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Do you consider America to dangerous to visit?

Higgins86

Higgins86

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World shocked at enduring racism, gun violence in US - Connecticut Post

Obama says gun violence much worse in US than Israel, France, Japan - The Times of India

Simple question really.

Given the high number of mass shootings and racial tensions in the US over the past few years would you feel comfortable visiting or even living in the US? Obviously in the past 12 months we have seen a number of high profile race related issues involving the Police which has resulted in riots and now a mass shooting. Now these shootings are nothing new to the US however they do seem to be increasing in number.
Reading a lot of media outlets over the past week and many countries seem appalled by the sheer number of gun related deaths in the US, is this a concern for you and would it put you off living in the US?

I'm caught in two minds as I have lived in the US before and it was in the relatively quiet and safe NH, however I have visited certain areas where I would feel uncomfortable raising a family. Saying that though Sandy Hook was eye opening for both me and my wife as it happened in New England and I have to say it did influence our decision to move back to the UK.

I love the US and visit several times a year however I do think their are major issues that need to be addressed and are not. The stats don't lie and gun crime is out of control over there and a lot of people also seem to be playing dumb when it comes to the obvious racial tensions between Blacks and Whites.
 
No not in the slightest. We have a huge population, judging us for the atrocities that happen occasionally is unfair.
 
catch22 said:
No not in the slightest. We have a huge population, judging us for the atrocities that happen occasionally is unfair.
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I mean I'm 33 times more likely to get shot in America than I am in Israel.

It's not something I worry about when I visit most places in the US but it certaintly changes the way you behave when visiting.
 
Higgins86 said:
I mean I'm 33 times more likely to get shot in America than I am in Israel.

It's not something I worry about when I visit most places in the US but it certaintly changes the way you behave when visiting.
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Citation? I bet if you compare the U.S. to the rest of the world we have to be in the top 10% of safest countries.
Also, just looking at gun violence is a bad way to judge safety as a whole.
 
Come to Texas. [for a visit] If you mind your Ps and Qs we won't have to shoot you. ;)
 
I don't consider it dangerous to live here so I wouldn't consider it dangerous to visit. Even further, I think most tourist destinations are safer than non-tourist areas because cities care more about looking good to visitors than being safe for residents.
 
ThePlayDrive said:
I don't consider it dangerous to live here so I wouldn't consider it dangerous to visit. Even further, I think most tourist destinations are safer than non-tourist areas because cities care more about looking good to visitors than being safe for residents.
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That's true enough. I visited Chicago and there was a decent Police presence in the busy tourist/ city areas.
 
Higgins86 said:
That's true enough. I visited Chicago and there was a decent Police presence in the busy tourist/ city areas.
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Chicago is the perfect example, particularly now. Our current mayor has spent a significant amount of money on increasing the visual appeal and safety of tourist areas while reducing police officers and other crime prevention resources in crime-ridden, low-income neighborhoods that tourists rarely visit. If you visit the United States and stick to the places made for tourists, you'll (generally) be good to go.
 
ThePlayDrive said:
Chicago is the perfect example, particularly now. Our current mayor has spent a significant amount of money on increasing the visual appeal and safety of tourist areas while reducing police officers and other crime prevention resources in crime-ridden, low-income neighborhoods that tourists rarely visit. If you visit the United States and stick to the places made for tourists, you'll (generally) be good to go.
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Do you feel the potential for racial tensions in Chicago like we have seen in other cities like Baltimore and Ferguson?
 
Higgins86 said:
I mean I'm 33 times more likely to get shot in America than I am in Israel.

It's not something I worry about when I visit most places in the US but it certaintly changes the way you behave when visiting.
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uh if you don't do drugs, screw around with those who do and if you don't have a felony record, your chances of being shot is not much different here than in the UK
 
No. Haven't seen much in the way of European tourists getting gunned down over there.
 
TurtleDude said:
uh if you don't do drugs, screw around with those who do and if you don't have a felony record, your chances of being shot is not much different here than in the UK
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My kids are not doing gun drills in UK schools but my oldest had to do them when we lived in the US. Had to hide somewhere and play dead, I have to say that was a massive social shock to me.
 
Higgins86 said:
My kids are not doing gun drills in UK schools but my oldest had to do them when we lived in the US. Had to hide somewhere and play dead, I have to say that was a massive social shock to me.
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my point still stands
 
All the stats make this a very clouded issue, and media perceptions are not helping things.

If you looked at "intentional homicides per 100K" then the US (5 per) is more dangerous than Israel (2 per,) France, Italy, Austria, New Zealand, Ireland, Finland, etc. (all 1 per.) But is safer than Russia (9 per,) Mexico (22 per,) Brazil (25 per,) South Africa (31 per,) and Jamaica (39 per.) Those stats are 2012 numbers from the World Bank collected by the various UN organizations, take that for what you will. The UNODC has a slight change on these numbers, seems to mix 2012 with 2010 numbers, but close enough.

If you looked at "total crimes per 100K" then things change greatly. The US (41 per) is more dangerous than many nations in Europe, and Russia, and China, and even Mexico. The comparable nations that have a higher total crime rate are France (61 per,) Germany (78 per,) Canada (80 per,) and the UK (109 per.) The source is the same organizations.

But back to that perception. The US is the one making world news for racial relations from high profile police activity, our riots make the same news outlets around the globe. We also have to keep in mind the area being visited. Going to New York or Chicago or Detroit is bound to skew the risk results vs. going to some small bed and breakfast in upstate Vermont. Going to the beaches of Los Angeles or Daytona Beach is bound to skew the results vs. going to a beach somewhere in the Carolinas.

It is my opinion that we have too much conflicting data to suggest the US is or is not a dangerous visit vs. some of these other nations. But without comparison, the conversation is a bit worthless.

One of the sources...
Intentional homicides (per 100,000 people) | Data | Table (note, the collection separates homicides from crime from deaths from warfare.)
 
Higgins86 said:
My kids are not doing gun drills in UK schools but my oldest had to do them when we lived in the US. Had to hide somewhere and play dead, I have to say that was a massive social shock to me.
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Same hysteria that had us ducking under our desks in case of a nuclear attack when we were kids.

duck-and-cover.jpg
 
Higgins86 said:
I mean I'm 33 times more likely to get shot in America than I am in Israel.

It's not something I worry about when I visit most places in the US but it certaintly changes the way you behave when visiting.
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According to the per 100,000 people statistics you're also more likely to get shot and killed in Finland, Sweden and Canada than in Israel.
Just a small note there.
 
TurtleDude said:
my point still stands
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I'm not sure it does mate. Our gun death rate if around 0.04%, in recent years that has meant between 40-60 people a year and that was mostly due to gangs/crime related incidents.
 
Higgins86 said:
Do you feel the potential for racial tensions in Chicago like we have seen in other cities like Baltimore and Ferguson?
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Well, the ACLU recently came out with a report showing that Chicago uses stop-and-frisk more than New York, the city that became famous for stop-and-frisk. The report also found that, no surprise, black and Hispanic residents were stopped disproportionately. Chicago police are also infamous for torturing people in its custody. On a related note, it is also been called "The false confession capital of the United States".

In other words, the racial tension is already there. I don't know if it will explode the same way Baltimore and Ferguson exploded, though.
 
Ben K. said:
Yeah, I remember that story. Sorry about that.

But tourists have been murdered here too. Looking at the sheer number of tourists that visit the States I don't perceive an increased risk on the face of it.
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Oh I don't disagree , in terms of visiting the US I have no problems and In fact its probably one of my favorite countries to visit. Was more curious to see if other non-American posters agreed with the media perception of the US.

Living in the US however is a different story. Don't know if I could do it again for a number of issues.
 
Higgins86 said:
I'm not sure it does mate. Our gun death rate if around 0.04%, in recent years that has meant between 40-60 people a year and that was mostly due to gangs/crime related incidents.
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our gun death rate-once you remove suicides and mopes shooting mopes isn't much higher

and our violent crime rate is lower than yours
 
TurtleDude said:
our gun death rate-once you remove suicides and mopes shooting mopes isn't much higher

and our violent crime rate is lower than yours
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Not getting dragged into this one as we could go back and forth forever lol as we have done before. Really more want to hear from non American posters as well.

P.S My tip for Wimbeldon is Murray, he looks great right now.
 
ThePlayDrive said:
Chicago is the perfect example, particularly now. Our current mayor has spent a significant amount of money on increasing the visual appeal and safety of tourist areas while reducing police officers and other crime prevention resources in crime-ridden, low-income neighborhoods that tourists rarely visit. If you visit the United States and stick to the places made for tourists, you'll (generally) be good to go.
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Not good enough. All it takes is one little mistake on the subway and you can wind up in an area so crime-ridden and nasty that even the cabbies will stop and try to convince you to leave. This is a literal example I'm using: this happened to my friend. She knew the moment she got off the train she shouldn't be there, but she's American. Someone from a safer country (which is virtually all of them in the developed world, and even many in the developing world) might not be street smart enough to see it as quickly as she did.

There are definitely many places in America that are blatantly unsafe, even in broad daylight. I have seen those parts of town, and many American cities have them nowadays.

Yes, the tourist centers are nicer. But tourists don't know their way around. And in some places, like New Orleans, the tourist area is so limited and narrow that even going one block away from it puts you in very real danger.

People go to much more dangerous places all the time, obviously. People still go as tourists to the Middle East, and India, and even some of the uglier countries in Africa. So it's not necessarily a reason to avoid traveling to America.

But let's not kid ourselves about something: a lot of America is pretty damn dangerous, and it's disingenuous to pretend it's just like the rest of the West. It's not. It is blatantly, dramatically more dangerous. And tourists deserve to know that so they can plan accordingly. It's not an "adventure" to wind up in the wrong part of an American city, the way it when touring much of Europe.

My friend and I lived in one of the nicest cities in the country, before we moved to the UK. A week before we moved, a bullet missed her by 5 feet. Some random gay hate shooting. In a nice part of the most gay-friendly city in the country.

Sadly, that's not even the first time she's been assaulted with a gun. And she's only 25.

It's really nice to be able to wind up in the wrong part of town and not fear for my safety, I have to say. She feels similarly. Both of us are much more twitchy than most people here. A lot of our British/European friends don't understand why we're so paranoid., because America's done a very good job of white-washing its domestic problems.
 
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