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Democracy is Gone in the USA

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But Trump will fix it

There is no democracy in the United States. Nor does the United States bring democracy to other countries. In fact, the United States does not even really want democracy in other countries. The only ideology supported by the ruling elites in the US is the ideology of monopoly capitalism. One can call it the free market or one can call it neoliberalism; one can call it the American Way. What it is is this: a brutal, bloody, destructive and immoral attempt to rule the planet, no matter what the cost in lives and environmental destruction. The marriage to the amoral system of profiteering known as capitalism has created an immensely immoral number of men and women willing to carry out the brutality and bloodshed necessary to reap that profit.

As the paragraph above implies, in order to maintain such a system there must be humans willing to do the dirty work that maintenance entails. Of course, those humans must be organized and, of course they are. Security forces, both public and private, form the front lines of the system’s defenders. Military corps are also part of that line. Legislators serve their role too, making laws that benefit the wealthy elites and providing the money for their domination. Then there are the organizations that do the dirtiest and therefore, the least known work. This is where the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA), National Security Agency (NSA), and other secret police agencies come in. This is where the common brutality of the military and police transforms into a violence that makes Hollywood’s blood and gore cartoonish in contrast. While these deeds are not new to the current time, the events known as 9-11 have allowed those who champion them to make their actions public. The events that transpire in CIA black sites around the world are often too gruesome to be believed.51zbwgdhcal-_sx331_bo1204203200_

There was a program known as the Phoenix Program that was established by the CIA during the Vietnam War. The point of this program was to eliminate popular support for the revolutionary forces in Vietnam. The means utilized by those running the program included bribery, torture, murder of suspected revolutionaries, their supporters and their families. Despite the pervasiveness of the program it failed. Nonetheless, many of its architects have lived to fight another day, using it as a model for US imperial adventures subsequent to Vietnam in Central America, Asia and even in the United States.
Indeed, it is its replication in the United States that is the ultimate argument of author Douglas Valentine’s latest book examining the skullduggery, murder and deceit the Phoenix Program was synonymous with. This book, titled The CIA as Organized Crime: How Illegal Operations Corrupt America and the World, is a collection of previous articles, supplementary texts and completely new material that examines the connections between the implementation of the Phoenix Program in Vietnam and its ongoing utilization as a model for subsequent counterinsurgency operations by the CIA and other agencies. As Valentine makes clear, some of those connections are merely philosophical while others are as pinpoint as some of the same individuals who built their early careers on Phoenix are now operating inside the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and other top-secret US agencies—many of them enhanced in the wake of the events of 9-11.

There is no better investigator to write this book. Valentine’s best known title is the consummate text on the Phoenix Program, The Phoenix Program: America’s Use of Terror in Vietnam. Not only does this mean that his understanding of the complexities and subterfuges of Phoenix is fairly sophisticated, it also means he knows many of the personalities. This knowledge helps him draw what can only be considered a menacing number of connections from the development of the counterinsurgency template of the Phoenix Program to the creation and development of the US national security apparatus now in place around the globe. His discussion of the hierarchy of units leading all the way to CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia from hamlets in Vietnam and their replication in so-called fusion centers set up around the United States by the Department of Homeland Security since its inception is but one instance of the insidiousness of the Phoenix template. His naming of various individuals—like DHS commandant Bruce Lawlor—is proof that old death squad warriors don’t just go away, they are given more power. While Valentine reveals the dark side of US power, he also uncloaks the venality of many of those involved in these endeavors. In addition, his investigation leads this writer to believe that this is not the deep state so many conspiracists talk about; this is the state itself.

Democracy is Gone in the USA
 
Umm the US was never a democracy.
 
The Phoenix program was a wonderful program. Certain soldiers went into hostile villages, identified the Viet Cong representatives then came back under cover of weather or darkness and killed them. This allowed villages to be free of Viet Cong. These weren't all villages, just stragetic ones. This alone saved many American lives as well as Vietnamese civilian lives.

Most were subsistence farmers having to give up poultry, pigs, vegetables, and rice as the price of staying alive.

Wars are funny that way. It's the classic "kill the officers, not the privates" stragety. Works for me.

Actually there us still a lot of "off the books" killing going on. Keeps our special operators sharp
 
What left wingers leave out in their accounts of US activities after WWII is that we were at war with the Soviet Union. It was a Cold War, a proxy war, but it was every bit as brutal, violent, and bloody as any war. The Soviets and their allies were trying to cut the US off from resources and allies and kill it. The US was struggling to defend itself and neutralize the Soviets. Any sort of war time activity recounted as if it were done for no reason against no enemy would seem unnecessary and wrong, but that's not how it was. US actions ofttimes seem brutal, but they were done in response to brutalities on the other side.
 
But Trump will fix it

There is no democracy in the United States.

Democracy is Gone in the USA

lets see..... house elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy
lets see.....senate elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy

https://www.britannica.com/topic/direct-democracy

Direct democracy, also called pure democracy, forms of direct participation of citizens in democratic decision making in contrast to indirect or representative democracy, based on the sovereignty of the people. This can happen in the form of an assembly democracy or by initiative and referendum with ballot voting, with direct voting on issues instead of for candidates or parties. Sometimes the term is also used for electing representatives in a direct vote as opposed to indirect elections (by voting for an electing body, electoral college, etc.) as well as for recalling elected officeholders. Direct democracy may be understood as a full-scale system of political institutions, but in modern times, it means most often specific decision-making institutions in the broader system environment of representative democracy.[/QUOTE]
 
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lets see..... house elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy
lets see.....senate elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy

House elected by gerrymandered remaps that change every ten years.

With states gaining and losing congressional districts; therefore not the same as the whole state.

17th amendment adopted in 1914 due to corruption in state legislatures and deadlocks in choosing Senators that often led to states not having Senators for 2 to 4 years .
 
House elected by gerrymandered remaps that change every ten years.

With states gaining and losing congressional districts; therefore not the same as the whole state.

17th amendment adopted in 1914 due to corruption in state legislatures and deadlocks in choosing Senators that often led to states not having Senators for 2 to 4 years .

has no bearing on what i have said.....
 
What left wingers leave out in their accounts of US activities after WWII is that we were at war with the Soviet Union. It was a Cold War, a proxy war, but it was every bit as brutal, violent, and bloody as any war. The Soviets and their allies were trying to cut the US off from resources and allies and kill it. The US was struggling to defend itself and neutralize the Soviets. Any sort of war time activity recounted as if it were done for no reason against no enemy would seem unnecessary and wrong, but that's not how it was. US actions ofttimes seem brutal, but they were done in response to brutalities on the other side.

But they won't be doing that anymore since Putin and trump .
 
Democracy has been under attack from the elite, they who decided to ignore the "dead enders" or what ever the insult of the day is for people who dont agree with them, people who in spite of being right with the law and also often very productive and often found giving of self while taking care of community and family are said by the asshole elites to be so reprehensible that we must be shut down, disappeared, must be not allowed to speak and this maybe infect the next generation, those who are being raised to hopefully one day inhabit Utopia.

In their fantasy bus ride to Utopia we were going to be pushed down, then we were going to die, and that would be that.

no




Trump is the START to the fix.
 
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Eisenhower talked about all this back in 1961 in his 'Military-Industrial Complex' retirement speech.

Ike was a great man who did a lot of good things for the USA.
 
now trump is filling up the cabinet with billionaire elites

good news, huh?
 
lets see..... house elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy
lets see.....senate elected by the people...hmmm direct democracy

https://www.britannica.com/topic/direct-democracy

Direct democracy, also called pure democracy, forms of direct participation of citizens in democratic decision making in contrast to indirect or representative democracy, based on the sovereignty of the people. This can happen in the form of an assembly democracy or by initiative and referendum with ballot voting, with direct voting on issues instead of for candidates or parties. Sometimes the term is also used for electing representatives in a direct vote as opposed to indirect elections (by voting for an electing body, electoral college, etc.) as well as for recalling elected officeholders. Direct democracy may be understood as a full-scale system of political institutions, but in modern times, it means most often specific decision-making institutions in the broader system environment of representative democracy.

Dude! That was hilarious!

Please tell me that was satire. It is very hard to tell on the internet.

On the off chance it was not satire, a direct democracy functions as a vote by the public on every single point of order where as we have a representative republic that elects representatives and senators. We also don't elect our president. The president is elected by the states. The states happen to use popular vote to determine for whom they will vote.
 
Not a pure one but it is very much a democracy AND a republic.

we need to roll back the power of the federal government and reinstate state power as it was intended.
 
The world has never had it so good - thanks partly to capitalism - Telegraph

Contrary to what environmentalists, anti-globalisation campaigners and other economic curmudgeons like to think, the world is not going to hell in a handbasket.

Immense problems remain, of course, from Europe’s youth unemployment crisis to atrocious cases of extreme child poverty around the globe, and it is the duty of all of us to highlight and address them.

But humanity as a whole is doing better than it ever has: the world is becoming more prosperous, cleaner, increasingly peaceful and healthier. We are living longer, better lives. Virtually all of our existing problems are less bad than at any previous time in history.

Ends justify the means, I guess. Works for me.
 
we need to roll back the power of the federal government and reinstate state power as it was intended.

Specifically what powers should the states have that was usurped by the federal government?
 
Specifically what powers should the states have that was usurped by the federal government?

I don't have all that many issues when states are prohibited from restricting the rights that are guaranteed by the constitution but there are many federal laws that should be eliminated based on the tenth amendment (and restricting the commerce clause to allowing congress to regulate state level interference with commerce-the CC was NEVER intended to allow federal control over individuals operating in their own home states

so I would get rid of

1) all federal gun control-restrictions on use of firearms or those who can own them is a state matter
2) narcotics-if the citizens of Colorado want to have legal weed-so be it
3) welfare

are all areas that the federal government only gained the power to enact based on the dishonest FDR expansions.

state power is self policing in many ways. For example, if one state is too generous in terms of welfare, it will attract lots of deadbeats and public teat sucklers. It will have to tax tax and tax productive people to pay for that and many will leave. that state will either go bankrupt or will have to change its ways.

and that is what the founders intended. allowing the states to experiment with various policies and if the policies are bad, the harm will be somewhat contained
 
we need to roll back the power of the federal government and reinstate state power as it was intended.

A weaker federal government would take some of the anger out of these elections, that is for sure. IMO, one reason these things get so heated is because the federal government is having more and more impact on the lives of the people instead of less and less. So, I agree, we need to cut that monster back down to size.
 
A weaker federal government would take some of the anger out of these elections, that is for sure. IMO, one reason these things get so heated is because the federal government is having more and more impact on the lives of the people instead of less and less. So, I agree, we need to cut that monster back down to size.

A government big enough to give you everything you want, can take away everything you have
 
I don't have all that many issues when states are prohibited from restricting the rights that are guaranteed by the constitution but there are many federal laws that should be eliminated based on the tenth amendment (and restricting the commerce clause to allowing congress to regulate state level interference with commerce-the CC was NEVER intended to allow federal control over individuals operating in their own home states

so I would get rid of

1) all federal gun control-restrictions on use of firearms or those who can own them is a state matter
2) narcotics-if the citizens of Colorado want to have legal weed-so be it
3) welfare

are all areas that the federal government only gained the power to enact based on the dishonest FDR expansions.

state power is self policing in many ways. For example, if one state is too generous in terms of welfare, it will attract lots of deadbeats and public teat sucklers. It will have to tax tax and tax productive people to pay for that and many will leave. that state will either go bankrupt or will have to change its ways.

and that is what the founders intended. allowing the states to experiment with various policies and if the policies are bad, the harm will be somewhat contained

Did the founders want to allow states to fail completely? There was a war fought to preserve the union. Allowing states to fail weakens the union.
 
Did the founders want to allow states to fail completely? There was a war fought to preserve the union. Allowing states to fail weakens the union.

who said anything about completely failing? movement from state to state would be most edifying
 
we need to roll back the power of the federal government and reinstate state power as it was intended.

You mean the system the founders scrapped as unworkable? Or the one where one region of the country got to control the presidency and the second it felt like it couldn't do that anymore it committed treason en masse?

That system?
 
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