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US warns Britain: If you leave EU you face barriers to trading with America

Funny you would want a mid level bureaucrat to use his visible position to try and influence the population of a foreign democracy.

It is you that call him a mid level bureaucrat to demean his words. The fact that this has been US policy for decades, and that even the Reagan administration warned the Thatcher regime that leaving the EU was a bad idea.. funny how you and people like you forget history constantly.. oh and facts.

And please.. influence the population... When the US does influence a country, they go all in.. and you know that.
 
It is you that call him a mid level bureaucrat to demean his words. The fact that this has been US policy for decades, and that even the Reagan administration warned the Thatcher regime that leaving the EU was a bad idea.. funny how you and people like you forget history constantly.. oh and facts.

And please.. influence the population... When the US does influence a country, they go all in.. and you know that.

Let's talk about it, when you have calmed down.
 
US warns Britain: If you leave EU you face barriers to trading with America | Politics | The Guardian


Well, this is going to be a long campaign. Two years out and already everyone is voicing their opinion on it. Can't see them not signing a trade deal if UK voted out though, they'd just prefer the path of least resistance vis-a-vie trade relationships.

Did "the US" warn Britain or did the TTIP negotiator do so? While I truly believe that GB would be crazy to exit the EU totally, I do not think that a trade negotiator is the one to carry the message and threaten a friendly population.
 
Why so eager to break up the EU?

I can understand why citizens within the EU might ask for it but for those with nothing to do with it ~ there's always an agenda.

There's usually some bald faced lies about how parts of old Europe should go back to what they were but they are totally ignorant of how bad some parts of life in old Europe actually were.
 
You really think it would strengthen the US? I don't really think it would.

It is not about what I think.. it is what the Americans have been doing for decades. Every time a country or group of countries threaten the domination of the US economic power, then the US has turned on them in one way or another. The US, especially the US right, has to be nr. 1 at everything and when they are not, they get petty and destructive. It has always been like that. Look at China... any idiot could see that China would pass the US as the biggest economy on the planet.. they have 5x+ the population! But you read American headlines.. the "shock" it has happened or is happening and the shame.. and how bad China is and they are the enemy bla bla bla.. Same with the Russians atm, or the French after they refused to invade Iraq... it happens all the time.

It is just that the EU has overshot and is wasting too much political capital and treasure on solving the problems of the last century messily. If it addressed any of the pressing challenges of the beginning century, it would be only a question of the incompetent handling. But it is directing the means away from projects that are existential to our all survival. Worse than the waste, the misdirected effort is probably increasing the dangers of this century.

Listen I dont disagree fully, but let look at many of those things.. Ukraine for example and Crimea. An EU issue? Nope not really. Sure they have fertile lands for food production, but lets be realistic here.. adding Ukraine would be worse than adding Romania and Bulgaria 10 times.. their economy was in tatters even before the current crisis. Why did it get involved then? I say because of the US, via NATO basically set the agenda. That whole mess was about cold war issues and nothing about "treasure". It was about the port of Sevastopol and the Russia Black Sea Fleet... pure and simple. Or adding former iron curtain countries to the EU before they were ready.. that was political, but political based on a cold war mentality that exists in NATO and is primarily driven by the Americans.. not the European countries. America wanted to take influence away from Russia, and by suggesting the EU and Europeans to get Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and the Baltic nations into the EU asap.. they did that. Once that was done, then their applications to NATO would be much easier to justify and wupti, suddenly the US has the ability to put forces right up against the Russian border.

So yes, as long as the US can influence European policy in their favour (and there are plenty of examples on that.. extradition treaties to trade deals to information sharing.. well giving to the US more like.... ) then the EU and UK are good to have around.. but as soon as we show any form of independence, then it is time to sabotage us. It happens time and time again since 1945.
 
~ The US, especially the US right, has to be nr. 1 at everything and when they are not, they get petty and destructive ~

I think this kind of thinking often drives the desire by some non-European citizens to see the EU fall apart. I always wonder why the "special interest.."

~ Listen I dont disagree fully, but let look at many of those things.. Ukraine for example and Crimea. An EU issue? Nope not really. Sure they have fertile lands for food production, but lets be realistic here.. adding Ukraine would be worse than adding Romania and Bulgaria 10 times.. their economy was in tatters even before the current crisis. Why did it get involved then? I say because of the US, via NATO basically set the agenda. That whole mess was about cold war issues and nothing about "treasure". It was about the port of Sevastopol and the Russia Black Sea Fleet... pure and simple. Or adding former iron curtain countries to the EU before they were ready.. that was political, but political based on a cold war mentality that exists in NATO and is primarily driven by the Americans.. not the European countries. America wanted to take influence away from Russia, and by suggesting the EU and Europeans to get Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and the Baltic nations into the EU asap.. they did that. Once that was done, then their applications to NATO would be much easier to justify and wupti, suddenly the US has the ability to put forces right up against the Russian border ~

I don't disagree any of this. Same with the very strong pressure from the US to have Turkey join the EU; regardless of the fact Turkey has very porous borders and we would see a vastly larger influx of Arab looking Turks migrating into Europe than we do now with the refugee crisis.
 
Did "the US" warn Britain or did the TTIP negotiator do so? While I truly believe that GB would be crazy to exit the EU totally, I do not think that a trade negotiator is the one to carry the message and threaten a friendly population.

I suppose if he's fired we'll know that he doesn't represent the American administration. :shrug:
 
Because it strengthens the US and Russian Empires.

Why! I thought the odds were higher that the planets of Uran and Neptune would crash into one another VS agreeing with your positions, but if your serious then "Yes" that is my initial speculative suspicion.

If so though, the US position seem pro-EU at the demise of Russians and some Americans.
 
I suppose if he's fired we'll know that he doesn't represent the American administration. :shrug:

If not, then it is a good sign of cooperation and growth between US and EU.

The only thing better would be Canada and Australia to also make similar claims.
 
Froman should be fired. A medium level bureaucrat should not be allowed to get involved in the political process of a democratic country. The EU must be really putting on pressure. Do you believe this is in connection to TTIP? The EU people could have connected the success of the negotiations with just such a statement.

I agree. that was a stupid thing to say and only causes political fallout that has to be fixed later.
the US will make trade agreements with Britain regardless if they are in the EU or not.

the fact they want to pull out of the EU I think shows smarts on the side of Britain. there is nothing that the EU offers them
that is worth being a member of.
 
I assume the former, which makes this a great pro-EU policy!

It is indeed a pro-EU policy.

But we shouldn't be punishing our allies for leaving the EU.
 
It is indeed a pro-EU policy.

But we shouldn't be punishing our allies for leaving the EU.

Since the EU cannot, someone has to. Cheers fellow American! Have a drink up at the tavern and tell the bartender that it is on me ;)

:peace
 
I suppose if he's fired we'll know that he doesn't represent the American administration. :shrug:

Obama won't fire him. TTIP would then have no chance of completion before he goes.
 
I agree. that was a stupid thing to say and only causes political fallout that has to be fixed later.
the US will make trade agreements with Britain regardless if they are in the EU or not.

the fact they want to pull out of the EU I think shows smarts on the side of Britain. there is nothing that the EU offers them
that is worth being a member of.

Though, I do think that the UK is better off with a voice at the table, the EU is a mess and could conceivably harm the UK, unless the British are mindful of the dangers. But they did avoid the Euro and Schengen. That is a good record, so there is hope.
 
Though, I do think that the UK is better off with a voice at the table, the EU is a mess and could conceivably harm the UK, unless the British are mindful of the dangers. But they did avoid the Euro and Schengen. That is a good record, so there is hope.

I think that is why Britain wants out of it because the EU is a mess and is basically at this point being run by Germany full steam ahead.
I think Britain can do fine on their own without the need of the EU.

without them there Germany will just gain a bit more power in the EU than what it has.
however Britain sheds itself of the instability of Greece, spain etc ...
 
I think that is why Britain wants out of it because the EU is a mess and is basically at this point being run by Germany full steam ahead.
I think Britain can do fine on their own without the need of the EU.

without them there Germany will just gain a bit more power in the EU than what it has.
however Britain sheds itself of the instability of Greece, spain etc ...

On the other hand the slide towards Russia will become very hard for German trans Atlanicists to stop, without the UK on board. The EU would become a much more lose canon than it already is.
 
Why on earth should he be fired? He is only stating fact. Why is it with you anti-European types that when facts are put on the table, you want to punish people and deny basic facts? Oh not to mention blaming the EU for everything. The EU putting pressure on who and why?

Stop saying 'anti-european', people are anti-EU. The EU is not europe.
 
I think this kind of thinking often drives the desire by some non-European citizens to see the EU fall apart. I always wonder why the "special interest.."

It is a very American thing.. wanting always to be nr 1. at everything. Now this is admirable, but it is also a problem when it becomes fanatical and a fact that you cant be nr 1 because someone else is better at it. That is when the destructive attitude starts.. the classic is the rivalry between Nancy Kerrigan and Tonya Harding... ice skaters in the 1990s. It basically ended with one attacking the other because she could not compete.

I don't disagree any of this. Same with the very strong pressure from the US to have Turkey join the EU; regardless of the fact Turkey has very porous borders and we would see a vastly larger influx of Arab looking Turks migrating into Europe than we do now with the refugee crisis.

The US wish for Turkey to be in the EU is geo political of course. By linking them closer to Europe, they grow further apart from the other countries in the Middle East.. Syria and so on. Also because Turkey is close to the Russians, and most importantly... the Bosphorus. Same reason that the British Empire propped up the Ottomans for almost 100 years..

But I dont know if you have noticed.. the US wish for Turkey to be in the EU has died down a lot the last half a decade or so.. ever wondered why? Look at the situation in the Baltics, Poland and now Ukraine. Turkey use to be the closest NATO country to the Russians.. it aint any more.
 
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Business is business, and I see no reason why trade between UK and USA would not continue as usual should UK vote to terminate their EU membership. Certainly not because of views voiced by some idiot, and we have such idiots in UK too. Further, the views expressed by such people are not necessarily shared by population of either UK or USA, and certainly not on this issue.
 
It is a very American thing.. wanting always to be nr 1. at everything. Now this is admirable, but it is also a problem when it becomes fanatical and a fact that you cant be nr 1 because someone else is better at it. That is when the destructive attitude starts.. the classic is the rivalry between Nancy Kerrigan and Tonya Harding... ice skaters in the 1990s. It basically ended with one attacking the other because she could not compete.

Elements of how there is a need for a dire enemy number one. Suddenly muslims are as real a threat as Russia with all her nukes were/are. You've fallen for that line of thought too.

~ But I dont know if you have noticed.. the US wish for Turkey to be in the EU has died down a lot the last half a decade or so.. ever wondered why? Look at the situation in the Baltics, Poland and now Ukraine. Turkey use to be the closest NATO country to the Russians.. it aint any more.

Yeah, I noticed that too. About time too as Turkey's actions in Syria and over the Kurds show just whose side the Turks are on (Turkey's)
 
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