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Rochester Police Arrest Woman in Her Front Lawn For Filming Traffic Stop

TacticalEvilDan said:
My feelings on all this are a little mixed.

On the one hand, I don't see where those officers could legitimately say they felt unsafe. There was, what, four of them there? One woman with a camera and maybe a buddy watching from across a yard is a threat to them? I really don't think so. If they genuinely felt threatened they would've taken a much different tone. They just didn't like that camera.

On the other hand, my dad's a Deputy in a rural county. He works the night shift, and unless it's the weekend it's him and two other Deputies on patrol for the whole county, plus the odd Trooper or 4. Deputies ride one to a car, even at night, which means even a single solitary backup Deputy might be 20 minutes away at high speed if you get into a jam.

If my dad said he felt threatened because someone was up to some funny business just out of his line of sight and wouldn't go away, I could see him getting uncomfortable and starting to bark orders. I'd be on his side, too, because I've heard stories of the things he's lived through out there in the dark.

Then there's my natural distrust of authority ... :lol:

Anyhow, the local authorities did the right thing, setting this woman free and starting an internal probe. Those cops screwed up bad.

ETA: Oh, and the ticketing jazz, at that meeting to support her? Bull****, pure unadulterated bull****. That was just ****ed up.
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Upstate as vast as it is and the sheriffs and troopers that would be understandable, but local city cops and usually two to a car at night and backup minutes away, there is no excuse.
 
deltabtry said:
Upstate as vast as it is and the sheriffs and troopers that would be understandable, but local city cops and usually two to a car at night and backup minutes away, there is no excuse.
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Like I said, 4 cops on the scene, the woman just standing quietly there with the camera, and the reaction not being that of a cop feeling genuinely unsafe, I think the police were in the wrong.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
No, it's not. It's one of the ways of the world.
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Uh tyranny?..;)
To cook a frog(American people) you must put it in cool water and then warm it slowly. I may have been exaggerating a bit, but non the less the police are becoming more and more militaristic. Don't get me wrong I am all for the rule of law and those who volunteer to enforce it but, I place the oath that one takes above all else and that said non one is above the law or their oath if it applies.
 
deltabtry said:
Uh tyranny?..;)
To cook a frog(American people) you must put it in cool water and then warm it slowly. I may have been exaggerating a bit, but non the less the police are becoming more and more militaristic. Don't get me wrong I am all for the rule of law and those who volunteer to enforce it but, I place the oath that one takes above all else and that said non one is above the law or their oath if it applies.
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you see a coming tyranny and I see a petty official abusing his power.
 
Viktyr Korimir said:
Blame the legislatures that are passing laws against it. The police are only enforcing the laws we've told them to.
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That is the problem, isn't it? Give a combat veteran a badge, and he will violate every constitutional right he is instructed to. Sounds like we need a constitution for the people, and not the authoritarians. Sounds like that cop & whoever gave him that shoking power should share a cell, and set an example for those who follow.
 
And if it had been a news crew?

Arresting the woman for what she was doing was a violation of the First Amendment. Korimyr is right in that many States are now giving cops the ability to arrest people for filming them. The laws are tyrannical, unconstitutional, and they need to make to SCOTUS to get shot down.

Police operating in public spaces are not immune to the First Amendment unless it's a threat to their safety. I cannot think of a single argument that could qualify them being video taped as a danger to them. If no one can watch the cops and gather evidence of their behavior, then there is no concrete way to monitor authority.

Cops are granted power by the government, and the government is granted power by The People. It ultimately comes back to us. Government has no rights, just powers. We give them those powers. They are subject to our monitoring in how they exercise their special powers.

Arresting this woman is nothing more than corruption. Plain and simple. A cop doing no wrong has nothing to worry about. Sound familiar? They use the same argument on us when they tap our phone lines or do road blocks. Authority doesn't like its own rules turned on it. Well too bad for them - we aren't ASKING.
 
What makes cops uncomfotable these days is that they can't get away with as much as they used to anymore due to the risk that their delusions of grandeur will end up going viral on Youtube. That is what this was all about and it has nothing to do with how dangerous the city of Rochester may or may not be. I'm more familiar with the suburbs, but I bet something like this is as likely to happen out in Fairport or Henrietta as in the city. All it takes is one cop going a little nuts when a camera is pointed at him. I'm glad the case was dismissed, that woman did nothing wrong.
 
Arcana XV said:
What makes cops uncomfotable these days is that they can't get away with as much as they used to anymore due to the risk that their delusions of grandeur will end up going viral on Youtube. That is what this was all about and it has nothing to do with how dangerous the city of Rochester may or may not be. I'm more familiar with the suburbs, but I bet something like this is as likely to happen out in Fairport or Henrietta as in the city. All it takes is one cop going a little nuts when a camera is pointed at him. I'm glad the case was dismissed, that woman did nothing wrong.
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Yeah, those cops are really uncomfortable now that they actually have to follow the law, and there will be evidence when they don't.
 
Goshin said:
Public servants, operating in public, should not be protected from being filmed doing their job. Especially if it will keep them more honest.

I oppose these kinds of laws, against people filming cops doing their job. If they can film us.... we can film them.
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If the officers are arresting somebody in front of a 7-11, do they arrest the clerk because his security cameras are taping the goings on? What is the difference?

Does a citizen not involved in the incident have to follow any order given to them by any officer at any time? If they do by law, the freedom Americans used to enjoy is gone.
 
Thorgasm said:
I imagine that not much will come of it. She disobeyed a police order. Now it is ridiculous that she made him feel unsafe, but in a residential neighborhood police can be quickly outnumbered and threatened by a neighborhood mob. I can't see the State's Attouney taking this case to court though. It's a total waste of State resources.
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The court battle is besides the point. This woman needs to file a complaint with internal affairs and have her lawyer investigat this officer.

It looks like he was looking for a fight.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Yeah - it went too far. . . I agree with the ladies at the end of the video - the cops were pissed that she filmed them ****ing up.

But damn people - when a cop tells you to 'go inside' or 'leave the scene' you need to do what they say. Holy **** - how dense ARE people? Haven't we learned this lesson? How many countless cases have we seen where a minor - no big deal - issue happens and then it escalates and gets way out of hand BECAUSE people refuse to listen ot the advise or suggestion of an officer?

"put down your weapon"
"step away from the body"
"please leave the scene - go inside"

Holy crap people - every time a citizen seems 'arrested for no reason' in part it's because they're arguing with cops. . . and these 3 things are from cases in the last few month swehre no one was murdered, no one committed a blatant crime - but in the end they were arrested because they didn't DO what they were told ot DO.

I wonder how many people in similar situations such as the ones we've seen recently who DO listen and - OMG!! they DON'T get arrested! I have a suspicion that more people avoid arrest by doing what they're told - no harm done *to anyone*
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Are you going to comply with any order, it was not a suggestion, any cop gives you at any time? I would hope not. This woman was not involved with what was going on and he had no reason to come onto her property to arrest her.

If an officer stops a car in front of your house, and you are sitting on the porch, are you going to go inside because an officer orders you to?
 
Ockham said:
Most times I agree with that - do what the cop says. In this case however, I disagree. We are guaranteed freedoms... cops because they do not like being filmed do not have the right to arrest someone because they do not like being filmed. Yes, if people are too close to a crime scene, if there is a credible threat of a mob, or if there is inciting language, threats... all justified actions by the police to keep themselves and other citizens around them safe is paramount. A woman filming a cop does not apply... Because a cop tells you to bend over backwards and kiss your own ass on a public street doesn't mean you do it.
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The idea that a cop does not like being filmed is nonsense. There are cameras everywhere and they are filmed doing their job everywhere they go.

Why is it so much different if it is this lady of a security camera outside a business?
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Oh yeah - her friends really stood up for her and jumped in to argue. HAH!

Would it have been that horrid for her to step back a few feet - up into the group of people? I don't think so - and I don't think his initial request was out of line - she was closest to him and I can very easily see how that could become dangerous. She was armed with a camera - someone else in a different situation might have been armd with a handgun or knife. Just how was the officer suppose to differentiate?

"Watch your back" is a respectable thing - he wasn't being horribly out of line when he first requested that - it escalated when she began to argue. He was being polite - very repetative - and only after a few minutes of back and forth engaging with multiple warnings from him did it go further than that.

When he first requested that she step back into the house - would it have been terrible if she had done what he was politely asking?

And you know - this 'she was on her property, she can do what she wanted' isn't some mode of fact 100% of the time. . . depending on the situation it might not be true at all.
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Unless you saw a different video than I did, it looked like she was pretty far back from the action. Did it look to you like she was right in the middle of it? She did step back but she did not go into her house.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
you see a coming tyranny and I see a petty official abusing his power.
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Perhaps but I am not ready to run for the hills yet, although when I see that a large portion of law enforcement in several states dressing like the military and handling people like their in the military would, then yes I get concerned. Now bare in mind that the cops in question and who I refer to are not in gang riddle neighborhoods.
 
Mason66 said:
If the officers are arresting somebody in front of a 7-11, do they arrest the clerk because his security cameras are taping the goings on? What is the difference?

Does a citizen not involved in the incident have to follow any order given to them by any officer at any time? If they do by law, the freedom Americans used to enjoy is gone.
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Goshin was specifically advocating the videotaping of law enforcement by the citizenry. It seems you may have misunderstood what he was saying.


Also, the multi-quote feature is your friend. :2razz:
 
theangryamerican said:
Goshin was specifically advocating the videotaping of law enforcement by the citizenry. It seems you may have misunderstood what he was saying.


Also, the multi-quote feature is your friend. :2razz:
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I didn't misunderstand, but with his experience inlaw enforcement he can speak to the similatrities of the two situations. If the taping is really what the officer was upset about, he is being taped everywhere he goes, this womans camera was no different than any other security camera ina store or in a parking lot.
 
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