• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

What It Takes To Get Academics to Defend Free Speech

LowDown

LowDown

Curmudgeon
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 19, 2012
Messages
14,185
Reaction score
8,768
Location
Houston
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

.....as long as there's a safe room nearby.....
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

If we had a way to rate bias for every accredited University in the United States, I believe the vast majority would rate left of center. Few would argue that Falwell's Liberty University stands out as right of center. Professors who garnish publicity for extreme views come from both sides. I live in Florida ... went to a Public University. It did not bother me a bit when FAU dismissed Professor James Tracy. Did his dismissal bother you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Tracy_(communication_scholar)
 
Trippy Trekker said:
If we had a way to rate bias for every accredited University in the United States, I believe the vast majority would rate left of center. Few would argue that Falwell's Liberty University stands out as right of center. Professors who garnish publicity for extreme views come from both sides. I live in Florida ... went to a Public University. It did not bother me a bit when FAU dismissed Professor James Tracy. Did his dismissal bother you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Tracy_(communication_scholar)
Click to expand...

This latter belief led Tracy to allegedly harass the parents of a Sandy Hook victim, demanding they give him proof of their son's death
Click to expand...
This is why he was dismissed. He was harrassing people in the country. He was not dismissed for expressing his views.
 
joG said:
.....as long as there's a safe room nearby.....
Click to expand...

Yeah... safe rooms for college students. I can't wipe away my grin! This reminds me of the child care room in my local YMCA. I use to drop off my toddler children during my workouts.
 
Assuming it was a private twitter account the only response the University should have made was that it has no business meddling in the private speech of it's employees. That and perhaps a statement that the university disagrees with the sentiments.

As for the professor he needs to learn to communicate better. Assuming it was satire using twitter was stupid. It's hard enough to properly convey satire when you have a unlimited number of characters. Choosing twitter instead of something like Medium pretty much guaranteed people were going to misunderstand him.

On the basic premise of the OP - college is supposed to make you uncomfortable. That's the point. Grow up and get over it (not you Lowdown but people who hold anti free speech views regarding universities).
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

The very real psychotic melt down by so many young people apparently shaken to the core by Hillary's loss should be a wakeup call to all citizens as to the state of education, and the effort of the people who provide it.

All should be very concerned with the level of propaganda and indoctrination taking place in our education system, such that we would witness such a truly alarming reaction.
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

You seem to not understand the right to free speech and what it entails and does not. Being disinvited to speech is not a violation of free speech. When you learn what rights are, and that they apply to every one, then maybe you can start to lecture others on rights. Until then you are just looking silly.
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

Indeed. Spot on. The worst part of it is that behavior like this is being instilled in the student they are teaching, held up as a shining example. No telling what the longer term fall out from these student is going to be in the future. Remember? Students are our future.

joG said:
.....as long as there's a safe room nearby.....
Click to expand...

:lamo
 
Trippy Trekker said:
Yeah... safe rooms for college students. I can't wipe away my grin! This reminds me of the child care room in my local YMCA. I use to drop off my toddler children during my workouts.
Click to expand...

You mean to say that the sight of you doing a workout is the thing children's nightmares are made of?

;)
 
ocean515 said:
The very real psychotic melt down by so many young people apparently shaken to the core by Hillary's loss should be a wakeup call to all citizens as to the state of education, and the effort of the people who provide it.
Click to expand...
That's a wake up call that'll go unanswered, just as we've seen unanswered by the Democratic party members, leftists, liberals, and progressives alike.
ocean515 said:
All should be very concerned with the level of propaganda and indoctrination taking place in our education system, such that we would witness such a truly alarming reaction.
Click to expand...

Indeed we should be concerned. Very concerned. Students are our future.
 
Redress said:
You seem to not understand the right to free speech and what it entails and does not. Being disinvited to speech is not a violation of free speech. When you learn what rights are, and that they apply to every one, then maybe you can start to lecture others on rights. Until then you are just looking silly.
Click to expand...

How silly. Being disinvited to speak at a public forum is prior restraint of free speech.
 
LowDown said:
How silly. Being disinvited to speak at a public forum is prior restraint of free speech.
Click to expand...

No, actually it is not. Freedom of speech means the government won't tell you what you can say or not say. It does not mean that you will be given a platform for your speech, nor that people cannot choose to associate with who they want or not. Seriously, learn what rights are. Then lecture. Until then, you are just going to fail.
 
LowDown said:
How silly. Being disinvited to speak at a public forum is prior restraint of free speech.
Click to expand...

The speaker could have still shown up, with a soapbox and said whatever he wanted for free. The fact is, they prob read transcripts from their other speaking engagements and found them to be substandard or unnecessarily inflaming rhetoric and chose to not pay them for their bs.

The concept of free speech doesn't entitle every crazy person spouting nonsense the right to be heard, and to charge you to hear it. It protects you from going to jail for expressing yourself. Are these speakers in jail? No? Then get over it snowflake.
 
Redress said:
You seem to not understand the right to free speech and what it entails and does not. Being disinvited to speech is not a violation of free speech. When you learn what rights are, and that they apply to every one, then maybe you can start to lecture others on rights. Until then you are just looking silly.
Click to expand...

True enough. Private universities do not have to respect free speech - public ones do. I'd suggest though that not respecting free speech rights and not subjecting students to viewpoints other that their own runs contrary to the universities' education mission.
 
Gaius46 said:
True enough. Private universities do not have to respect free speech - public ones do. I'd suggest though that not respecting free speech rights and not subjecting students to viewpoints other that their own runs contrary to the universities' education mission.
Click to expand...

Sorta. Public universities cannot limit free speech rights, but they are not obligated to invite any one to speak at an event, and are free to disinvite them from speaking at an event. They are still free to say whatever they want in any public place on campus. There is no right to be an invited speaker.
 
Redress said:
No, actually it is not. Freedom of speech means the government won't tell you what you can say or not say. It does not mean that you will be given a platform for your speech, nor that people cannot choose to associate with who they want or not. Seriously, learn what rights are. Then lecture. Until then, you are just going to fail.
Click to expand...

A right to free speech does not necessarily stop with government restraint but extends to society in general. All efforts to stop speech or to attack the speaker may be considered violations of this right. The only morally correct form of censorship is for the individual to decide not to listen.

Stop being silly. Of course keeping people from speaking because of their politics is a violation of their rights, and also the rights of the people who invited them to speak, whether or not it's strictly a violation of the law, and whether or not, for example, universities are entitled to disinvite speakers.

Everyone has a right to free speech, but there are those that are better advised not to use it, particularly those who don't have a clue what they are talking about.
 
LowDown said:
A right to free speech does not necessarily stop with government restraint but extends to society in general. All efforts to stop speech or to attack the speaker may be considered violations of this right. The only morally correct form of censorship is for the individual to decide not to listen.

Stop being silly. Of course keeping people from speaking because of their politics is a violation of their rights, and also the rights of the people who invited them to speak, whether or not it's strictly a violation of the law.

Everyone has a right to free speech, but there are those that are better advised not to use it, particularly those who don't have a clue what they are talking about.
Click to expand...

That is ****ing stupid. If I own a business, and you come in yelling racial epitaphs, I am going to throw you out. That is neither a violation of your free speech, nor is it "morally incorrect".

Edit: that is not to suggest you would do such a thing.
 
Trippy Trekker said:
If we had a way to rate bias for every accredited University in the United States, I believe the vast majority would rate left of center. Few would argue that Falwell's Liberty University stands out as right of center. Professors who garnish publicity for extreme views come from both sides. I live in Florida ... went to a Public University. It did not bother me a bit when FAU dismissed Professor James Tracy. Did his dismissal bother you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Tracy_(communication_scholar)
Click to expand...

It would bother me if he was fired for what he said, but his actions went beyond expressing his opinions.
 
joG said:
You mean to say that the sight of you doing a workout is the thing children's nightmares are made of?

;)
Click to expand...

While meandering slightly off topic, much like Ted Cruz reminded me of Grandpa Munster, I do think I resemble Tiny Tim. The thought of Tiny Tim doing workouts in front of children disturbs me! Reminder to self - Do not workout in front of children- EVER!
 
Redress said:
That is ****ing stupid. If I own a business, and you come in yelling racial epitaphs, I am going to throw you out. That is neither a violation of your free speech, nor is it "morally incorrect".

Edit: that is not to suggest you would do such a thing.
Click to expand...

I don't think what I wrote could reasonably be said to imply that the right to free speech is absolute.

But if a scholar is invited to speak, the venue is available and approved at least initially, and that approval is reversed because of threats made by the usual suspects, then I'd call it a clear cut case of unjustifiable violation of free speech rights. Students who try to disrupt speech should be expelled or otherwise disciplined. Universities should not cave to threats. Using politics as a litmus test for who gets to speak is an especially egregious form of unjustified censorship.
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

You have a problem with satire?
 
Redress said:
Sorta. Public universities cannot limit free speech rights, but they are not obligated to invite any one to speak at an event, and are free to disinvite them from speaking at an event. They are still free to say whatever they want in any public place on campus. There is no right to be an invited speaker.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Though again the university mission is to teach people to think and they fail at that when they don't allow students to be exposed to viewpoints other than their own.
 
Redress said:
That is ****ing stupid. If I own a business, and you come in yelling racial epitaphs, I am going to throw you out. That is neither a violation of your free speech, nor is it "morally incorrect".

Edit: that is not to suggest you would do such a thing.
Click to expand...

Youre confusing the legal freedom of speech, with the concept of freedom of speech. The op is clearly talking about the latter, and how the public should defend the concept whether its legally required or not. Even worse is that publicly funded educational institutes do not protect speech.

And stop with the flaming. The op has treated you civilly, you should do the same.
 
LowDown said:
Drexel, Twitter and Academic Freedom

In a year when a record number of conservative speakers have been disinvited from speaking at universities, it's good to see that a university will ultimately defend the concept of free speech. All it takes is for one of their crazy hard left wing professors to tweet out something like "let's kill all the white people" and they'll jump to defend him and whatever he said as protected by free speech rights and academic freedom. A conservative coming to talk about, say, 2nd Amendment rights, or to be critical of campus crybullies, that's forbidden. But a professor calling for white genocide? Well...free speech! academic freedom!

God Damned Hypocrites is what they are. :devil:
Click to expand...

Can you point out this horde of liberals defending this statement?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom