Thread: Is it Bigoted/Racist to Support Minority Welfare/Federal Aid

I ask this question simply because it has been put to me at various times in my life.

Strictly speaking, welfare/aid policies at the very top, regardless of well intentions, are acts to recognize certain minorities as disadvantaged and therefore in need of a societal handicap (in the form of welfare, affirmative action, etc.).

Many supporters of such policies will argue that their opponents are racist, and not willing to provide a hand-up to those in need.

It doesn't make sense to me that paternalism and pity equals compassion and tolerance. Instead, the idea behind each policy is to categorize groups of people by "level of ability" and provide incentives to those in "need." Word it how you will, it basically states: "X group is unable to get ahead in society without Affirmative Action...welfare...easy credit...free housing...job quotas...etc."

Please assist.

Equality under the law excludes preferential treatment.

Originally Posted by Mensch

I ask this question simply because it has been put to me at various times in my life.

Strictly speaking, welfare/aid policies at the very top, regardless of well intentions, are acts to recognize certain minorities as disadvantaged and therefore in need of a societal handicap (in the form of welfare, affirmative action, etc.).

Many supporters of such policies will argue that their opponents are racist, and not willing to provide a hand-up to those in need.

It doesn't make sense to me that paternalism and pity equals compassion and tolerance. Instead, the idea behind each policy is to categorize groups of people by "level of ability" and provide incentives to those in "need." Word it how you will, it basically states: "X group is unable to get ahead in society without Affirmative Action...welfare...easy credit...free housing...job quotas...etc."

Please assist.

Equality under the law excludes preferential treatment.

What's the best way to ruin a child? Make sure they never have to accept responsibility for themselves. What's the best way to ruin a race of people? Make sure they never have to accept responsibility for themselves...or make it easy for them to choose not to. IMO, that's exactly what we do when we are willing to make exceptions to "work for welfare," as Obama just did; when we put ads on television encouraging people to sign up for food stamps; fail to address welfare fraud; fail to limit the amount of aid a mother can get for the myriad children she births that she can't support; and many more programs that keep our African-American population in velvet chains...to borrow an analogy from VP Biden.

Absolutely not, especially seeing as welfare and federal aid are not doled out soley to minorities, they are programs available to all ethnicties and creeds, therefore inherently indiscriminative. I must say that the whole mantra of cutting those off of supplementary aid and assistance under the guise of helping them achieve independence of some sort is getting rather stale of late.

Originally Posted by Hare

Absolutely not, especially seeing as welfare and federal aid are not doled out soley to minorities, they are programs available to all ethnicties and creeds, therefore inherently indiscriminative. I must say that the whole mantra of cutting those off of supplementary aid and assistance under the guise of helping them achieve independence of some sort is getting rather stale of late.

They're programs available to all ethnic backgrounds and creeds? That is absolutely incorrect.

You may find certain programs benefiting certain people, but by and large each one discriminates against the other.

Originally Posted by MaggieD

What's the best way to ruin a child? Make sure they never have to accept responsibility for themselves. What's the best way to ruin a race of people? Make sure they never have to accept responsibility for themselves...or make it easy for them to choose not to. IMO, that's exactly what we do when we are willing to make exceptions to "work for welfare," as Obama just did; when we put ads on television encouraging people to sign up for food stamps; fail to address welfare fraud; fail to limit the amount of aid a mother can get for the myriad children she births that she can't support; and many more programs that keep our African-American population in velvet chains...to borrow an analogy from VP Biden.

I wouldn't even say African-American population, because by that, you single them out in this debate.

This isn't at all about certain groups, but about the entire foundation of this government. For the sake of your own argument (which I do agree with), do not single out individual groups. It's simply not necessary.

As stated, yes it is racist to support financial aid to anyone because of their skin color. Equality requires that programs be open to everyone entirely without regard to race, gender, etc.

More white people are on welfare than any other race. The fact that you apparently assumed otherwise is a strong indication that your ignorance of the issue is coming directly from racist sources like Limbaugh or Beck or whatever.

Affirmative action is not even close to counteracting the massive advantage white people have in the job market solely because of the color of their skin. If a white person and a black person both apply for the same job with the same resume, even with whatever minor effect AA has on the job market, the white person is still 2.4 times more likely to get an interview. So, all AA is doing is reducing that from maybe 2.6 to 2.4 or something. It is a very limited program to try to reduce the discrimination in the job market, not discrimination in itself.

Originally Posted by Mensch

They're programs available to all ethnic backgrounds and creeds? That is absolutely incorrect.

What are you talking about?

Originally Posted by teamosil

More white people are on welfare than any other race. The fact that you apparently assumed otherwise is a strong indication that your ignorance of the issue is coming directly from racist sources like Limbaugh or Beck or whatever.

I NEVER assumed that position, you placed it upon me. Instead, I would ACKNOWLEDGE that wealthy, older, white families receive more welfare (in the form of tax breaks, business incentives, corporate welfare, etc.) than any other single distinguished group. But we'll save that for a thread entitled, "End the Progressive Tax!"

Affirmative action is not even close to counteracting the massive advantage white people have in the job market solely because of the color of their skin. If a white person and a black person both apply for the same job with the same resume, even with whatever minor effect AA has on the job market, the white person is still 2.4 times more likely to get an interview. So, all AA is doing is reducing that from maybe 2.6 to 2.4 or something. It is a very limited program to try to reduce the discrimination in the job market, not discrimination in itself.

It is absolutely impossible to compare the same two individuals of different races in any job search. It doesn't prove anything. You still have two very different experiences, personalities, resumes, education, work experience, references, salary expectations, interview impressions, writing abilities, speaking abilities, and so many other variables. To claim that African-Americans are at a historical disadvantage to Anglo-Americans is completely bogus and without merit.

You can have a candidate with a mediocre background but with a powerful personality win a job over another who has an outstanding resume, yet nothing more.

Originally Posted by teamosil

What are you talking about?

As I said, there is discrimination in every program, including ethnic, religious, etc.