Michegan Moves to REDUCE it's Regulatory Burden

ReverendHellh0und said:

Good luck. Michigan is filled with ****ty low rent politicians who thrive on regulations, fraud, waste and abuse. Just look at that ****hole detroit to see what a failure politicians in that state have been.

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Lets see if you are correct.

Michigan House of Representatives - controlled and dominated by Repubicans.
Michigan Senate - controlled and dominated with a super majority by Republicans.
Michigan Governors office - controlled by a Republican.
Michigan Supreme Court - majority of which are Republicans.

By jove, I think he has something.

haymarket said:

Lets see if you are correct.

Michigan House of Representatives - controlled and dominated by Repubicans.
Michigan Senate - controlled and dominated with a super majority by Republicans.
Michigan Governors office - controlled by a Republican.
Michigan Supreme Court - majority of which are Republicans.

By jove, I think he has something.

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Oh wait you confuse me for a Republican. :shrug: Michigan is one ****ed up state, liberal policies and corrupt unions have destroyed the state. So sad.

Dickieboy said:

Making this statement is merely a means to justify employing the activities of the ‘emergency manager’, agree or not. Remember you stated that we have ‘government of the people’ which I interpret to mean the statement above is not directed at the ‘municipal government that just came’ but rather includes all the citizens involved in the action as it is they and their predecessors who ‘got in the situation in the first place’. Considering the emergency manager, if austerity/taxation is unacceptable what other option is available else failure?

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Yesterday, I attended as part of my job a speech in Wyandotte Michigan by the former Emergency Managter of the city of Pontiac. His name is Michael Stampfler.

He is NOT a politician. He is a professional city manager who is something of a legend in Michigan for his turning around of a smaller city called Portage. He runs a business that trains and educates city managers and he is very successful. He was the EM for Pontiac for a year.

In his speech yesterday he said that the Michigan EM law is a disaster which dooms a city to a never ending cycle of financial wreck and ruin. He said this is because the entire extent of the law focuses on one thing and only one thing: balancing the books at any cost or price.

This is man who should know better than anyone.

ReverendHellh0und said:

Oh wait you confuse me for a Republican. :shrug: Michigan is one ****ed up state, liberal policies and corrupt unions have destroyed the state. So sad.

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I did not say one word about your political affiliation.

haymarket said:

I did not say one word about your political affiliation.

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Wonderful for you.

ReverendHellh0und said:

Wonderful for you.

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But I did demonstrate how your observation could be correct given the Republican domination of all three branches of government.

Thank you for that obsevation.

Michigan is a blue collar state in need of blue collar jobs.
GM outsourced jobs then ask for bailouts
Chrysler outsourced jobs then sold it's controlling share of stocks to Fiat
Is this a cocedence?
Don't think so.

This is an ongoing trend, the more a corporation outsources, the more profits they will lose on the back end.eace

haymarket said:

But I did demonstrate how your observation could be correct given the Republican domination of all three branches of government.

Thank you for that obsevation.

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As if it started with the incumbents.... :shrug:

Michigan has a long history of corruption and mishandling by it's politicians such as Barbara-Rose Collins, and Charles Diggs both were convicted of fraud I believe. You can see the fruits of this cycle of corruption in that post apocalyptic dump called Detroit.

presluc said:

Michigan is a blue collar state in need of blue collar jobs.
GM outsourced jobs then ask for bailouts
Chrysler outsourced jobs then sold it's controlling share of stocks to Fiat
Is this a cocedence?
Don't think so.

This is an ongoing trend, the more a corporation outsources, the more profits they will lose on the back end.eace

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Didn't the Obama administration approve, and even push these things? /facepalm

ReverendHellh0und said:

Didn't the Obama administration approve, and even push these things? /facepalm

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Ah Rev, how soon we forget huh.

You still trying the partisian political party line debate with me?

Obama and the Democrats are just as guilty as the grand old party and that bunch of blame gamers,

Sorry, you got the wrong poster Reverend, in my world there isn't Republicans or Democrats , just RIGHT OR WRONG.

I got no time to pick sides and do the "BLAME GAME SHUFFLE AND NOT MY FAULT DANCE".

I'll leave that to you hard line party liners.

I want action and I care not if it comes from Right, left or center..

Of course I doubt if it will come from the right or the left they are too busy blaming each other and slinging mud, hard to find a solution with all that mud in the way .

Kinda like post # 34?eace

presluc said:

Ah Rev, how soon we forget huh.

You still trying the partisian political party line debate with me?

Obama and the Democrats are just as guilty as the grand old party and that bunch of blame gamers,

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yet you only say so when prodded. :shrug:

Sorry, you got the wrong poster Reverend, in my world there isn't Republicans or Democrats , just RIGHT OR WRONG.

I got no time to pick sides and do the "BLAME GAME SHUFFLE AND NOT MY FAULT DANCE".

I'll leave that to you hard line party liners.

I want action and I care not if it comes from Right, left or center..

Of course I doubt if it will come from the right or the left they are too busy blaming each other and slinging mud, hard to find a solution with all that mud in the way .

Kinda like post # 34?eace

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second time I posted this, and no one prompted me..... :shrug:

ReverendHellh0und said:

yet you only say so when prodded. :shrug:

second time I posted this, and no one prompted me..... :shrug:

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I would ask you to do a simple task, Reverend.

If you are as you say just for right or wrong and not another party line follower,
List all the accomplishments done by the Democratic party as well as accomplishments done by the Republican party.
As well as the mistakes of the Democratic party as well as the Republican party.
Don't have to be a lot just a few.

Example " YES WE CAN" ," STAY THE COURSE" BOTH BULL**** JUST DIFFERENT PARTIES.eace

ReverendHellh0und said:

As if it started with the incumbents.... :shrug:

Michigan has a long history of corruption and mishandling by it's politicians such as Barbara-Rose Collins, and Charles Diggs both were convicted of fraud I believe. You can see the fruits of this cycle of corruption in that post apocalyptic dump called Detroit.

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News bulletin: Collins and Diggs were FEDERAL officials - not state officials. They held no power in Michigan government.

The Michigan Senate has been in the firm control of a majority of Republicans since the last thirty years.

In the Governors office - Republicans have held the office for 36 of the last 52 years.

haymarket said:

The Michigan Senate has been in the firm control of a majority of Republicans since the last thirty years.

In the Governors office - Republicans have held the office for 36 of the last 52 years.

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WOW! Those are overwhelming statistics. Considering your age, occupation and party affiliation I can only surmize that...YOU SUCK AT YOUR JOB!

haymarket said:

Yesterday, I attended as part of my job a speech in Wyandotte Michigan by the former Emergency Managter of the city of Pontiac. His name is Michael Stampfler.

He is NOT a politician. He is a professional city manager who is something of a legend in Michigan for his turning around of a smaller city called Portage. He runs a business that trains and educates city managers and he is very successful. He was the EM for Pontiac for a year.

In his speech yesterday he said that the Michigan EM law is a disaster which dooms a city to a never ending cycle of financial wreck and ruin. He said this is because the entire extent of the law focuses on one thing and only one thing: balancing the books at any cost or price.

This is man who should know better than anyone.

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Ok, and did he offer a solution?

Dickieboy said:

WOW! Those are overwhelming statistics. Considering your age, occupation and party affiliation I can only surmize that...YOU SUCK AT YOUR JOB!

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Actually, I do very well at my job. You see, this is a second career for me. Most of the campaigns I advise on end up winning.

Dickieboy said:

Ok, and did he offer a solution?

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Actually he said the law needed to be changed.

haymarket said:

In his speech yesterday he said that the Michigan EM law is a disaster which dooms a city to a never ending cycle of financial wreck and ruin. He said this is because the entire extent of the law focuses on one thing and only one thing: balancing the books at any cost or price.

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Maybe you want to walk back that 'disaster' part a bit. Here it is interpreted that he suggests amendments and clearly appears to be against repeal, actually discrediting those who are for repeal.

Stampfler displayed confidence that if his ideas were amended into Michigan's Public Act #4 statue, each locality under Emergency Management or a Consent Decree would be able to repair its' fiscal budgetary issues and thinks acts to repeal P.A. #4 aren't focusing on financial reasons for the crisis.

Former Emergency Manager Michael Stampfler, suggest changes to Michigan's Public Act # 4 ~ ROJS News

After reading his take on the whole scenario it appears logical, kinda like the ‘wars’ we (the US) have be in for the last 60 years. We go in, stir up a bunch of crap then leave hoping things will get better without addressing the systemic issues.

haymarket said:

Actually, I do very well at my job. You see, this is a second career for me. Most of the campaigns I advise on end up winning.

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I thought you worked for a Democrat???

Dickieboy said:

Maybe you want to walk back that 'disaster' part a bit. Here it is interpreted that he suggests amendments and clearly appears to be against repeal, actually discrediting those who are for repeal.

Stampfler displayed confidence that if his ideas were amended into Michigan's Public Act #4 statue, each locality under Emergency Management or a Consent Decree would be able to repair its' fiscal budgetary issues and thinks acts to repeal P.A. #4 aren't focusing on financial reasons for the crisis.

Former Emergency Manager Michael Stampfler, suggest changes to Michigan's Public Act # 4 ~ ROJS News

After reading his take on the whole scenario it appears logical, kinda like the ‘wars’ we (the US) have be in for the last 60 years. We go in, stir up a bunch of crap then leave hoping things will get better without addressing the systemic issues.

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My five pages of notes on his speech and answers to questions - which took up more time than the initial speech - are at work, I will post from them later in the day when I get there.

However, the article you are citing from is very incomplete. He said much more than that which is quoted in it.

From the top of my head at 6 AM - here is what stood out

1- Stampfler is a money manager financial type and NOT a politician. As such, his focus is on the management issues and NOT on the political issues. His answer about the city charter being merely interesting reading reveal that bias. I specifically asked him about taking away the right to vote in these communities and he replied that the right to vote was only being exercised by a minority of people before. He said in some communities as little as 10% of the people were voting in some elections. While he never ended that thought to go on to say "so to take away the right to vote from 10% of the people is no big deal" - it clearly hung out there like a fifty pound meatball on a plate of spaghetti. When I asked him about the Lincoln ideal of government "of the people, by the people and for the people" he merely endorsed the concept while stating that people in these communities were not getting good government in the first place.

2- The article fails to develop a theme which ran throughout his comments - with the appointment of an EM - no additional resources are brought into the community. What the community faces is a financial crisis. What the State denies them is financial assistance. He clearly said that without such assistance, communities were doomed to end up in a cycle where this would happen again and again to them. The law does not fix that problem.

3- The article quotes him on his demand for development of what he called "political capital". He was rather vague about this referring to community groups like the Rotary who was sponsoring his speech. Several people asked follow up questions about that and he continued to fail to develop what he meant and how it would changed anything in a community which had their right to vote denied to them.

4- While you are correct that he never mentioned the word REPEAL, it was very clear that this was an EM who was telling the world that the EM law was not going to solve any problems for those communities and was dooming them to an endless cycle of financial crisis. Listeners were free to draw their own conclusions.

I will write more about his remarks when I get to work and get some free time.

presluc said:

I would ask you to do a simple task, Reverend.

If you are as you say just for right or wrong and not another party line follower,
List all the accomplishments done by the Democratic party as well as accomplishments done by the Republican party.
As well as the mistakes of the Democratic party as well as the Republican party.
Don't have to be a lot just a few.

Example " YES WE CAN" ," STAY THE COURSE" BOTH BULL**** JUST DIFFERENT PARTIES.eace

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Your kidding right? Since when have you changed your jib? And adopted this nee look :lol:

Anyway I am always much better at pointing out their flaws than their successes...

If you go back and search the threads I've started several in both support and condemnation of r's and D's. :shrug:

Dickieboy said:

WOW! Those are overwhelming statistics. Considering your age, occupation and party affiliation I can only surmize that...YOU SUCK AT YOUR JOB!

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:lamo :lamo :lamo

ReverendHellh0und said:

Your kidding right? Since when have you changed your jib? And adopted this nee look :lol:

Anyway I am always much better at pointing out their flaws than their successes...

If you go back and search the threads I've started several in both support and condemnation of r's and D's. :shrug:

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Nope, not kidding, REV.
I've read your post, most point fingers at Democrats and you seem to agree with Republicans 99% of the time, a huge %.
You might want to look for a bit more balance of Democrats and Republicans, REV..
That is unless you think Democrats are always wrong and Republicans are always right or vise versa.

Or perhaps you think only the Democratic party makes mistakes, while Republicans make none???
FYI, I could have preformed that task, I find it no surprise that you could not.eace

presluc said:

Nope, not kidding, REV.
I've read your post, most point fingers at Democrats and you seem to agree with Republicans 99% of the time, a huge %.
You might want to look for a bit more balance of Democrats and Republicans, REV..
That is unless you think Democrats are always wrong and Republicans are always right or vise versa.

Or perhaps you think only the Democratic party makes mistakes, while Republicans make none???eace

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99% of the time? really?


I am against DOMA
I am for anyone who wants to serve, serving.
I am against corporate welfare
I want to shrink the defense budget
I want to end drug prohibition
I want for assisted suicide
I am against no child left behind act
I am for teaching of evolution
I am against school led prayer

Should I go on?




I don't care who you ****, do drugs with, or marry, it's none of my or the governents business.


you who has been a far left poster for as far as I can remember all of the sudden have this independent streak? It's cool man, but don't pretend you can look down upon me and call me a far right wing conservative, that's just foolish.

ReverendHellh0und said:

99% of the time? really?


I am against DOMA
I am for anyone who wants to serve, serving.
I am against corporate welfare
I want to shrink the defense budget
I want to end drug prohibition
I want for assisted suicide
I am against no child left behind act
I am for teaching of evolution
I am against school led prayer

Should I go on?




I don't care who you ****, do drugs with, or marry, it's none of my or the governents business.


you who has been a far left poster for as far as I can remember all of the sudden have this independent streak? It's cool man, but don't pretend you can look down upon me and call me a far right wing conservative, that's just foolish.

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Is it Rev?

How about these,
You support rich tax cuts
You support outsourseing jobs
You want a smaller government
You have supported the Tea Party on more than one occasion.
You have supported Palin on more than one occasion
You have not posted one good thing about the current president Obama.
NEED I GO ON?

FYI, AS FOR AS YOUR LIST .
A closer look perhaps.
The only thing you are against is 1.a child left behind a proposal that failed some time ago, 2. school led prayer , PLEASE, where you living in the 70's.You was also against corporate welfare, and DOMA BIG DEAL, anybody that isn't against these is comitting political suicide you know that.
The rest ,the things you are for, right out of the right wing handbook on how to get votes.

Don't feel bad , Rev the left wing uses the same tactics just with a little more finesse .eace