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Explaining Why Federal Deficits Are Needed[W:5330]

Gimmesometruth said:
Yer back yo where you and I began I asked what mechanism is going to change, to cause interest rates to increase, to reverse a trend going on 4 decades. You would not answer then (you distracted to "Obummer"), so I'll ask again, explain how rate declines will reverse a long term trend.
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He believes interest rates increase because debt increases. It is a typical conservative talking point, that lacks any and all economic logic and understand of finance.
 
Kushinator said:
Is this the case for the rest of the developed world as well?



I already answered you, as it is not some fixed amount. Much of the waste from government spending is in the form of imperialism: maintaining a global military presence, which ironically enough, allows the rest of the developed world to piggy-back off of it and provide healthcare to their citizens. All at a direct cost to American taxpayers.



Your opinion is based on anger, frustration, fear, and partisan ignorance. It's therefore worthless.



I use international comparison to get an idea how the U.S. is performing, relative to the rest of the world. When we want to consider our education system, we compare it to that of Japan, Korea, Germany, France, Brazil, China, etc.... The reason we do so is beyond your ability to comprehend.
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I am not angry at all, frustrated with people like you complaining about what is going on in this country that you don't even understand. I live in TX, best move I ever made and the growing population here continues to be a huge issue because the opportunities here continue to outstrip those blue states around the country.

That waste of govt. spending on what you call imperialism has kept this country safe and freed billions of people around the world. The true waste, fraud, and abuse is in social spending which is most of the US budget all because people like you have no problem with the Federal govt. taking over state and local social problems and throwing money at them never demanding actual verifiable results. All that does is make you feel good and feel like you are actually solving problems none of which are solved. Your answer is throw more money at it
 
Kushinator said:
All you do on this forum is provide a reference point for when we need to move our parents into a nursing home. Nothing you have stated is of any value, and you repeat it constantly, as though each instance of repetition makes it stronger.
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LOL, glad you aren't one of my kids. Would love to compare balance sheets with you all self made not looking for the govt. to do anything but give me equal opportunity which it did, I did the rest
 
Kushinator said:
He believes interest rates increase because debt increases. It is a typical conservative talking point, that lacks any and all economic logic and understand of finance.
Click to expand...

Interest rates have little to do with the debt other than affecting the debt service costs so keep making things up
 
Gimmesometruth said:
Yer back to where you and I began, I asked what mechanism is going to change, to cause interest rates to increase, to reverse a trend going on 4 decades. You would not answer then (you distracted to "Obummer"), so I'll ask again, explain how rate declines will reverse a long term trend.
Click to expand...

QE lowered interest rates, the Fed is keeping them low because the economy is stagnant and there remains high under employment. Obama economic policies have done nothing to change human behavior as it relates to economic growth with some of that economic growth artificially inflated due to the stimulus and other govt. spending
 
Conservative said:
When the recession began the African-American unemployment rate was 8.5% … Today the unemployment rate for African-Americans is 8.4%
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Nov 2007 was a bubble high. When Obummer took office, the rate for Negroes was 13.7%. Eleven months later, as the effects of the GOP SSE Great Recession played through the labor market, it was 16.5%. So the failed policies you continue to support DOUBLED the rate for Negroes. This is why you Ignore my posts — cuz I continually expose yer lies and deceptions.

>>Seems that first black President hasn't done a lot of the African Americans in this country yet people like you still believe the rhetoric while ignoring the results

Last month's 8.4% (it was 8.2 in May) is half of what it was Jan 2010. "Thank you Obummer," say the Negroes. And when it was 8.5% in Nov 2007, the economy was on the verge of a collapse that would see it doubled. Not that way now, is it?

DA60 said:
Look what big government did for the rich since 2007: bailed out big banks … bailed out their buddies at GM and Chrysler … sent the stock market … skywards
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Fat cats have a lot of influence over the economy and the political system. The Negro didn't create that situation, but he is forced to deal with it. If the banks and the auto companies were severely damaged, the results for the country and the world would have been devastating. Better that equities are up than not.

>>the Fed's actions since 2007 have increased the wealth gap drastically and grown the number of rich and poor while shrinking the number of middle class Americans.

False. Inequality has diminished or at least slowed under the Negro.

atfer-tax_income_inequality_index_1979_2013.jpg

And tax policy has been the driver.

tax_impact_on_inequality_1979_2013.jpg

>>since 2007, the national debt/FED balance sheet are massively higher.

The result of the GOP SSE Great Recession.

>Food stamp usage is WAY up, the home ownership rate is WAY down

Same thing, and the figures from Nov 2007 were produced by the bubble that burst. SNAP participation is now down by 4.3 million from Dec 2012 to its lowest level since Oct 2010.

>>the DOW has skyrocketed. And you say that is good for the poor/middle class?

Yes.

>>Big government helps the rich...not the poor.

Gubmint helps all Americans.
 
Conservative said:
Good for them, how do they pay for it? The beauty of this country is if you don't like what is going on in Arizona you can move to a state more to your liking like California. It is amazing how stupid people are, isn't it as the population growth in those southern conservative states continues to grow and lead the nation. People just love to move to TX with its low wages, no insurance, high pollution and continue to vote for a conservative govt. I know this is going to come as a shock to you but have you ever considered that the problem could just be with you?
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Again, I know yer argument, Texass is yer "utopia"....so secede already! I was in CA, reaching a personal economic peak, until the Bush recession wiped me, my wife....and everything we had built up over 30 years....completely out. It wasn't a matter of the state, the same thing would have happened in Phx had we stayed there, it was a matter of FEDERAL characteristics/inactions. State lines do not isolate, so again, yer argument completely phails.

But keep avoiding the answer to yer previous question, the one on the general health of a population based on the "socialism" of the govt.
 
Conservative said:
I am not angry at all, frustrated with people like you complaining about what is going on in this country that you don't even understand. I live in TX, best move I ever made and the growing population here continues to be a huge issue because the opportunities here continue to outstrip those blue states around the country.

That waste of govt. spending on what you call imperialism has kept this country safe and freed billions of people around the world. The true waste, fraud, and abuse is in social spending which is most of the US budget all because people like you have no problem with the Federal govt. taking over state and local social problems and throwing money at them never demanding actual verifiable results. All that does is make you feel good and feel like you are actually solving problems none of which are solved. Your answer is throw more money at it
Click to expand...

If you think there isn't waste, fraud, and abuse in military spending, you are kidding yourself. As a fellow conservative I am in favor of a strong military, but we need to eliminate the wasteful spending. I have always contended we could maintain the most powerful military in the world, and reduce the defense budget at the same time by eliminating, NOT REDUCING, wasteful spending.
 
Conservative said:
I am not angry at all, frustrated with people like you complaining about what is going on in this country that you don't even understand. I live in TX, best move I ever made and the growing population here continues to be a huge issue because the opportunities here continue to outstrip those blue states around the country.
Click to expand...

Nobody cares.

That waste of govt. spending on what you call imperialism has kept this country safe and freed billions of people around the world. The true waste, fraud, and abuse is in social spending which is most of the US budget all because people like you have no problem with the Federal govt. taking over state and local social problems and throwing money at them never demanding actual verifiable results. All that does is make you feel good and feel like you are actually solving problems none of which are solved. Your answer is throw more money at it
Click to expand...

Hilarious coming from someone who has at least 80% of his medical costs subsidized by the Federal Government. Hypocrisy is your strong point!
 
Conservative said:
LOL, glad you aren't one of my kids. Would love to compare balance sheets with you all self made not looking for the govt. to do anything but give me equal opportunity which it did, I did the rest
Click to expand...

Cool story bro
 
Gimmesometruth said:
Again, I know yer argument, Texass is yer "utopia"....so secede already! I was in CA, reaching a personal economic peak, until the Bush recession wiped me, my wife....and everything we had built up over 30 years....completely out. It wasn't a matter of the state, the same thing would have happened in Phx had we stayed there, it was a matter of FEDERAL characteristics/inactions. State lines do not isolate, so again, yer argument completely phails.

But keep avoiding the answer to yer previous question, the one on the general health of a population based on the "socialism" of the govt.
Click to expand...

No need to, love making people like you miserable and watching you complain. As of the health of other countries, don't really give a damn but I do notice many leaders coming to this country for medical care. wonder why? Sounds to me like you would be better off in one of those countries since you cannot get your state to be more like them. Did you ever think that just maybe when you talk about health issues you aren't talking the same things and factors. Think personal choices here have any affect on health issues?
 
Kushinator said:
So why will they rise?
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They will rise when the economy grows and employment truly improves meaning there won't be 6 million Americans working part time for economic reasons and a 9.7% U-6 rate
 
mmi said:
Nov 2007 was a bubble high. When Obummer took office, the rate for Negroes was 13.7%. Eleven months later, as the effects of the GOP SSE Great Recession played through the labor market, it was 16.5%. So the failed policies you continue to support DOUBLED the rate for Negroes. This is why you Ignore my posts — cuz I continually expose yer lies and deceptions.

>>Seems that first black President hasn't done a lot of the African Americans in this country yet people like you still believe the rhetoric while ignoring the results

Last month's 8.4% (it was 8.2 in May) is half of what it was Jan 2010. "Thank you Obummer," say the Negroes. And when it was 8.5% in Nov 2007, the economy was on the verge of a collapse that would see it doubled. Not that way now, is it?



Fat cats have a lot of influence over the economy and the political system. The Negro didn't create that situation, but he is forced to deal with it. If the banks and the auto companies were severely damaged, the results for the country and the world would have been devastating. Better that equities are up than not.

>>the Fed's actions since 2007 have increased the wealth gap drastically and grown the number of rich and poor while shrinking the number of middle class Americans.

False. Inequality has diminished or at least slowed under the Negro.

View attachment 67205881

And tax policy has been the driver.

View attachment 67205882

>>since 2007, the national debt/FED balance sheet are massively higher.

The result of the GOP SSE Great Recession.

>Food stamp usage is WAY up, the home ownership rate is WAY down

Same thing, and the figures from Nov 2007 were produced by the bubble that burst. SNAP participation is now down by 4.3 million from Dec 2012 to its lowest level since Oct 2010.

>>the DOW has skyrocketed. And you say that is good for the poor/middle class?

Yes.

>>Big government helps the rich...not the poor.

Gubmint helps all Americans.
Click to expand...

The amount of stupid in this post is truly mind boggling. Nothing anyone can say will dissuade you and your ilk from the utterly stupid ideas you forward. The only thing Americans can do is defeat you by any means necessary. Trying to argue with idiots is an exercise in futility. Have a nice day. :)
 
Conservative said:
They will rise when the economy grows and employment truly improves meaning there won't be 6 million Americans working part time for economic reasons and a 9.7% U-6 rate
Click to expand...

They will rise when the demand for capital increases relative to the supply. The developed world is awash in cash; corporations have so much of it that they are willing to take on debt as a means of returning it to shareholders.
 
Conservative said:
QE lowered interest rates, the Fed is keeping them low because the economy is stagnant and there remains high under employment.
Click to expand...
FALSE, treasury notes are selling at the rate they are selling at.......because there are buyers who think that is a good return. If it was not, they would not sell. It is not an artificial rate.
Obama economic policies have done nothing to change human behavior as it relates to economic growth with some of that economic growth artificially inflated due to the stimulus and other govt. spending
Click to expand...
Apparently, from the results, the policies have created a better set of conditions for growth as compared to other major economies, a point made yesterday. Can't you remember argument already made? Why do you ALWAYS fall into this spiral of already failed argument........EVERY SINGLE DAY?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
They won't as long as the buyer is basically also the seller. ;)
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The Fed's balance sheet has been in decline, overnight rates have increased, and still Treasury rates are at or near all-time lows.
 
Kushinator said:
He believes interest rates increase because debt increases. It is a typical conservative talking point, that lacks any and all economic logic and understand of finance.
Click to expand...
Don't forget the "debt/inequality" correlation, another apparently new revelation.
 
Conservative said:
QE lowered interest rates, the Fed is keeping them low because the economy is stagnant and there remains high under employment. Obama economic policies have done nothing to change human behavior as it relates to economic growth with some of that economic growth artificially inflated due to the stimulus and other govt. spending
Click to expand...

QE is over, rates have increased, and Treasury yields moved opposite. How can this be the case?
 
Gimmesometruth said:
FALSE, treasury notes are selling at the rate they are selling at.......because there are buyers who think that is a good return. If it was not, they would not sell. It is not an artificial rate.Apparently, from the results, the policies have created a better set of conditions for growth as compared to other major economies, a point made yesterday. Can't you remember argument already made? Why do you ALWAYS fall into this spiral of already failed argument........EVERY SINGLE DAY?
Click to expand...

I keep waiting for someone of the left to tell me where the money comes from to fund those treasury notes when they come due? You think the average American and those in the 9.7% U-6 rate give a damn about other countries and their economic results? Interesting how people keep flocking to this country from those European utopias. Guess the Grass really is greener on the other side, isn't it. Have you been there?
 
Kushinator said:
QE is over, rates have increased, and Treasury yields moved opposite. How can this be the case?
Click to expand...

Yes, QE is over, the economy stagnant, U-6 rate is still historically high and the feds will continue to keep interest rates low in hopes of getting more of those under employed back to work thus creating more demand
 
ttwtt78640 said:
They won't as long as the buyer is basically also the seller. ;)

I often give myself free labor instead of just a steep discount on it.
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You do know that QE3 ended....back in 10/14....si senor?
 
Conservative said:
QE is over
Click to expand...

Why haven't interest rates increased?

the economy stagnant
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No, GDP growth is stagnant relative to the historic norm. Other aspects of the economy, e.g. the labor market, asset prices, etc... are doing quite well.

U-6 rate is still historically high
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False

fredgraph.png


and the feds will continue to keep interest rates low in hopes of getting more of those under employed back to work thus creating more demand
Click to expand...

They just raised the rates for the first time in 9 years. Why have treasury yields fallen as a response?
 
Conservative said:
I keep waiting for someone of the left to tell me where the money comes from to fund those treasury notes when they come due? You think the average American and those in the 9.7% U-6 rate give a damn about other countries and their economic results? Interesting how people keep flocking to this country from those European utopias. Guess the Grass really is greener on the other side, isn't it. Have you been there?
Click to expand...
do those who face long term unemployment look to other nations and want policies those "socialist" states practice.....where people are healthier, happier and live longer.....and want that for this nation too?

Really?


Let me get back to you on that.


FFS.
 
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