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13 Y/O boy fends off two armed home invaders - killing one

CanadaJohn said:
I'm glad the child is all right, but there's a lot here that's disturbing to me such as why is a 13 yr old child home alone with access to a loaded gun and what's the emotional impact going to be on this child now and as he grows up. The outcome was good here but there are so many other scenarios where this could have gone horribly wrong.
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Well at least he can grow up - seeing as how he's alive. He'll be more confident, perhaps? I see being able to protect yourself as a positive.

The extreme negative was two ****headed douches that dared to break into a home while a kid (perfectly of legal age to be alone and clearly mature enough to handle it) was there. ****ers. This has happened to other kids and they weren't so fortunate.

The first time I ever heard of a kid defending off an intruder was when I was a kid myself - he was a few years older than me. His baseball practice was canceled, I think, and he went home early. No one was there and while he was watching TV some guy tried to get into his home by cutting through the metal screen on the window. He broke the guy's hand with a baseball bat. Good for him.
 
CanadaJohn said:
What does liberal or conservative have to do with anything?
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I made an accurate response about, and pointed out, how liberals respond to situations in which they don't agree. This is a political website.

Sidebar: Most liberals are anti-gun.

CanadaJohn said:
I made a point about what I consider irresponsible parenting and irresponsible gun ownership. Honest and sincere people can have differences of opinion without stooping to ridiculing those who disagree.
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I pointed out where your opinion obviously fell short. Its too bad too. There is another world out there where people know how to use guns responsibly, even 13 year olds.
 
CanadaJohn said:
What does liberal or conservative have to do with anything? I made a point about what I consider irresponsible parenting and irresponsible gun ownership. [BOLD]Honest and sincere people can have differences of opinion without stooping to ridiculing those who disagree.[/BOLD]
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Yes, can and should. Unfortunately, our politicians make lousy role models of late. ;)
 
ttwtt78640 said:
You certainly could after multiple felony convictions. Are you advocating even shorter sentences? Reform, like sobriety, must come from within. We are highly unlikely to mete out prison terms of "until reformed" so adding more time, especially for subsequent felony convictions is a reasonable alternative.
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what I would like to see are no prison sentences for minor crimes, and the focus be on reform and not punishment for those who will enter society again...if the system turns a soft criminal into a hardened criminal we as a society lose in multiple ways

reform must come from within yes...and if it is to come from within there must be hope that one can improve ones self and make a better life once outside otherwise, just should just throw the key away because the rate of recidivism is already too high

we need to decide what the goal is and the price we are willing to pay
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Well at least he can grow up - seeing as how he's alive. He'll be more confident, perhaps? I see being able to protect yourself as a positive.

The extreme negative was two ****headed douches that dared to break into a home while a kid (perfectly of legal age to be alone and clearly mature enough to handle it) was there. ****ers. This has happened to other kids and they weren't so fortunate.

The first time I ever heard of a kid defending off an intruder was when I was a kid myself - he was a few years older than me. His baseball practice was canceled, I think, and he went home early. No one was there and while he was watching TV some guy tried to get into his home by cutting through the metal screen on the window. He broke the guy's hand with a baseball bat. Good for him.
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I have a friend who died by home invasion robbery so this is personal for me. I think everyone who wants to own a gun should train their children how to use it/them and the responsibility that goes with it.

Let's not forget the boy had a decision to make and obviously reacted in his best interest, no matter what others here tell you.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1065274599 said:
I have a friend who died by home invasion robbery so this is personal for me. I think everyone who wants to own a gun should train their children how to use it/them and the responsibility that goes with it.

Let's not forget the boy had a decision to make and obviously reacted in his best interest, no matter what others here tell you.
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Well I fully agree with you - gun owning parents should properly raise their children to understand, respect, and even use guns (though this last part isn't necessary to understand and respect or even fire on occasion just to understand).

Fully agree.
 
_Sal said:
what I would like to see are no prison sentences for minor crimes, and the focus be on reform and not punishment for those who will enter society again...if the system turns a soft criminal into a hardened criminal we as a society lose in multiple ways

reform must come from within yes...and if it is to come from within there must be hope that one can improve ones self and make a better life once outside otherwise, just should just throw the key away because the rate of recidivism is already too high

we need to decide what the goal is and the price we are willing to pay
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Many (most?) of those "minor" crimes are simply reduced charges offered in order to get plea deals to avoid a costly trial. Real justice (trying every case i court) is even more expensive than doling out short jail/prison terms. We have bargain justice now - which is why many of these "minor" criminals are free to become major criminals.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'm glad the child is all right, but there's a lot here that's disturbing to me such as why is a 13 yr old child home alone with access to a loaded gun and what's the emotional impact going to be on this child now and as he grows up. The outcome was good here but there are so many other scenarios where this could have gone horribly wrong.
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Sounds to me like there was a good reason why he should have had access to the gun.

Why he was left home alone is another question, but i was home alone various times at that age and out unsupervised by adults at that time in my life.

Of course, that was a long, long time ago in a galaxy far away...
 
CanadaJohn said:
Your hysteria in support of leaving a loaded gun with a 13 yr old left alone to defend himself is truly heartwarming.

Do you think it's responsible for an adult to leave a loaded gun around available to a 13 yr old who has no adult supervision? How many burglars, such as in this case, have been killed by a 13 yr old defending himself as opposed to younger children being killed by a 13 yr old or younger who happened to find or get access to a loaded gun when no adult supervision was around? If you think 13 yr olds are basically adults, you're in the minority.

You can dismiss legitimate concerns expressed by myself and others about a 13 yr old being left with a loaded gun and no adult supervision, but you just identify yourself as someone who doesn't give a **** about the consequences of irresponsible gun ownership. With rights come responsibilities.
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I dont know what kind of 13 year olds you are used to being around or raising. Sounds like the type that apparently cant be left alone. Thats just...sad.
 
CanadaJohn said:
What does liberal or conservative have to do with anything? I made a point about what I consider irresponsible parenting and irresponsible gun ownership. Honest and sincere people can have differences of opinion without stooping to ridiculing those who disagree.
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You are officially on the same side of the argument with AtlantaAdonis. That ought to tell you everything you need to know about your argument.
 
VanceMack said:
I dont know what kind of 13 year olds you are used to being around or raising. Sounds like the type that apparently cant be left alone. Thats just...sad.
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I don't know what kind of a neighbourhood you live in, but if I lived in a neighbourhood where a 13 yr old who was left alone required a loaded firearm to protect himself I sure as hell wouldn't be leaving that child alone and unsupervised.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I don't know what kind of a neighbourhood you live in, but if I lived in a neighbourhood where a 13 yr old who was left alone required a loaded firearm to protect himself I sure as hell wouldn't be leaving that child alone and unsupervised.
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I hear WalMart is having a sale on adult sized bubble wrap. You should stock up.

Seriously...do you send your kids to school? Do you let them go play outside alone? I really cant fathom your world. At 13 my kids were spending weekends on camping trips with their friends. They all knew how to handle firearms. Yes...I could even trusts them to be home alone.
 
VanceMack said:
You are officially on the same side of the argument with AtlantaAdonis. That ought to tell you everything you need to know about your argument.
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I'm not on anybody's side, except for the side of a 13 yr old boy who was left alone and required to shoot to kill in order to protect himself with no parents or other adult figure around to protect him. I don't need a side to defend my views on the issue and I don't need to indirectly slag another poster in order to make my point. You apparently need the security of numbers to defend your position. Too bad this 13 yr old didn't have the same security in numbers when he was left alone to kill or be killed.
 
VanceMack said:
I hear WalMart is having a sale on adult sized bubble wrap. You should stock up.

Seriously...do you send your kids to school? Do you let them go play outside alone? I really cant fathom your world. At 13 my kids were spending weekends on camping trips with their friends. They all knew how to handle firearms. Yes...I could even trusts them to be home alone.
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I'm happy to hear your children survived their wilderness existence.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'm happy to hear your children survived their wilderness existence.
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I'm sorry to hear your kids need parental supervision to pee.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'm not on anybody's side, except for the side of a 13 yr old boy who was left alone and required to shoot to kill in order to protect himself with no parents or other adult figure around to protect him. I don't need a side to defend my views on the issue and I don't need to indirectly slag another poster in order to make my point. You apparently need the security of numbers to defend your position. Too bad this 13 yr old didn't have the same security in numbers when he was left alone to kill or be killed.
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Good ****ing lord...you are on the side of a 13 year old that would have been left to the watchful care and custody of two violent felons...and you are wetting yourself over him actually having the means to and ability to defend himself. And you dont think your priorities are ****ed up?
 
VanceMack said:
Good ****ing lord...you are on the side of a 13 year old that would have been left to the watchful care and custody of two violent felons...and you are wetting yourself over him actually having the means to and ability to defend himself. And you dont think your priorities are ****ed up?
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No, I don't think my priorities are ****ed up - I'd rather live in my world than yours.
 
CanadaJohn said:
No, I don't think my priorities are ****ed up - I'd rather live in my world than yours.
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I'm sure the sky is a lovely shade of pink in your world.

In MY world? The real world? Soft minded people create a penal system that allows two violent felons with multiple arrests for violent crimes roam the streets. they commit brutal violent crimes about 1.2 million times a year. And my children werent raised as special snowflakes to pretend that nothing bad will ever happen or that the cops will always be there to protect them.
 
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VanceMack said:
I'm sure the sky is a lovely shade of pink in your world.

In MY world? The real world? Soft minded people create a penal system that allows two violent felons with multiple arrests for violent crimes roam the streets. they commit brutal violent crimes about 1.2 million times a year. And my children werent raised as special snowflakes to pretend that nothing bad will ever happen or that the cops will always be there to protect them.
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ZZZZZZZZ :yawn:
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Many (most?) of those "minor" crimes are simply reduced charges offered in order to get plea deals to avoid a costly trial. Real justice (trying every case i court) is even more expensive than doling out short jail/prison terms. We have bargain justice now - which is why many of these "minor" criminals are free to become major criminals.
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many to most of minor crimes are actually serious and they plead down? That's interesting.

I have never heard that before...do you have stats on that or is it assumptive?
 
CanadaJohn said:
I don't know what kind of a neighbourhood you live in, but if I lived in a neighbourhood where a 13 yr old who was left alone required a loaded firearm to protect himself I sure as hell wouldn't be leaving that child alone and unsupervised.
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Did you give this one minutes thought? If you lived in such a neighbourhood could you afford to hire somebody to look after the child? Apparently reality is not part of your thinking and a home invasion is a reality no matter where you live except possibly in a prison. At 13 both my parents worked a common thing today.
 
_Sal said:
many to most of minor crimes are actually serious and they plead down? That's interesting.

I have never heard that before...do you have stats on that or is it assumptive?
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Yes.

Plea bargains have been common for more than a century, but lately they have begun to put the trial system out of business in some courtrooms. By one count, fewer than one in 40 felony cases now make it to trial, according to data from nine states that have published such records since the 1970s, when the ratio was about one in 12. The decline has been even steeper in federal district courts.
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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/26/u...-prosecutors-push-for-plea-bargains.html?_r=1

In that world, 97 percent of federal cases and 94 percent of state cases end in plea bargains, with defendants pleading guilty in exchange for a lesser sentence. Courtroom trials, the stuff of television dramas, almost never take place.
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The implication of the decisions is that defendants should be rewarded with the lesser sentences afforded by plea bargains simply because “the squeezed economics of the system virtually demand that almost all cases be processed by watered-down negotiation rather than by trial,” said William G. Otis, a former c Appellate Division chief at the United States attorney’s office in the Eastern District of Virginia.
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http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/23/us/stronger-hand-for-judges-after-rulings-on-plea-deals.html

https://www.bja.gov/Publications/PleaBargainingResearchSummary.pdf

Plea Bargains and Guilty Pleas

An example of such a deal follows:

Former Ms. Washington Takes Plea Bargain in Murder Case - ABC News
 
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Crimefree said:
Did you give this one minutes thought? If you lived in such a neighbourhood could you afford to hire somebody to look after the child? Apparently reality is not part of your thinking and a home invasion is a reality no matter where you live except possibly in a prison. At 13 both my parents worked a common thing today.
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Did you give this one minute's thought?

Summerville South Carolina doesn't seem like the ghetto to me.

* predominantly white 73%
* 93% highschool graduate or higher
* 30% bachelors degree or higher
* 10% of the population veterans
* home ownership 63%
* median home value $180,000
* median household income $55,000
* persons below poverty level 11.5%

Summerville (town) QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau

Compared to the rest of South Carolina, this seems to me to be a fairly well off part of the state with the numbers above being significantly higher than those for the rest of the state.

I don't know the circumstances of this family. But I stand by my statement that if I lived in a neighbourhood where my 13 yr old child needed a loaded gun to protect himself if left home alone, I wouldn't leave him home alone.
 
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