It is set ten years after the first film and crime has skyrocketed due to the strict no kill policy for the police.They show a news broadcast talking about the no kill policy and list all the police officers who died defending the no kill policy as though it was a good thing.
If it happens in a fictional story, that must be how it would work in the real world! :D

Though I have to say, I always thought of Craig Ferguson as being a little bit like that "I'll buy that for a dollar!" guy. Anyway....

The Washington Times article is a tad biased -- surprised! To wit: SFPD currently do not carry stun guns, and the police chief and union support their use. What they don't like is a rushed set of policies about how to use incapacitation equipment and firearms.

There is absolutely no indication the officers will no longer carry firearms. Nor will they be barred from using firearms if the suspect is armed.

What the Mayor is hoping is to avoid another Mario Woods, a suspect in a non-fatal stabbing. When Woods brandished a 6-8" kitchen knife at five officers, they tried to incapacitate him with bean bags and pepper spray. When that failed, one of the officers opened fire, the other officers followed suit, and Woods was struck and killed by 20 bullets.
 
And all members of the SFPD should tell Hizzoner to go **** himself.
 
And all members of the SFPD should tell Hizzoner to go **** himself.
Erm... Again, SFPD does not currently carry stun guns or tasers. They're supportive of adopting them.
 
It would be nice if we could develop reliable, less-than-lethal first response weapons for the police. Or maybe shooting people trying to get out of a wrecked car is just good ol' American fun.

There are several. I like the bean bag round. The problem with most non lethal alternatives is the short range. I would think that non lethal should be the first choice in most situations. I also think some police just shouldn't be police.
 
Erm... Again, SFPD does not currently carry stun guns or tasers. They're supportive of adopting them.

They are adoptive of using ONLY stun guns. What could possibly go wrong, right? I mean a guy is shooting at the police from 30 foot away and the police all have stun guns with a range of 22 feet. A potato gun would be better than a stun gun in that situation. Maybe they should just go straight to the potato gun. Sling shots would be good too.
 
And you thought gun control stopped at private ownership.

Nahh, there are several people that have seriously proposed it on this sight. I just didn't know there was someone out there in a public position that was stupid enough to do it. I will be real interested in the reactions of the cops on the force if they actually do get this done.
 
It would be nice if we could develop reliable, less-than-lethal first response weapons for the police. Or maybe shooting people trying to get out of a wrecked car is just good ol' American fun.

It would be nicer if the criminals had those less than lethal weapons. Until they do, the best way to stop them is a bigger guy with a bigger weapon.
 
They can make anything can happen in a script. Bruce Willis killed a helicopter with a car.
Wanting police to not use lethal force could lead to reality imitating fiction.
 
It would be nicer if the criminals had those less than lethal weapons. Until they do, the best way to stop them is a bigger guy with a bigger weapon.

No, a smarter guy with a smarter weapon will do just fine. No need to kill people unnecessarily.
 
They are adoptive of using ONLY stun guns.
No, they're not. Not even close.

SFPD does not currently have any stun guns. The mayor wants to get them immediately. The police chief and union support him. Others in SF are dubious, as stun guns are not exactly "non-lethal," need to be trained on them, prefer to focus on training.

The Mayor does want to encourage incapacitation first. At no point has the Mayor said ANYTHING about phasing out sidearms.

The Washington Times article is, to put it charitably, sloppy in its reporting.
 
The liberal mayor of San Fran should be a real leader and, to help get this proposal off to a good start, he should instruct his body guard detail to carry only stun guns. It wouldn't hurt to publicize what a real hero the mayor is, in all of the main stream media, by stepping forward like that and letting all of the elements of society in San Fran know that his body guards only have stun guns. Oh that's right..................
 
We have discussed this in the forum but I didn't think anyone was dumb enough to actually try it. It is San Fran. It will be interesting to see how this works out after a cop dies chasing a guy with a real gun. I wonder how many cops quit the force. It will be an interesting social experiment.



Ed Lee, San Francisco mayor, wants police to use stun guns instead of firearms - Washington Times

Oh man...(slap the forehead)

The tasers will be issued to go along with the service pistol; usually a SAP .40.

SF cops did not have tasers when the guy in the Bay View was shot.
 
Certainly when the criminals see this, they will use stun guns also.

Isn't that how Liberal logic works?
 
We have discussed this in the forum but I didn't think anyone was dumb enough to actually try it. It is San Fran. It will be interesting to see how this works out after a cop dies chasing a guy with a real gun. I wonder how many cops quit the force.

Hopefully all of them. Then they will be forced to try free market alternatives to socialized police and prove that it not only can work, but work better.
 
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