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Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Socialism

Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

bluesmoke said:
Do you think Social Security is socialism and is illegal because it at least partially changes the US Government to Socialism?
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I think Social Security is a reflection of good intentions gone wrong. We, as a society, for too long, have aided and abetted in the dependence of people on others to take care of them even when they are capable of taking care of themselves instead of encouraging people to take care of themselves and then allowing those who don't to suffer the consequences of those poor decisions. To a large extent, the money was taken, but the number of people falling through the cracks has risen dramatically due to Congressional meddling and more recently, Administration meddling with finances unlawfully.

I also think Social Security has unfortunately become yet another political tool. At the very least, a person should have had an option (during their earning years) to invest that money that was forcefully taken away as they saw fit rather than the way it now is taken and then you may or may not get some of it back (without interest) and the age at which you can begin receiving those benefits has been moved several times father back so that statistically, a larger and larger number of people will never get those benefits they earned or deserve.

So in short, it most certainly does. The country did not include Social Security in it's founding documents.
 
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Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

ashurbanipal said:
Sure, I agree. But take a look again at the point to which I was responding, which was (in a nutshell) that it is impossible for the U.S. to undergo significant socialist reforms without changing the form of government. Presumably this is why the OP claims it would be illegal to enact socialist reforms, since the Constitution specifies our form of government. I'm pointing out that this claim about impossibility is false--it is entirely possible that we could pass all kinds of laws that a conservative person would think of as socialist, without in any way changing the form of government we currently have.
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Basically what you are saying is revise our form of government to death.
What social reforms that have been enacted today are clearly enumerated and specified in the Constitution?
States should be the ones dealing with welfare...not the Federal government.

Today's welfare system, was actually a clever way to empower the Federal government beyond it's legal powers.

The Constitution clearly states that those powers not specified as belonging to the Federal government shall rest with the states.

Those wishing to destroy the republic continually "re-interpret" the Constitution to manipulate our form of government.
 
Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

Orly? said:
When are we invading and overthrowing California to install a nice capitalist republican government?
LMK
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California is practically a foreign nation now that ignores the will of the People to boot. The public has overwhelmingly voted on many issues that the government has simply subsequently ignored.
What ever happened to government By The People and For The People? Politicians and judges impose THEIR will instead.
 
Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

Redress said:
No one in this thread said the country would be in safe hands with Sanders as president. Why are you building that strawman?
Notice that your definition of a republic does not, in any way, rule out socialism. That is not an argument for socialism, that is simply understanding English.
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You are very liberal, self declared. As such, it would be surprising if you saw it another way.
There are millions of Americans who wanted Sanders to become President. How is that fact a strawman?

I clearly explained my case. That you refuse to see it or at least give it consideration is on you. I, and probably MANY who see what the left is doing to this nation would undoubtedly agree.

We are about to have 4 more years of national chaos and destruction because Hillary is likely to be selected by the establishment already.
If you sincerely believe the last 8 years have been "good" for America.....shame on you...you are not situationally, politically, globally aware
 
Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

NoLeftNoRight said:
I think Social Security is a reflection of good intentions gone wrong. We, as a society, for too long, have aided and abetted in the dependence of people on others to take care of them even when they are capable of taking care of themselves instead of encouraging people to take care of themselves and then allowing those who don't to suffer the consequences of those poor decisions. To a large extent, the money was taken, but the number of people falling through the cracks has risen dramatically due to Congressional meddling and more recently, Administration meddling with finances unlawfully.

I also think Social Security has unfortunately become yet another political tool. At the very least, a person should have had an option (during their earning years) to invest that money that was forcefully taken away as they saw fit rather than the way it now is taken and then you may or may not get some of it back (without interest) and the age at which you can begin receiving those benefits has been moved several times father back so that statistically, a larger and larger number of people will never get those benefits they earned or deserve.

So in short, it most certainly does. The country did not include Social Security in it's founding documents.
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As opposed to what you say, we, socio-economically, have socialized cost and privatized profits. You point out a huge part of socializing cost, which allows businesses to pay employees less since those workers can rely on government assistance. And, since there is no such thing as 100% employment, those without jobs get government assistance also. Meanwhile, through wealth distribution via our tax system, et al, the corps and those with the most get more and more money while those with less get the least. You complain and lay blame, but offer no solution.

You have no statistics to prove personally investing one’s SS taxes elsewhere would be more successful. And, even you must acknowledge, quite a number of people would not invest well. How would they do in retirement?

You say “forcefully taken away”. I guess kind of tax is forcefully taken away. Theoretically, you get some kind of a return, a service, on those taxes. Infrastructure, etc. But with SS, you get money for the rest of your life. Which is why it’s the single largest portion of the US budget.

That a larger number of people will never get benefit because the SS retirement age keeps getting raised is wrong. The fact is, American life expectancy is going up faster than is the SS retirement age. One interest thing is, on average, black males living in poverty will only get maybe two years of SS before they die.

I agree with you that SS is, effectively, socialism. As to SS not being in our founding documents, neither was democracy as we know it today. It only came about by Amendment for the purposes of voting, only.
 
Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

NoLeftNoRight said:
US Constitution
Article IV
Section 4

Republican government

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.
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I don't see anything about government owning the means of production and I don't recall any case saying the same had anything to do with what you quoted. But, um, ok...
 
Re: Just so you know - It is illegal to attempt to change the US Government to Social

DamnYankee said:
True. But the primary goal of the leftists is to ensure we become a socialist sh*thole. Don't think for a second if the left could get away with it, they would destroy the 1st Amendment. Remember the leftists chip, chip, chip, away. That's why we have sunk to Banana Republic status right now. And that's why we have DJT.
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That kind of delusional and hateful rhetoric might fly in basement meetings, but it really makes no sense as anything other than a blind rant.
 
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