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Denmark to fleece refugees of money and valuables

Heinrich

Heinrich

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"The Danish parliament has approved a controversial law allowing authorities to seize refugees’ cash and valuables, and delay them being reunited with their families."
Denmark approves controversial refugee bill allowing police to seize asylum seekers' cash and valuables | Europe | News | The Independent
Although refugees have had to pay people smugglers to make it to the shores of the European Union (EU) and arrive with very little, they will be required by the Danes to finance any costs related to offering them asylum, a right protected under international law. Refugees will be allowed to keep up to €1340 ($1455) but anything above this will be seized by the police.
Denmark which was occupied by the Third Reich is reminding the rest of Europeans that Jews were required to pay for their own transport to death camps. It is an irony that this is happening on 27 January, Holocaust Memorial Day, the anniversary of the day the Auschwitz concentration camp was liberated by the Soviets. Another EU member state adds to our shame.
 
Heinrich said:
"The Danish parliament has approved a controversial law allowing authorities to seize refugees’ cash and valuables, and delay them being reunited with their families."
Denmark approves controversial refugee bill allowing police to seize asylum seekers' cash and valuables | Europe | News | The Independent
Although refugees have had to pay people smugglers to make it to the shores of the European Union (EU) and arrive with very little, they will be required by the Danes to finance any costs related to offering them asylum, a right protected under international law. Refugees will be allowed to keep up to €1340 ($1455) but anything above this will be seized by the police.
Denmark which was occupied by the Third Reich is reminding the rest of Europeans that Jews were required to pay for their own transport to death camps. It is an irony that this is happening on 27 January, Holocaust Memorial Day, the anniversary of the day the Auschwitz concentration camp was liberated by the Soviets. Another EU member state adds to our shame.
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Migrants are being put on the same footing as Danes seeking state support and quite right too. If, as you say, migrants arrive with very little, they will not be required to pay anything at all and will be housed, fed, clothed and given free medical care courtesy of the Danish taxpayer.

Calm down Heinrich. My Danish neighbours are not going to make anyone pay for their transport to death camps as you somewhat hysterically suggest.
 
Sweden said:
Migrants are being put on the same footing as Danes seeking state support and quite right too. ...
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It is obscene to equate miserable refugees fleeing war and famine, enduring peril at sea and marching with the children who survive through half a continent with Danish citizens. This is the attitude some Europeans have stooped to.
 
Heinrich said:
"The Danish parliament has approved a controversial law allowing authorities to seize refugees’ cash and valuables, and delay them being reunited with their families."
Denmark approves controversial refugee bill allowing police to seize asylum seekers' cash and valuables | Europe | News | The Independent
Click to expand...

Lets look at some facts here. The Dutch, Swiss and certain German states have been doing this for a long time. And in some cases the threshold of when they take valuables is much much lower and includes taking wedding rings.

Personal items like wedding rings are not seized.

Cash and other valuables over 1300 or so Euros are seized to pay for their care.

Denmark could also do it another way.. tell them no we wont help you until you have used your own money, and that would include selling off wedding rings.

Although refugees have had to pay people smugglers to make it to the shores of the European Union (EU) and arrive with very little, they will be required by the Danes to finance any costs related to offering them asylum, a right protected under international law. Refugees will be allowed to keep up to €1340 ($1455) but anything above this will be seized by the police.
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And they do get protection. Now we can debate the quality of care they get, because here lately the Danes have gone a bit backwards, but they do get protection and their cases are heard according to international law.

Why is it bad to require that refugees use their own funds as long as they have them? Are you seriously telling me that a refugee with 10k euros should get free room and food, and let the Danish taxpayer pay for their care?

But now lets be realistic here.. how many will this hit? Probably very few, but it is politically important step to appease a more and more reluctant population that has been fuelling a far right racist nationalists.

Denmark which was occupied by the Third Reich is reminding the rest of Europeans that Jews were required to pay for their own transport to death camps. It is an irony that this is happening on 27 January, Holocaust Memorial Day, the anniversary of the day the Auschwitz concentration camp was liberated by the Soviets. Another EU member state adds to our shame.
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False, disgusting and highly insulting comparison. You should be ashamed.
 
Heinrich said:
It is obscene to equate miserable refugees fleeing war and famine, enduring peril at sea and marching with the children who survive through half a continent with Danish citizens. This is the attitude some Europeans have stooped to.
Click to expand...

Due try to calm down Heinrich. I fear for your heart. No, the vast majority of those arriving in Dk are not fleeing 'war and famine' and an even bigger majority are young men. There are very few women and a minute number of children. You have not replied to this point: if they arrive without money, as you say, they will not be paying any.

Language style note: the use of the word 'obscene' to mean 'something with which I disagree' is to be discouraged.
 
Heinrich said:
"The Danish parliament has approved a controversial law allowing authorities to seize refugees’ cash and valuables, and delay them being reunited with their families."
Denmark approves controversial refugee bill allowing police to seize asylum seekers' cash and valuables | Europe | News | The Independent
Although refugees have had to pay people smugglers to make it to the shores of the European Union (EU) and arrive with very little, they will be required by the Danes to finance any costs related to offering them asylum, a right protected under international law. Refugees will be allowed to keep up to €1340 ($1455) but anything above this will be seized by the police.
Denmark which was occupied by the Third Reich is reminding the rest of Europeans that Jews were required to pay for their own transport to death camps. It is an irony that this is happening on 27 January, Holocaust Memorial Day, the anniversary of the day the Auschwitz concentration camp was liberated by the Soviets. Another EU member state adds to our shame.
Click to expand...

Have you really just compared between the seizing of some of the refugees' property to finance the cost of granting them an asylum and the bloody Holocaust? Seriously?
 
Heinrich said:
It is obscene to equate miserable refugees fleeing war and famine, enduring peril at sea and marching with the children who survive through half a continent with Danish citizens. This is the attitude some Europeans have stooped to.
Click to expand...

Bull****. The refugees are allowed to keep up to 10,000 kroner in cash or valuables. Anything above that will be surrendered to help pay for their care.

It's the right thing to do. It follows the same principle the majority of all nations use to fund the nursing care of their elderly. The elderly person's assets are used first, before the State (taxpayers) pick up the bill. The idea is that a person is ultimately responsible for their own food and care, but when they cannot afford to care for themselves, the State will assist.

They are allowing the refugees to keep a portion of their wealth - not a lot - but some.

Why shouldn't the refugees be required to spend their own money before the citizens who are paying taxes spend their money for their care?

You need to think this through better.
 
The specific changes made: Italics are my comments and views.

The police has to seize any valuables of 10k KR (1300 Euro) and over and this has to be used to pay for the care of the refugees. Reasonable, and done by other countries.

The right to get family up has changed so that it will take 3 years instead of the previous 1 year. Personally I dont like this change at all.


It will be harder to get permanent residence for refugees. A special residence program is cut. Clearly politically motivated and some what reasonable. Permanent residency makes it harder to kick them out when and if their home country goes back to normal.

Refugees get 10% less than before in benefits. Also they have to pay a fee to apply for permanent residence and get family up. I am not sure what the rules are for normal migrants, but I believe that there is no fee for permanent residency.. so I dont like this one at all if true. Refugees should not be discriminated against because of their situation. If normal migrants pay a fee.. then fine.

The 500 UN quota refugees will have to live up to an integration standard before Denmark will accept them. Not sure what the hell that means. But considering other countries have similar standards on who they want.. then well.

The rules on invalidating a refugee status or residency based on refugee claim has changed so that if the refugee visits the home country, then they can have their status removed. Long long overdue. Always pissed me off that Lebanese "refugees" still in Denmark have regular vacations back to Lebanon..

Refugee applicants will no longer be able to be housed in private or special housing outside the refugee centers. Clearly political, as there has been a lot of huffing and puffing about refugees getting 4 bedroom houses and there being homeless people in que for housing.
 
Heinrich said:
It is obscene to equate miserable refugees fleeing war and famine, enduring peril at sea and marching with the children who survive through half a continent with Danish citizens. This is the attitude some Europeans have stooped to.
Click to expand...

Those racist Euro's ! They are beginning to look like those racist Americans that you like to harp on. Oh wait...........Americans don't take anything from them the illegals.

Sorry............had to throw it out there. ;)

But anyways.................Denmark should do whatever it needs within reason to help offset the cost of keeping the refugees.
 
Heinrich said:
"The Danish parliament has approved a controversial law allowing authorities to seize refugees’ cash and valuables, and delay them being reunited with their families."
Denmark approves controversial refugee bill allowing police to seize asylum seekers' cash and valuables | Europe | News | The Independent
Although refugees have had to pay people smugglers to make it to the shores of the European Union (EU) and arrive with very little, they will be required by the Danes to finance any costs related to offering them asylum, a right protected under international law. Refugees will be allowed to keep up to €1340 ($1455) but anything above this will be seized by the police.
Denmark which was occupied by the Third Reich is reminding the rest of Europeans that Jews were required to pay for their own transport to death camps. It is an irony that this is happening on 27 January, Holocaust Memorial Day, the anniversary of the day the Auschwitz concentration camp was liberated by the Soviets. Another EU member state adds to our shame.
Click to expand...

I guess it is sort of like back then. The actual numbers relative to the population of Europe are not very high.
 
Sweden said:
Migrants are being put on the same footing as Danes seeking state support and quite right too. If, as you say, migrants arrive with very little, they will not be required to pay anything at all and will be housed, fed, clothed and given free medical care courtesy of the Danish taxpayer.

Calm down Heinrich. My Danish neighbours are not going to make anyone pay for their transport to death camps as you somewhat hysterically suggest.
Click to expand...

Why? Are Danes required to pay their own money till they are down to 1.500 Euros, before getting social benefits? I doubt it.
 
joG said:
Why? Are Danes required to pay their own money till they are down to 1.500 Euros, before getting social benefits? I doubt it.
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they are actually...
 
PeteEU said:
they are actually...
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That is much lower than in Germany, where it is possible to keep an apartment or house, when living on social payments, if the size is "appropriate". The government will then even pay the mortgage to a point. The same is true for a car, tv etc.
 
joG said:
That is much lower than in Germany, where it is possible to keep an apartment or house, when living on social payments, if the size is "appropriate". The government will then even pay the mortgage to a point. The same is true for a car, tv etc.
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I think you miss-understand. "Wealth" is cash, stocks and other holdings that are not connected to living conditions.

For example, if you go unemployed and have 1 million in the bank, then they demand you use that first before getting any state aid. If you own stock, or more than one house and such, then that is considered value that you can liquidate before you get state aid.

It does not mean that if you go unemployed and have 1000 euros in the bank, and a house with a mortage.. that you are forced to sell the house and so on.
 
PeteEU said:
I think you miss-understand. "Wealth" is cash, stocks and other holdings that are not connected to living conditions.

For example, if you go unemployed and have 1 million in the bank, then they demand you use that first before getting any state aid. If you own stock, or more than one house and such, then that is considered value that you can liquidate before you get state aid.

It does not mean that if you go unemployed and have 1000 euros in the bank, and a house with a mortage.. that you are forced to sell the house and so on.
Click to expand...

Oh, I know quite a bit about wealth, income and buying power. You see, paying the mortgage on a house that belongs to the person secures their equity in the house that could be Euros 100.000. The same is similar with an automobile. The social payments receiver could use a bicicle or train but maintains the asset value in the form of the car.
 
PeteEU said:
...
Personal items like wedding rings are not seized.
Click to expand...
The SS took wedding rings and tooth fillings.

PeteEU said:
Why is it bad to require that refugees use their own funds as long as they have them? Are you seriously telling me that a refugee with 10k euros should get free room and food, and let the Danish taxpayer pay for their care?
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Because these unfortunate refugees have already paid so much in privation, money to human traffickers, some children and others have paid with their lives.

Sweden said:
Due try to calm down Heinrich. I fear for your heart. No, the vast majority of those arriving in Dk are not fleeing 'war and famine' and an even bigger majority are young men. There are very few women and a minute number of children.
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Stop attempting to minimize the plight of refugees. Have you no sense of shame?

Apocalypse said:
Have you really just compared between the seizing of some of the refugees' property to finance the cost of granting them an asylum and the bloody Holocaust? Seriously?
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Inasmuch as Jews were required to finance their own transport and processing during the Final Solution, yes, there is an obvious similarity in making victims reimburse the government.

HowardBThiname said:
... It's the right thing to do. It follows the same principle the majority of all nations use to fund the nursing care of their elderly. ... Why shouldn't the refugees be required to spend their own money before the citizens who are paying taxes spend their money for their care? ...
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You are confusing other European Union states with England.

RetiredUSN said:
... Denmark should do whatever it needs within reason to help offset the cost of keeping the refugees.
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Denmark did not need to do this. Clearly it does not need what little money it will take from the refugees. It was done to make things more difficult for the victims, not easier for the Danes.
 
Whether or not this is fair depends on what benefits the refugees are receiving from the Danish government. My guess is the cost of what the refugees are receiving is greater than what the refugees are surrendering financially.

I get it. The optics are bad and it probably isn't the most compassionate way of doing things. But the Danes ARE letting them in and helping them start a new life. I'm not inclined toward being too hard on them in this case.

The deathcamp comparison is uncalled for.
 
Heinrich said:
Inasmuch as Jews were required to finance their own transport and processing during the Final Solution, yes, there is an obvious similarity in making victims reimburse the government.
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So it's the same thing, in your eyes, for a government to demand a certain minority within the country to finance their transport to the place where they will be murdered and for a government to demand people from another country to contribute to the financing, and only if they can, of the cost of granting them an asylum from a warzone within the nation's borders? Is that it, am I getting the insanity right here?
 
Heinrich said:
The SS took wedding rings and tooth fillings.
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And the relevance is how? Are you accusing the Danes of removing gold fillings and wedding bands and then shooting/gasing refugees? Seriously?

Because these unfortunate refugees have already paid so much in privation, money to human traffickers, some children and others have paid with their lives.
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And how is that relevant to Denmark, Danes or Europe in general? Hell according to you they are criminals since they paid human traffickers, so we should arrest them and deport them right?

Stop attempting to minimize the plight of refugees. Have you no sense of shame?
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Not minimizing anything. The only one who should be shameful are those that are linking Nazi Germany to this story...

Inasmuch as Jews were required to finance their own transport and processing during the Final Solution, yes, there is an obvious similarity in making victims reimburse the government.
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As much as it is irrelevant to this story. All countries have requirements for its citizens and migrants to finance many aspects of their own lives if they have the funds.. why should it be any different for refugees?

You are confusing other European Union states with England.
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Eh what does this have to do with what I wrote?

Denmark did not need to do this. Clearly it does not need what little money it will take from the refugees. It was done to make things more difficult for the victims, not easier for the Danes.
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No it was done for domestic political reasons and to make refugees equal to locals.

And if the amount seized is so small then why bitch about it in the way you are? And why did you not bitch about it when German states do the same thing.. the Swiss or the Dutch?
 
Heinrich said:
You are confusing other European Union states with England.
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I'm not confusing anything. I'm telling you that it's the fiscally responsible thing to do. The refugees are allowed to keep a portion, as noted, and the balance is used to help pay for their care. They qualify for food, shelter and healthcare.

It's the right thing to do. Those who are making a fuss over it -- simply don't understand it.
 
Apocalypse said:
So it's the same thing, in your eyes, for a government to demand a certain minority within the country to finance their transport to the place where they will be murdered and for a government to demand people from another country to contribute to the financing, and only if they can, of the cost of granting them an asylum from a warzone within the nation's borders? Is that it, am I getting the insanity right here?
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You do not appreciate the meaning of "victim".

PeteEU said:
And the relevance is how? Are you accusing the Danes of removing gold fillings and wedding bands and then shooting/gasing refugees? Seriously?
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No, in this respect the Danes are different from the SS.

PeteEU said:
And how is that relevant to Denmark, Danes or Europe in general? Hell according to you they are criminals since they paid human traffickers, so we should arrest them and deport them right?
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No; the refugees have been exploited by the traffickers. It is not a crime to be exploited by having money taken from you either by traffickers or the Danish police.

PeteEU said:
Not minimizing anything. The only one who should be shameful are those that are linking Nazi Germany to this story...
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If the cap fits, wear it.

PeteEU said:
As much as it is irrelevant to this story. All countries have requirements for its citizens and migrants to finance many aspects of their own lives if they have the funds.. why should it be any different for refugees?
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Refugees are different from English people going to work in Silicon Valley. In contrast, they have lost practically everything; their childhood, their homes, their relatives, their country, their security, and often many lost their lives. Now the Danes want to sell their asylum for whatever the refugees have left. Not a proud act and one that brings shame on them and their apologists.

PeteEU said:
No it was done for domestic political reasons and to make refugees equal to locals.
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No one is buying that.

HowardBThiname said:
I'm not confusing anything. I'm telling you that it's the fiscally responsible thing to do. The refugees are allowed to keep a portion, as noted, and the balance is used to help pay for their care. They qualify for food, shelter and healthcare.

It's the right thing to do. Those who are making a fuss over it -- simply don't understand it.
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The one thing it is not is the right thing to do and the Danes have disgraced themselves.
 
I've heard that the details on how this is going to be enforced are a little hazy. Politicians have said that it is down to the jurisdiction of the police but they've been given no specific instructions on how, or when during the immigration process, these seizures take place.

It could be that these are little more than lip service in order to dissuade economic migrants from making the trip there, which I don't see the issue with. Taking in refugees who are fleeing war is one thing but economic migration should be more strongly reviewed.
 
Heinrich said:
You do not appreciate the meaning of "victim".
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I deeply apologize if I'm not seeing any similarities whatsoever between using the belongings of refugees to finance the asylum a nation grants them within its borders and the Holocaust.
 
Heinrich said:
The one thing it is not is the right thing to do and the Danes have disgraced themselves.
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Not only is it "right," it's essential in order to continue to offer care and services for all the refugees. Where do you think money comes from? Trees?
 
HowardBThiname said:
Not only is it "right," it's essential in order to continue to offer care and services for all the refugees. Where do you think money comes from? Trees?
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Have no doubt that Denmark is not broke and a good deal wealthier than miserable refugees.
 
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