Sex scandals du jour...

code1211 said:

CNN is in the tank for the Dems as much as FOX is in the tank for the Reps.

It just stinks to high Heaven that all of these women's collective amnesia was cured in the same week.

I'll admit that I'm not following this much closer than the Bradjolina break up. Did any of these ladies file a complaint against Trump at any point in the past?

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Nope, no complaints that I'm aware.

SheWolf said:

You're right, I meant to say bet, not get. I am not a fan of either candidate, so I am not emotionally invested in this debate or defending one candidate over the other. But I do believe the victims I talked to and similar people, could very likely be offended by some of the statements being said about the women publicly speaking out. There is no reason to try turning the tables on them and question them. It makes Trump and his surrogates look bad. It also keeps the situation going and in the news. The best the could do is try to reposition the debate and talk about other issues instead of making a larger judgement on the behavior of women and all people in similar situations.

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Ive said all along. Every victim should be believed. That doesnt mean there shouldnt be an investigation and it doesnt mean the accuser is always telling the truth...but everything begins with believing the victims. That is a starting point.

VanceMack said:

Ive said all along. Every victim should be believed. That doesnt mean there shouldnt be an investigation and it doesnt mean the accuser is always telling the truth...but everything begins with believing the victims. That is a starting point.

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That certainly works with reports of child abuse so I get it. "Chilling effect...." But these are grown women. Very different. We owe it to the accused to approach ten and twenty year old accusations with healthy skepticism and look for corroborating evidence before we destroy someone's life.

SheWolf said:

You're right, I meant to say bet, not get. I am not a fan of either candidate, so I am not emotionally invested in this debate or defending one candidate over the other. But I do believe the victims I talked to and similar people, could very likely be offended by some of the statements being said about the women publicly speaking out. There is no reason to try turning the tables on them and question them. It makes Trump and his surrogates look bad. It also keeps the situation going and in the news. The best the could do is try to reposition the debate and talk about other issues instead of making a larger judgement on the behavior of women and all people in similar situations.

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I can respect what your saying but also at the same time there is no reason to assume they are telling the truth either. Im sorry if women feel insulted that anyone would question a womans integrity and not just blindly take her on her word but thats on them not thise who question these womens stories.

They are making very serious allegations with huge implications surrounding them. They are offering next to nothing for verifiable evidence and their timing is suspect as well.

If they cant understand this im not sure what to tell them

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MaggieD said:

That certainly works with reports of child abuse so I get it. "Chilling effect...." But these are grown women. Very different. We owe it to the accused to approach ten and twenty year old accusations with healthy skepticism and look for corroborating evidence before we destroy someone's life.

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Cosby's accusations go back years as well. When a number of people have similar stories, it's hard to dismiss them all as liars. Trump's life is not going to be destroyed over these accusations either. While doing what he is accused of doing is illegal in books, it's hard to prove. We have a justice system in the United States that recognizes Trump's rights as these allegations come out. He has also filed some lawsuits as a result of these allegations.

MaggieD said:

That certainly works with reports of child abuse so I get it. "Chilling effect...." But these are grown women. Very different. We owe it to the accused to approach ten and twenty year old accusations with healthy skepticism and look for corroborating evidence before we destroy someone's life.

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There is a difference between believing victims and automatically agreeing that a crime has occurred. From an advocate perspective...believe everything. We can separate advocacy for the individual from the investigative process.


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trouble13 said:

I can respect what your saying but also at the same time there is no reason to assume they are telling the truth either. Im sorry if women feel insulted that anyone would question a womans integrity and not just blindly take her on her word but thats on them not thise who question these womens stories.

They are making very serious allegations with huge implications surrounding them. They are offering next to nothing for verifiable evidence and their timing is suspect as well.

If they cant understand this im not sure what to tell them

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I am not arguing that you should believe them. I am arguing that the women should be treated with more respect than I have seen them treated with, and I think I made the reason why very clear... watching anybody make a statement treated like an automatic liar or harshly judged speaks to all victims of a sexual assault, rape, and abuse, including men, women, teens, and children. This type of treatment is exactly why people are hesitant to report anything in the first place. The least anybody could do is be neutral to both sides involved, and not act as if Trump is the only true victim up against a bunch of lying conspiratorial women.

VanceMack said:

There is a difference between believing victims and automatically agreeing that a crime has occurred. From an advocate perspective...believe everything. We can separate advocacy for the individual from the investigative process.


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Well said.

I tried to explain something similar to TD in another thread. The fact is Trump could have done exactly what he is accused, word-for-word, according to these women's stories, but it still unlikely he would actually be charged with anything. There is a difference between believing the victim and understanding the legality of the situation. Most occurrences of these sorts do not even go to court as it is, and given what these women have actually said, they most likely haven't suffered years of trauma. It doesn't even warrant a civil suit IMO. There is no valid reason to attack victims for coming forward or not coming forward sooner. This type of mentality tends to only suffice the people judging the accusers, and it is exactly why the majority of victims don't come forward in first place. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

I could go on and on about the issue, but if you look at the facts, it doesn't matter if it is a child, a teen, a man, or a woman, most people don't come forward for a variety of similar reasons and they come forward for a variety of similar reasons. One of the most powerful reasons they do come forward is protect other people, and the most inspirational example IMO is the story of Timothy White and Steven Stayner.

SheWolf said:

I am not arguing that you should believe them. I am arguing that the women should be treated with more respect than I have seen them treated with, and I think I made the reason why very clear... watching anybody make a statement treated like an automatic liar or harshly judged speaks to all victims of a sexual assault, rape, and abuse, including men, women, teens, and children. This type of treatment is exactly why people are hesitant to report anything in the first place. The least anybody could do is be neutral to both sides involved, and not act as if Trump is the only true victim up against a bunch of lying conspiratorial women.

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My appologies i missunderstood. I agee with what you just said and i would add the accussed should also be treated with the same amount of respect

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Chomsky said:

Nope, no complaints that I'm aware.

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I haven't heard of any either.

The lack of previous complaints seems to be an almost unreported notion.