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We Need To Give Trump a Chance

A random insult followed by a random prognostication. I do not accept that you can see into the future Tucker unless you are a paid up member of the American Association of Clairvoyants and Allied Trades.

I can see into the past, which is why I called Trump a con man.

As far as my "prognostication", one does not require a crystal ball to see the reality that building a wall will not end illegal immigration (40% of current illegals simply overstay their visas). One does not need to be psychic to understand that "extreme vetting" will do nothing whatsoever to to affect terrorist attacks on US soil (since 9/11, almost all attacks carried out on US soil involved either natural born citizens or people who immigrated as minors. In fact, I believe that only one Islamic terrorist attack carried on on US soil since 9/11 involved a person who immigrated as an adult (the LA airport shooting in 2002).

One does not need to be a psychic to realize that trump's "intentions" will not achieve any goals of value. One does need to be capable of objective analysis of reality, though.
 
Shouldn't give a corrupt establishment politician "a chance" either.

When choosing between a corrupt establishment politician and a known con artist, a rational person takes the corrupt establishment politician. This is because the corrupt establishment has not actually destroyed the country. A known con man who wasn't even able to run a casino profitably is a terrible choice in every conceivable way.

think of it this way. I hate McDonald's. But if I'm forced to eat McDonald's, I don't take a **** in it before I eat it. While it is certainly up for debate on whether or not this would improve the taste, it definitely unhygienic (to say the least) and you would probably get sick from it. sometimes, it's better to just eat your Big Mac today and hope that you get a chance to go to Five Guys four years from now.
 
"Conservative author David Horowitz and political commentator Pamela Geller—both Jews—wrote columns defending Bannon."

Bannon is defended by a bunch of right-wing Jewish racists, and we are supposed to take this to mean anything?

If one were reasonable, wouldn't one take away from this that Bannon is no antisemite?
 
When choosing between a corrupt establishment politician and a known con artist, a rational person takes the corrupt establishment politician. This is because the corrupt establishment has not actually destroyed the country. A known con man who wasn't even able to run a casino profitably is a terrible choice in every conceivable way.

think of it this way. I hate McDonald's. But if I'm forced to eat McDonald's, I don't take a **** in it before I eat it. While it is certainly up for debate on whether or not this would improve the taste, it definitely unhygienic (to say the least) and you would probably get sick from it. sometimes, it's better to just eat your Big Mac today and hope that you get a chance to go to Five Guys four years from now.

I don't think we are ever going to agree on this, as I see it as the reverse.

With Hillary's pay to play, foreign money, 'favors' she owed to both foreign and domestic special interests, and her corrupt nature (as proven by a long history of such), I saw (and still see) that as a far worse threat to the nation.

So using your analogy, I guess it's whether to eat a **** sandwich or inject **** directly into your veins. I would choose the former.

All that aside, Trump hasn't taken office, hasn't issued a single official order or legislative initiative, and already those who are against him are already clamoring, without a basis in fact (premature and / or predisposed I believe it's called).

Trump's been underestimated during the primary and during the general, and those that continue to underestimate him do so without a strong track record. He may turn out to be an effective and capable manager, leader, and CEO (think about it, he's been all these things for most of his working life), and a pragmatic on at that.

A Lesson in Cognitive Dissonance
Scott Adams' Blog,
Posted November 23rd, 2016
A Lesson in Cognitive Dissonance | Scott Adams' Blog

Imagine you are one of the anti-Trump folks who believe we just elected a racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-semitic, science-denying dictator. Let’s say that’s the movie playing in your mind. That’s some scary stuff. Now imagine watching the news as Trump reveals in slow-motion that he’s flexible and pragmatic on just about everything. Thomas Friedman at the New York Times just reported that Trump is – as of yesterday anyway – open-minded about climate-change science, and Trump is no longer in favor of waterboarding terror suspects.
 
IMO he is a sorry excuse for a human being.

That's so much better Carleen. In the US you had your chance to vote against Trump. For sixty years no one in Cuba had a chance to vote against Castro - or even to call him names without putting their life and liberty into serious danger.
 
If one were reasonable, wouldn't one take away from this that Bannon is no antisemite?

When reasonable Jews defend Bannon against accusations of anti-Semitism, let me know.
 
When reasonable Jews defend Bannon against accusations of anti-Semitism, let me know.

It's up to you now, what a reasonable and an unreasonable Jew is? Really?

I guess it just goes to show you that if you really, really are determined to find something you'll find it, even if it is only in your imagination.
 
Trump's been underestimated during the primary and during the general, and those that continue to underestimate him do so without a strong track record.

I disagree on this. Trump wasn't underestimated, the electorate was overestimated.

Personally, I've thought Trump was working a brilliant con-job from the start and I was one of the people who expected him to pick up the Republican nomination early.

Admittedly, I thought that the people would see through it in the general, and on that count I was wrong. Trump knows how to manipulate the media perfectly. He also intuitively understands that the path to the election does not involve appealing to people's intelligence (it's just a matter of statistics and the bell curve).

Basically, if you look at Trump's campaign objectively, it's a perfect "how to" on running a mass-level con. Wishy-washy declarations, non-stop appeals to emotion, populist pandering, media manipulation. Objectively speaking, it was a thing of beauty.

My greatest hope was that he was enough of a narcissist that he would try to go down in history as a great president, and thus he would go against his promises and instead enact real policies that would make an actual difference. Alas, his cabinet picks show he does not know how to accomplish this.

He may turn out to be an effective and capable manager, leader, and CEO (think about it, he's been all these things for most of his working life), and a pragmatic on at that.


That's just it, though. He hasn't those things. For example, he bankrupted a casino. A casino, the most rigged system on the planet for making money, and his went bankrupt. Yet he made a fortune while those businesses failed. His investors, who he conned, lost their asses.

I don't call him a con-man based solely on his campaign. I've done a lot of research into his business style over the years and came to a simple conclusion: He's an exceptionally accomplished con man. If you view his campaign objectively through the lens of understanding this simple fact, everything he does makes sense and, more importantly, he becomes more predictable. Provided you know what his "marks" want to hear.

For example, when news of his settlement over Trump university broke, I said to my wife, "Trump's about to say something stupid to distract from this." Next thing you know, Hamilton. Perfect choice. A bunch of citified urban elitist liberals who unfairly criticize decent honest white folk for no good reason. Who gives a **** if what they said wasn't even the least bit objectionable? His marks find the people making the statement objectionable. Actually, his other "marks" (hyper-reactive liberals who are easily distracted by the "shiny") fell in step, too.

So the conversation is shifted away from one that is potentially harmful to him with his primary "marks" to one where they are defending him from the irrational attacks of hyper-sensitive politically correct liberals.

It's a brilliant masters class on mass manipulation in 140 characters or less.
 
Look guys, I've vehemently disagreed with Donald Trump on many issues throughout the course of his presidential campaign. I certainly don't like the fact that he is our President (although I wouldn't have been happy with a Clinton presidency either, as I hate them both).

But I do think we all need to give Donald Trump a chance. If you noticed, he's changed his tune significantly after he won the election. It's like an entirely different person just replaced the volatile, rude, and incredibly explicit Trump we all loathe and despise. I'm thinking that because of that, he might actually be able to do some good over the course of the next 4 years. If he can be reasonable, it can be possible to work together with him. But we have to be willing to do that first.

However, if he does something unforgivable, I will be happy to throw Trumpster under the dumpster.


aint gonna happen. a birther gets no leeway he just gets attack mode
 
I don't think we are ever going to agree on this, as I see it as the reverse.

With Hillary's pay to play, foreign money, 'favors' she owed to both foreign and domestic special interests, and her corrupt nature (as proven by a long history of such), I saw (and still see) that as a far worse threat to the nation.

So using your analogy, I guess it's whether to eat a **** sandwich or inject **** directly into your veins. I would choose the former.

All that aside, Trump hasn't taken office, hasn't issued a single official order or legislative initiative, and already those who are against him are already clamoring, without a basis in fact (premature and / or predisposed I believe it's called).

Trump's been underestimated during the primary and during the general, and those that continue to underestimate him do so without a strong track record. He may turn out to be an effective and capable manager, leader, and CEO (think about it, he's been all these things for most of his working life), and a pragmatic on at that.



using clintons incompetence to defend trump is absurd. trying to defend a woman groper, birther isnt something civil people will do.
 
Your post is incomplete Carleen. It requires an "in my opinion" to be added to it. My opinion is that Mr Trump is, in fact, a human being, much like you and me.


time to redo english 101. saying IMO is really bad usage. everything one says is opinion unless some sort of attribution is used. saying IMO is teeny bopper facebook ignorance.
 
time to redo english 101. saying IMO is really bad usage. everything one says is opinion unless some sort of attribution is used. saying IMO is teeny bopper facebook ignorance.


IYDO - that means 'In Your Dim Opinion' - Katzgar. But thank you for taking the trouble to offer your advice.
 
I disagree on this. Trump wasn't underestimated, the electorate was overestimated.

Got it. Voters are stupid (at least when they don't vote how you want them to).
You are failing to grasp that all those you (as well as many other liberals / progressives) insult with your arrogance don't like it, and this time around they voted against your preferences. From my view it's a legitimate repudiation of this liberal / progressive arrogance as well as a repudiation of liberal / progressive policies that have made the mess that the nation finds itself in. Now that so many have voted as they have, next time it'll be easier to vote against the same.

Personally, I've thought Trump was working a brilliant con-job from the start and I was one of the people who expected him to pick up the Republican nomination early.

Admittedly, I thought that the people would see through it in the general, and on that count I was wrong. Trump knows how to manipulate the media perfectly. He also intuitively understands that the path to the election does not involve appealing to people's intelligence (it's just a matter of statistics and the bell curve).

Basically, if you look at Trump's campaign objectively, it's a perfect "how to" on running a mass-level con. Wishy-washy declarations, non-stop appeals to emotion, populist pandering, media manipulation. Objectively speaking, it was a thing of beauty.

My greatest hope was that he was enough of a narcissist that he would try to go down in history as a great president, and thus he would go against his promises and instead enact real policies that would make an actual difference. Alas, his cabinet picks show he does not know how to accomplish this.




That's just it, though. He hasn't those things. For example, he bankrupted a casino. A casino, the most rigged system on the planet for making money, and his went bankrupt. Yet he made a fortune while those businesses failed. His investors, who he conned, lost their asses.

I don't call him a con-man based solely on his campaign. I've done a lot of research into his business style over the years and came to a simple conclusion: He's an exceptionally accomplished con man. If you view his campaign objectively through the lens of understanding this simple fact, everything he does makes sense and, more importantly, he becomes more predictable. Provided you know what his "marks" want to hear.

For example, when news of his settlement over Trump university broke, I said to my wife, "Trump's about to say something stupid to distract from this." Next thing you know, Hamilton. Perfect choice. A bunch of citified urban elitist liberals who unfairly criticize decent honest white folk for no good reason. Who gives a **** if what they said wasn't even the least bit objectionable? His marks find the people making the statement objectionable. Actually, his other "marks" (hyper-reactive liberals who are easily distracted by the "shiny") fell in step, too.

So the conversation is shifted away from one that is potentially harmful to him with his primary "marks" to one where they are defending him from the irrational attacks of hyper-sensitive politically correct liberals.

It's a brilliant masters class on mass manipulation in 140 characters or less.

<*sigh*> Fine. Fine. You keep believing that, and avoid the far more unpleasant (for liberal / progressive anyway) truth.

We are witnessing the end of the liberal era
By Nile Gardiner, Updated 12:36 PM ET, Mon November 21, 2016
We are witnessing the end of the liberal era (Opinion) - CNN.com
 
no advice offered just correct usage
How comforting it must be to know that whatever view one has it is the 'correct' one. For my part I will gladly accept your dictates on matter of correct usages in Prairieville, LA, but not anywhere further than 10 miles outside the city limits.

( I cannot find Prairieville in my dog-eared Rand McNally. Do you really know where you are?)
 
How comforting it must be to know that whatever view one has it is the 'correct' one. For my part I will gladly accept your dictates on matter of correct usages in Prairieville, LA, but not anywhere further than 10 miles outside the city limits.

( I cannot find Prairieville in my dog-eared Rand McNally. Do you really know where you are?)



ah yes classic right wing ignorance. to be expected. have your nurse show you how to use gmaps.
 
Trump was not my first choice, nor my second. I was never much of a fan. I only voted for him because Hillary seemed the greater evil to me.


Nonetheless, he is going to be President shortly, so I hope he does well. Hopefully he will get good advice and listen carefully before making important decisions. We will see.


He might surprise us all and be a good President. Or not; it will be at least a year or two down the road before we can really judge, since he hasn't even taken office yet.


The incredible hysteria I see from some who seem to think they're at risk of being shipped off to Auschwitz simply for being a leftist is just ludicrous. Godwin's Law is much in evidence.
 
Look at his choices for his team His VP believes that electroshocking someone out of being gay is a viable therapy. His AG has fought against civil rights for years, his Education Secretary opposes public schooling, his "Special Advisor" runs a website which gives a voice to neo-nazis and white supremacists. How many chances does he need?
 
Look guys, I've vehemently disagreed with Donald Trump on many issues throughout the course of his presidential campaign. I certainly don't like the fact that he is our President (although I wouldn't have been happy with a Clinton presidency either, as I hate them both).

But I do think we all need to give Donald Trump a chance. If you noticed, he's changed his tune significantly after he won the election. It's like an entirely different person just replaced the volatile, rude, and incredibly explicit Trump we all loathe and despise. I'm thinking that because of that, he might actually be able to do some good over the course of the next 4 years. If he can be reasonable, it can be possible to work together with him. But we have to be willing to do that first.

However, if he does something unforgivable, I will be happy to throw Trumpster under the dumpster.

I'd be curious. What would you consider unforgivable?
 
Um, we did give him a chance. He had a year to show what kind of human being he is, we lent him our ear and he spent that year demonstrating that he's a gigantic piece of ****.

No "we" didn't. Trump ran a campaign. Possibly the most successful campaign in US history. Trump beat all the competition. That's a success story.

Now it's a new ball game. I agree with the governess. Give him a chance. We'll know soon enough what he can and will do.
 
Look guys, I've vehemently disagreed with Donald Trump on many issues throughout the course of his presidential campaign. I certainly don't like the fact that he is our President (although I wouldn't have been happy with a Clinton presidency either, as I hate them both).

But I do think we all need to give Donald Trump a chance. If you noticed, he's changed his tune significantly after he won the election. It's like an entirely different person just replaced the volatile, rude, and incredibly explicit Trump we all loathe and despise. I'm thinking that because of that, he might actually be able to do some good over the course of the next 4 years. If he can be reasonable, it can be possible to work together with him. But we have to be willing to do that first.

However, if he does something unforgivable, I will be happy to throw Trumpster under the dumpster.

Thank you for this post. I count you among those on the left side of the aisle who actually reasons and uses logic instead of just knee jerk, Pavlov dog-like responses to people, groups, concepts they have been conditioned to despise in all contexts.

I can appreciate that you see your world through a different prism than I see mine and it will probably remain that way. But I can appreciate a point of view that is argued civilly and competently whether or not I can embrace it.

So we are in agreement here--the progressive and the libertarian (little "l") conservative. :) There is much about Trump the campaign person that I didn't like. And I have no illusions that as a private citizen he was sometimes insulting, crude, rude, and in the celebrity culture was sometimes inappropriate if we measure that behavior by what we consider appropriate outside of that culture. He was one of them and was a media darling and pretty much above reproach to an adoring media in those days.

And while I forgive ANYBODY for an off the cuff extemporaneous remark and don't insist on taking them seriously, Trump was the gift that just kept on giving providing negative sound bite after sound bite to a media that immediately turned on him once he became a Republican candidate for President. And they didn't care whether they used those sound bites in context and as he intended them or not. I became very frustrate with the Donald during that time and wished somebody on the team would take the damn Twitter account away from him.

There was a side of me that appreciated him refusing to be politically incorrect--I am a one woman wrecking crew in opposition to political correctness in all its forms--but realistically I also know that giving all that ammo to a leftwing media, leftwing message boards, etc. would cost him votes on our side. And it did.

I strongly did not want John McCain to be President but he was so much more qualified than Barack Obama, and at least had his head on straight on several conservative issues that I voted for him over a Barack Obama that I saw as potentially dangerous and imminently unqualified to be President. But I deliberately held my tongue and did not criticize Obama for a good long while to give him a chance to govern competently.

I did not want Trump to be the nominee of the GOP either, but once he was, I could vote for him with a clear conscience because I believe Hillary Clinton by her words and actions disqualified herself from the Presidency. And now I am a bit dismayed that he seems to be backtracking on so many of his strongest campaign promises. It is very difficult to respect that if that is in fact what he is doing. I don't trust the media to honestly inform us.

So I will hold my tongue for a good long while and allow Trump room to get his administration together and see how he is going to govern before I criticize him.

I wish everybody would.
 
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