Well of course if you discount all the unhealthy vegans, then veganism is a healthy lifestyle. This is what's called the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. It's similar to the "no democracies have ever fought each other" claim.
What a stupid argument when you consider that the average individual with the "Standard American Diet" is extremely unhealthy. The longest lived cultures on earth all largely eat a plant based diet.
Comparing some other culture that is not actually vegan to the standard American diet is fallacious. A valid comparison would be between American vegans and other Americans.
And what do you know, vegans tend to have higher rates of eating disorders, malnutrition, etc.
They also have much lower obesity rates, lower cancer rates (particularly colon cancer), much lower rates of type 2 diabetes, and lower heart disease rates.
Pointing out that vegans are less likely to be obese is like pointing out that people with high blood pressure are less likely to have fainting spells.
Comparing some other culture that is not actually vegan to the standard American diet is fallacious. A valid comparison would be between American vegans and other Americans.
And what do you know, vegans tend to have higher rates of eating disorders, malnutrition, etc.
eating healthy isn't the same thing as obsessing.
I don't know about veganism.
But I have been a vegetarian (off and on - about 90% on) for decades. Plus I used to be a medium intensity bodybuilder (again, about 90% while I was vegetarian).
Providing you take vitamins to make up for a couple of nutrients/vitamins that are difficult to get in non-meat sources, a vegetarian diet gives you everything you need to be healthy...including plenty of protein if you watch it right.
And it is much better for your overall well being - especially compared to a red-meat heavy diet. And it is cheaper to boot.
Why am I a vegetarian? Primarily because I think it is wrong to eat something you are not prepared to kill and dress/prepare yourself. And there is NO WAY I would ever kill a cow unless my life literally depended on it. The same more or less goes for a pig. A little less for a chicken and a lot less for a fish.
But I still would not want to kill any of them...to varying degrees.
My wife and I raise chicken for eggs and meat, quail for eggs and meat, and we garden some. Our little farm is all organic. I don't look forward to processing day but you have to kill it before you can grill it.
Obsessing? You mean like having a pathological hatred for meat?
i don't take advice from people who have eaten their way into disease.
Obsessing? You mean like having a pathological hatred for meat?
i don't take advice from people who have eaten their way into disease.
Moderator's Warning: |
I am tiring of the two of you messing up any thread on this topic. If you want to discuss things, civilly, be my guest. If you don't, you will have my wrath to deal with. |
I don't know about veganism.
But I have been a vegetarian (off and on - about 90% on) for decades. Plus I used to be a medium intensity bodybuilder (again, about 90% while I was vegetarian).
Providing you take vitamins to make up for a couple of nutrients/vitamins that are difficult to get in non-meat sources, a vegetarian diet gives you everything you need to be healthy...including plenty of protein if you watch it right.
And it is much better for your overall well being - especially compared to a red-meat heavy diet. And it is cheaper to boot.
Why am I a vegetarian? Primarily because I think it is wrong to eat something you are not prepared to kill and dress/prepare yourself. And there is NO WAY I would ever kill a cow unless my life literally depended on it. The same more or less goes for a pig. A little less for a chicken and a lot less for a fish.
But I still would not want to kill any of them...to varying degrees.
I don't know about veganism.
But I have been a vegetarian (off and on - about 90% on) for decades. Plus I used to be a medium intensity bodybuilder (again, about 90% while I was vegetarian).
Providing you take vitamins to make up for a couple of nutrients/vitamins that are difficult to get in non-meat sources, a vegetarian diet gives you everything you need to be healthy...including plenty of protein if you watch it right.
And it is much better for your overall well being - especially compared to a red-meat heavy diet. And it is cheaper to boot.
Why am I a vegetarian? Primarily because I think it is wrong to eat something you are not prepared to kill and dress/prepare yourself. And there is NO WAY I would ever kill a cow unless my life literally depended on it. The same more or less goes for a pig. A little less for a chicken and a lot less for a fish.
But I still would not want to kill any of them...to varying degrees.
Vegetarianism is not always but is a great amount of the time the result of over politicizing and obsessing about food in a not healthy or pleasant way. Is it any shock that these people would display a history of eating disorders?
EXCUSE ME, NO!
Lets get some more science on this, and kindly spend a little extra time with those vegan nut jobs, tyvm. (NOTE TO MODS: this is a political statement of disgust towards all vegans for their vegansism, not an insult towards any individual, which should be clear but just in case this is not (I like having my current score))
For sure I dont want to get in the way of the freedom of any vegan to have his pretty yuk dinner plate, but I dont have to desire to associate with them either. and dont have to be chummy with them either. I am pretty sure it says this in the Constitution.
you're also the guy who had a heart attack at 50 and doesnt care about his health though, right?
IMO, there are many good reasons for vegetarianism, perhaps even veganism ... the mass production of meat in an industrialized fashion, is often unhealthy and, when you have a closer look at it, absolutely unappetizing. I mean, just look at these animals, pumped full of antibiotics in their own feces, fed with all kinds of food that isn't their natural diet.
So you really don't need to be an animal lover to find many good reasons for vegetarianism/veganism. Though I don't think animal protection is anyhow a bad motivation either; personally, I think eating meat is very natural. As in hunting and fishing. But that doesn't mean you have to make animals suffer unnecessarily, or overextend their natural populations. (If everybody had to hunt or fish his own food, which would be the natural way our ancestors did, many more people would likely eat much less meat).
I also think there are health reasons for moderate meat consumption. In our evolutionary past, most people didn't eat meat every day. It was a food that was more difficult to obtain than grains or fruits -- or milk and eggs for that matter, so people ate less of it. I assume this has left traces in our genetic setup, so the modern habit of excessive meat consumption might well be unhealthy for our bodies.
Certainly our ancestors used to eat much less animal fat and sugar than many of us do today.
I'd say, though, that strict veganism isn't natural either. It also requires considerable care, because you really have to take care you get enough proteine and B-vitamins. When done improperly, veganism can well be damaging.
Personally, I guess I could avoid meat if necessary... but no way I'd voluntarily give up milk and cheese. Forget it.
http://jevohealth.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1022&context=journalUse of Animal Fat as a Symbol of Health in Traditional societies Suggests Humans may be Well Adapted to its Consumption
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: Recommendations to limit the dietary consumption of saturated fat have been
adopted by public health organizations in most countries. However, recent scientific studies and reviews have
questioned the alleged negative health claims regarding saturated fat.
This research aims to provide a historical, evolutionary point of view to the debate through a short review of
evidence for animal fat consumption by Paleolithic and recent traditional societies, and the discernment of
how recent traditional societies perceived animal fat in terms of health and other lifestyle aspects
Your theory has several major flaws. Here is one:
http://jevohealth.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1022&context=journal
Your theory has several major flaws. Here is one:
http://jevohealth.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1022&context=journal
that's a terrible argument. people who eat tons of animal fat don't live long healthy lives
that's a terrible argument. people who eat tons of animal fat don't live long healthy lives
Tell that to the Inuit.
Well, maybe not, science is not sure yet, but there is reason to think that fat is no where near as bad for us as has been advertised.