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Merkel's Last Stand? Chancellor Running Out of Time on Refugee Issue

Roadvirus said:
The problem is that European authorities and politicans are damn near spineless when it comes to implementing law in regards to other ethnic/religious groups. Look at the Rotherham scandal...scared to death of reporting Muslim Child sex rings for 16 years for fear of being slapped with a racist label. Who's to say they'll act when a Sharia "court" oversteps it's boundaries for the same reason?
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Yep.

It seems awfully naive to me to think that a legal system that treats women as second class citizens by very design, is adjucated by Imans steeped in an extremely misogynistic system, and passes judgments on women who have been coerced into using them will somehow render verdicts fair to them.

The sheer weight of the bureaucracy necessary to oversee them adequately would be prohibitively expensive and unwieldy to administer, so will more likely end up being little more than a rubber stamp committee. In the end, it is guaranteed to be bad for women even if the weasel talking multiculturalist bureaucrats claim otherwise.
 
Lafayette said:
Just last week I watched an interview of an African immigrant who was a riveter for a German company (that hired and apprenticed him), which makes electricity wind-mills. They had spent months looking for an equivalent in Germany, Poland and Hungary – and got nowhere.
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Riveting is an extremely difficult skill that only a select few ever master. Germans, Poles, and Hungarians are too backwards to be any good at it, even after an apprenticeship. You have to go to a very advanced place like Africa to find a good riveter. Most people don't know it, but the U.S. probably would never have gotten to the moon if it had not brought in Mauretanians and Ugandans to do the complex riveting the space program required. Americans just couldn't do the job.
 
Roadvirus said:
The problem is that European authorities and politicans are damn near spineless when it comes to implementing law in regards to other ethnic/religious groups. Look at the Rotherham scandal...scared to death of reporting Muslim Child sex rings for 16 years for fear of being slapped with a racist label. Who's to say they'll act when a Sharia "court" oversteps it's boundaries for the same reason?
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Problem is that whether in Europe or the US, if people want to go to unofficial sharia courts you'll find it hard to stop them.

Anyhow - I am hopeful that the debate in Parliament will force the issue to be dealt with fully. Enforcing any ban or imitations on sharia courts will depend on information and cooperation from the public whether here or in Europe / the US. If you alienate your population then they don't cooperate and underground courts will just operate without impunity.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
Problem is that whether in Europe or the US, if people want to go to unofficial sharia courts you'll find it hard to stop them.

Anyhow - I am hopeful that the debate in Parliament will force the issue to be dealt with fully. Enforcing any ban or imitations on sharia courts will depend on information and cooperation from the public whether here or in Europe / the US. If you alienate your population then they don't cooperate and underground courts will just operate without impunity.
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They will not operate with impunity if those subverting the British legal system are deported or jailed.

Cut off the snakes head rather than feeding it. The U.K. needs to start jailing or deporting the Imams who are leading the war against it. Everybody knows who they are.
 
Gardener said:
They will not operate with impunity if those subverting the British legal system are deported or jailed.

Cut off the snakes head rather than feeding it. The U.K. needs to start jailing or deporting the Imams who are leading the war against it. Everybody knows who they are.
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As I tried to explain - you will just drive the courts underground. There probably are already unofficial courts operating in the US - they just haven't been discovered yet.

As for deporting imams - that's something we're not very good at yet, too many elements of national and international law to protect them or delay the process. We have a lot to learn from the French who have been able to deport 40 imams in the same time we have failed to deport hate preachers and their ilk.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
As I tried to explain - you will just drive the courts underground. There probably are already unofficial courts operating in the US - they just haven't been discovered yet.

As for deporting imams - that's something we're not very good at yet, too many elements of national and international law to protect them or delay the process. We have a lot to learn from the French who have been able to deport 40 imams in the same time we have failed to deport hate preachers and their ilk.
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Well, that sure sounds like a Hobson's choice to me. You either promote Sharia law by sanctioning it or you promote Sharia law by driving it underground.

I have raised two sons, and the one thing I sure never did when they were acting up is to give them candy hoping it would improve their behavior.
 
Gardener said:
Well, that sure sounds like a Hobson's choice to me. You either promote Sharia law by sanctioning it or you promote Sharia law by driving it underground.

I have raised two sons, and the one thing I sure never did when they were acting up is to give them candy hoping it would improve their behavior.
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My recollection of Hobson's choice was different however the point I was making that you either have a form of Sharia that fits within common law or it's driven underground. The reality is that even with sanctioned courts there is an underground network of courts which you'll probably find in any country including the US.

Even where we may have muslims who are unlikely to become extremists who take up arms against us such as Kurdish muslims - there will be a wish for internal and unofficial courts to decide matters between muslims. The only real solution is the one espoused by Mr Trump and stop all immigration or go even further and deport all if you wish to truly solve the issue of muslims using an alternate legal system.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
My recollection of Hobson's choice was different however the point I was making that you either have a form of Sharia that fits within common law or it's driven underground. The reality is that even with sanctioned courts there is an underground network of courts which you'll probably find in any country including the US.

Even where we may have muslims who are unlikely to become extremists who take up arms against us such as Kurdish muslims - there will be a wish for internal and unofficial courts to decide matters between muslims. The only real solution is the one espoused by Mr Trump and stop all immigration or go even further and deport all if you wish to truly solve the issue of muslims using an alternate legal system.
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My response would be to make it a National priority to root them out, then. As is, the sanctioning acts as a foot in the door and rewards their efforts to move the bar in the direction of the state they are working towards.

Has appeasement ever actually worked, or does it merely postpone the problem until it is too big to be addressed?
 
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Gardener said:
My response would be to make it a National priority to root them out, then. As is, the sanctioning acts as a foot in the door and rewards their efforts to move the bar in the direction of the state they are working towards.

Has appeasement ever actually worked, or does it merely postpone the problem until it is too big to be addressed?
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I wouldn’t know, you’d need to ask someone who wishes to appease. Either that or you have misunderstood what the Parliamentary debate is all about and what it wished to achieve.

The Parliamentary discussion I support is clearly about enforcing the primacy of UK law over different religious laws. I particularly like that it forces out those who would wish to have Islamic law over UK law because these are the people we don’t want in the UK as their beliefs tend towards the extreme in other matters too.
 
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