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Should Churches be forced into holding the ceremony for homosexual couples?

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DeenThomas

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If i'm in wrong forum - just, move my thread(don't know why, but i can't post into "polls")
Yesterday, before going for sleep, i ws thinking about discrimination and contradictions in some statements of LGBT activists.
For example - situation with bakeries(when baker didn't want to make wedding cake for gays) Oregon Bakery Found Culpable For Anti-Gay Discrimination, Could Face $150,000 Fine | ThinkProgress
LGBT activists call this - discrimination and violation, but i have a question... "Why?" this man just have his opinion and maybe he just don't wanna bake this, why he should suffer now? It seems like he suffer because he have his opinion huh!
But when homosexual bakeries refuses to make traditional marriage cakes - it's okay...
Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake, And Is Denied Service By All Of Them (WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO) - Walid Shoebat
Why?
 
DeenThomas said:
If i'm in wrong forum - just, move my thread(don't know why, but i can't post into "polls")
Yesterday, before going for sleep, i ws thinking about discrimination and contradictions in some statements of LGBT activists.
For example - situation with bakeries(when baker didn't want to make wedding cake for gays) Oregon Bakery Found Culpable For Anti-Gay Discrimination, Could Face $150,000 Fine | ThinkProgress
LGBT activists call this - discrimination and violation, but i have a question... "Why?" this man just have his opinion and maybe he just don't wanna bake this, why he should suffer now? It seems like he suffer because he have his opinion huh!
But when homosexual bakeries refuses to make traditional marriage cakes - it's okay...
Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake, And Is Denied Service By All Of Them (WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO) - Walid Shoebat
Why?
Click to expand...

No...they should not. There's also no call for churches to perform that service.

As for a business...businesses aren't allowed to discriminate.
 
iliveonramen said:
No...they should not. There's also no call for churches to perform that service.

As for a business...businesses aren't allowed to discriminate.
Click to expand...

But there has been calls to take away church's tax status essentually making then businesses.
 
WCH said:
But there has been calls to take away church's tax status essentually making then businesses.
Click to expand...

More appropriately, the side that doesn't like churches spreading the Gospel of Rush likes to get the side that worships at the alter of Saint Rush all worked up.
 
Looks like a bunch of deflection to me. 8)

You all know these sorts of attacks against whoever come in increments and through the back door
 
iliveonramen said:
No...they should not. There's also no call for churches to perform that service.

As for a business...businesses aren't allowed to discriminate.
Click to expand...

Ah, but don't you know? Churches often rent their space for weddings, provide daycare services, and the like. They're "businesses" ;)
 
DeenThomas said:
If i'm in wrong forum - just, move my thread(don't know why, but i can't post into "polls")
Yesterday, before going for sleep, i ws thinking about discrimination and contradictions in some statements of LGBT activists.
For example - situation with bakeries(when baker didn't want to make wedding cake for gays) Oregon Bakery Found Culpable For Anti-Gay Discrimination, Could Face $150,000 Fine | ThinkProgress
LGBT activists call this - discrimination and violation, but i have a question... "Why?" this man just have his opinion and maybe he just don't wanna bake this, why he should suffer now? It seems like he suffer because he have his opinion huh!
But when homosexual bakeries refuses to make traditional marriage cakes - it's okay...
Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake, And Is Denied Service By All Of Them (WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO) - Walid Shoebat
Why?
Click to expand...

if what that 13 video's is correct they should all be sued and put out of business for religious discrimination. that is against the law and lawsuits need to be filed.
they need to make the cake or lose their business. the law works both ways and until people start doing this and standing up for themselves then these people will continue to put people out of business and ruin peoples lives none of which the law was designed to do.

as for church's and funerals and weddings. they have no case. the 1st amendment protects them.
however many church have stopped doing weddings to non-members and have changed their religious views to
show that marriage is only between a man and a women.

it is just a matter of time before a gay couple attempts to sue a church for not letting them hold their wedding there.
it was already done in England.
 
cpwill said:
Ah, but don't you know? Churches often rent their space for weddings, provide daycare services, and the like. They're "businesses" ;)
Click to expand...

a lot of them are stopping those types of services.
 
Churches should not be forced to perform a same sex marriage. I imagine that the churches that prefer not to perform them feel it is against their teachings. If that's the case, I can't imagine a same sex couple wanting anything to do with that church in the first place. If I was gay and looking to get married I would look for a church that accepts me for what I am.
 
Ontologuy said:
Yes .. calls for all sorts of stupid **** .. including the oxymoronic "gay marriage".

Those calls don't mean "nothing".

Obviously.
Click to expand...

Until they translate to action, they mean nothing.
 
1750Texan said:
That in no way reverts Churches to businesses.
Click to expand...

It would be idiotic, churches and business serve completely different aspects of society and have different needs, purposes, requirements, and outputs. There is absolutely no reason to treat them the same.
 
DeenThomas said:
If i'm in wrong forum - just, move my thread(don't know why, but i can't post into "polls")
Yesterday, before going for sleep, i ws thinking about discrimination and contradictions in some statements of LGBT activists.
For example - situation with bakeries(when baker didn't want to make wedding cake for gays) Oregon Bakery Found Culpable For Anti-Gay Discrimination, Could Face $150,000 Fine | ThinkProgress
LGBT activists call this - discrimination and violation, but i have a question... "Why?" this man just have his opinion and maybe he just don't wanna bake this, why he should suffer now? It seems like he suffer because he have his opinion huh!
But when homosexual bakeries refuses to make traditional marriage cakes - it's okay...
Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake, And Is Denied Service By All Of Them (WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO) - Walid Shoebat
Why?
Click to expand...

Churches will never be made to conduct gay marriages: that's unconstitutional. The bakery thing is a private business selling goods and service to the public, and just like in hiring, a business cannot discriminate: it's the southern lunch counter thing.
 
A Church is not a business and not in the business of providing the public wedding ceremonies. Marriage is a function of the doctrine of the Church and unless the couple adheres to that doctrine...with the permission of the pastor can a marriage be solemnized.

A Catholic Church can not be forced to perform a Jewish ceremony...or a Hindi ...or Hopi...ect. And visa versa.
 
tacomancer said:
Until they translate to action, they mean nothing.
Click to expand...
False, and obviously so.

Rangers do not wait for devastating avalanches to occur, they dynamite to solve the problem before it happens. The potential of the avalanche means something.

Therapists don't wait for a couple to end their relationship before helping them when asked, they work to solve problems in the relationship before the action of dissolution occurs. The potential of dissolution means something.

Your statement is obviously false.

The reality remains that in a democracy, an idea can not only take hold, it can have it's value, degree of acceptance, even its meaning distorted by the media .. until, if nothing is done to stop those distortions .. action occurs that is obviously harmful because it's based on a distortion.

No, the very action of speaking about something, having that speaking spread and intensify, is action itself, action that must be taken seriously.

It functions as a warning to those who care about that which the distortion, if further action is taken on it, will damage, it functions as a warning to them to take heed now ..

.. Before it's too late.

A word to the wise.
 
Ontologuy said:
False, and obviously so.

Rangers do not wait for devastating avalanches to occur, they dynamite to solve the problem before it happens. The potential of the avalanche means something.

Therapists don't wait for a couple to end their relationship before helping them when asked, they work to solve problems in the relationship before the action of dissolution occurs. The potential of dissolution means something.

Your statement is obviously false.

The reality remains that in a democracy, an idea can not only take hold, it can have it's value, degree of acceptance, even its meaning distorted by the media .. until, if nothing is done to stop those distortions .. action occurs that is obviously harmful because it's based on a distortion.

No, the very action of speaking about something, having that speaking spread and intensify, is action itself, action that must be taken seriously.

It functions as a warning to those who care about that which the distortion, if further action is taken on it, will damage, it functions as a warning to them to take heed now ..

.. Before it's too late.

A word to the wise.
Click to expand...

all of those things you cited are actions, not calls.
 
DeenThomas said:
If i'm in wrong forum - just, move my thread(don't know why, but i can't post into "polls")
Yesterday, before going for sleep, i ws thinking about discrimination and contradictions in some statements of LGBT activists.
For example - situation with bakeries(when baker didn't want to make wedding cake for gays) Oregon Bakery Found Culpable For Anti-Gay Discrimination, Could Face $150,000 Fine | ThinkProgress
LGBT activists call this - discrimination and violation, but i have a question... "Why?" this man just have his opinion and maybe he just don't wanna bake this, why he should suffer now? It seems like he suffer because he have his opinion huh!
But when homosexual bakeries refuses to make traditional marriage cakes - it's okay...
Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake, And Is Denied Service By All Of Them (WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO) - Walid Shoebat
Why?
Click to expand...

1. To the question in the subject. No, Churches should not be forced into holding homosexual couples weddings. They shouldn't be forced into holding any wedding. However, for profit wedding chapels may not refuse to perform a legal same sex marriage on the singular basis of it being same sex if the state laws do not allow for discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation. As a for profit wedding chapel, you are selling the SERVICE of officiating and hosting a wedding ceremony. This is especially true when your wedding chapel openly advertises that it welcomes people who want non-traditional ceremonies, secular weddings, or weddings of people of other faiths...indicating the owners of said chapel are absolutely willing to put aside their religious beliefs in the name of their for profit business.

2. "Why" was the cake instance discrimination? Because the person had an open to the public business that advertised that it provided a specific service, and the individuals in question were denied that specific service due to their sexual orientation, which in many states is illegal. Similar to a hotel advertising it rents rooms, but then refusing to rent rooms to an interracial couple because they think interracial marriage is a sin (discrimination based on race).

3. The same absolutely should apply the other direction as well. If you're a Christian couple going into a publicly facing bakery owned by an athiest that advertises that they do wedding cakes, he should not legally be able to refuse to make that cake. If you're a person wanting a cake for an event promoting traditional marriage and you go into a public facing bakery owned by a homosexual that advertises they do cakes for events, they should not legally be able to refuse to make your cake. Whether or not the individual attempting to make such a purchase in good faith wishes to push the issue legally or not is entirely up to that person and is not the fault of some other activists.

Additionally, the PUBLICS perception of the legitimacy and worthiness of support regarding each individual case is completely seperate from the notion of legality, and frankly is one of the potential ramifications of having a free society. The reality is that just like in the past when homosexuality was inherently looked at as "negative" and the notion that "let gays marry" would have been looked at with scorn and it was all perfectly okay from a societal aspect, so too is it okay from a societal aspect if the thing being viewed as "negative" now is opposing gay marriage. That's an entirely seperate issue from that of the law.
 
goood lord this lunacy again? lol

of course churches should not be forced to marry anybody or hold ceremonies in a church.

nor is there any REAL threat of that actually happening since the constitution exists

this ilogical conspiracy theory is a real trad and its one that doesnt even float
 
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