Lachean

Where is it written that everything that people need should be affordable or available to them? Just how does one's need justify their claim to the efforts or wealth of another?

Sorry but survival in this universe requires work, and of course there are problems with our healthcare system; mostly due to government involvement in the industry. The solution is not to take more of the poison that got us into this mess.

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"Men had always thought of wealth as a static quantity--to be seized, begged, inherited, shared, looted or obtained as a favor. Americans were the first to understand that wealth has to be created. The words 'to make money' hold the essence of human morality. " - Ayn Rand

donc

Sorry, didn’t think about posting the source of for my numbers ($6.55 (July 24, 2008) that is the minimum wage that goes into effect July 24, 2008.I guess I should have did the numbers with the current rate of $5.85 per hour. Much simpler take $.70 per hour of the 40-hour workweek, just makes the numbers more grim to everybody but the average compassionate conservative doesn’t it.

Here is the other link that you wanted. Notice that it is a 2007 date;there is some good news, and some bbad news, about healthcare ,the good news is the trend, according to” Pricewaterhouse” the report projects a slower health care spending growth rate in 2008.Notice it said slower growth rate not decreasing.

Now the bad news < The U.S. unemployment rate surged to 5.5 percent in May, its highest in more than 3-1/2 years, as the barely growing economy lost jobs for the fifth straight month.>another 324,000 American citizens will soon be without healthcare for their families.

WRAPUP 4-US jobless rate leaps to 3-1/2 year high in May | Markets | Markets News | Reuters


< n 2007, employer health insurance premiums increased by 6.1 percent - two times the rate of inflation. The annual premium for an employer health plan covering a family of four averaged nearly $12,100. The annual premium for single coverage averaged over $4,400.2>

NCHC | Facts About Healthcare - Health Insurance Cost

Jerry

I would appreciate it if you would stop confusing health *care* with health *insurance*.

I'm still waiting for you to source the example private health insurance plan you wish to use.

Unless I missed something, your source did not state the extent of coverage of the average private policy, and it is my first assertion that you should only have catastrophic health insurance and pay for all the little stuff like lab work yourself.

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......Lerxst is always right
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donc

I’ll tell you what Jerry, look carefully at the bottom half of post #13,see the link that says NCHC | Facts About Healthcare - Health Insurance Cost in addition to what I have posted you will find this.

< The annual premium that a health insurer charges an employer for a health plan covering a family of four averaged $12,100 in 2007. Workers contributed nearly $3,300, or 10 percent more than they did in 2006.2 The annual premiums for family coverage significantly eclipsed the gross earnings for a full-time, minimum-wage worker ($10,712).>

If that isn’t enough, and I have doubts it will be, because it was all in post #13 which you evidently ignored.

If your really energetic , go to the bottom of the link, there’s 19 cite/links that you can browse thru at your leisure.

Indy

Jerry,

I gotta say, everybody should be able to afford health insurance that isn't JUST catastrophic. That's pretty heartless. What makes you think that everyone can just cover the costs of all lab work and such? What if they get really sick but aren't necessarily covered in their "catastrophic" plan? There's no way they could afford the medication and such. You have to meet us in the middle if we are going to really create a serious healthcare plan for the nation. That's the point of this thread. How do we make sure that every citizen can guarantee they will be treated when they are sick? It may not be written in the constitution but it sure as hell should be a given when you are living in a FIRST WORLD NATION.

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Affiant further sayeth not.

Jerry

Yes, I ignored your source, which is why I qualified my statement with "Unless I missed something...", which represents my acknowledgment that I may be in error.

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Your souce does not identify what the policy covered. The average family may be taking what I am calling to much coverage. Your souce does not *only* represent "catastrophic coverage" (= high out-of-pocket and co-pay, low monthly premium).

Unless the average person in chronicly ill, the average person does not need more than catastrophic coverage. "Oh ****" insurance.

Jerry

Yes, everybody should be able to completely pay for their own private insurance policy of their choice. I agree.

Part of the ideology package I present here is that the average Joe saves an emergency fund. First up to $1,000, then they follow a simple thoery to get completely out of debt, then they build that $1,000 emergency fund up to cover 3-6 months of family expenses. Lab fees, co pays, etc, come out of the emergency fund.

You'll need to specify what the illness is and quote an actual policy that doesn't cover that illness in order for your vague hypothetical to have any fact to ground it in reality.

There should be NO national health care plan other than Social Security for the disabled at all. None.

It's okay to be a free adult individual, not dependent on Big Bro to take care of you or have a say in your private medical decisions.

We don't.

We set out options and let people make their own choices.

One great option is offering job training.

It should be earned through hard work.

donc

From the link we have established that the annual premium for single coverage averaged over $4,400,so lets give this guy a $1000.00 deductible, also let him/her pay the lab fees him/her self, until said deductible is met. Now were left with $3300.00 spread out over a 52 weeks, that comes out of his weekly pay of $225.00- $65.00=$160.00 now remember we have given this person ten hours OT per week if that is taken away it will represent almost half of his take home of$160.00 per week. Ok Jerry here’s your high deductible with 2007 numbers, his take home would be between $90.00 and $160.00 know any place he can rent for …say around a hundred a month?

Jerry

The established average annual premium for single coverage may be for a policy that is more than catastrophic. What is the average premium for catastrophic single coverage for someone in a minimum wage job?

We have not established that the hypothetical individual will have any lab fees or co-pays at all in our example year. How likely is this person to suffer a non-job-related serious illness or injury

People do go a long time with out becoming seriously ill or injured, and that must be taken into consideration.

Yes, I'm being a stone headed dick. It's ok to say it.

Jerry

I just got a quote for myself on https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi...ISSPELL%200527

My quote assumes that I am 30, male, a non smoker, non collage student, and single.



My quoted best premium is $1,010.40 annually.

I am not trying to make myself the hypothetical example, I am only demonstrating how insurance becomes affordable when you trim the fat off the policy and take only what you need.

Using my quote -vs- your average, I would save $3,000 simply by taking catastrophic. That $3,000, assuming I need to pay for medical atention at all in a given year, pays my entire out-of-pocket + $200.