NATO Urges Russia to pull back troops in Crimea, will stand by Ukraine.....

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

The Crimea voting helped amped things up.....Now NATO has told Putin to Pull his Troops out. They are standing with the Ukraine as the title says.

NATO urged Russia on Thursday to call back to bases its forces on the Ukrainian Crimea peninsula, saying it stood by Ukraine's territorial integrity in the face of the greatest threat to European security since the end of the Cold War.

"Ukraine is a valued and long-standing partner for NATO. In these difficult moments NATO stands by Ukraine, NATO stands by Ukraine's sovereignty, integrity and by the fundamental principles of international law," NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen said.

"This crisis is not just about Ukraine, this crisis has serious implications for the security and stability of the Euro-Atlantic area as a whole. We clearly face the gravest threat to European security since the end of the Cold War," Rasmussen said.

"Above all we call on Russia to step up its international commitments and halt the military escalation in Crimea. We call on Russia to withdraw its forces to their bases and to refrain from any interference elsewhere in Ukraine," he said.....snip~

NATO urges Russia to pull back troops in Crimea, will stand by Ukraine

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

Well now.....Obama has called for sanctions on those responsible for what has taken place in the Crimea. Plus the travel Ban. But.....guess what. Putin is not named in any of them.

Obama orders sanctions against those involved in Russian move in Ukraine.....

President Barack Obama on Thursday ordered the freezing of U.S. assets and a ban on travel into the United States of those involved in the Russian military intervention into Ukraine's Crimea region.

Obama signed an executive order aimed at punishing those Russians and Ukrainians responsible for the Russian move into Crimea, which has triggered the worst crisis in U.S.-Russian relations since the end of the Cold War.

The order, the White House said in a statement, is "a flexible tool that will allow us to sanction those who are most directly involved in destabilizing Ukraine, including the military intervention in Crimea, and does not preclude further steps should the situation deteriorate."

One such potential for escalation would be any Russian actions in eastern Ukraine, a senior U.S. official told reporters.

The State Department is also putting in place visa bans on a number of officials and individuals responsible for or complicit in threatening the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Ukraine.

However, Russian President Vladimir Putin is not one of those singled out by the sanctions, a senior administration official said.....snip~

Obama orders sanctions against those involved in Russian move in Ukraine

Linc · Mar 6, 2014

This is not about Putin and Obama.
It is about Russia invading Ukraine.
About the EU standing with the USA to stand against Russia's naked aggression .

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

NIMBY said:
This is not about Putin and Obama.
It is about Russia invading Ukraine.
About the EU standing with the USA to stand against Russia's naked aggression .

What does the Article from Reuters say again about Obama? Why is Reuters saying Obama signed sanctions against those Russians or any involved with what took place with the Ukraine?

Were you able to read the article from Reuters and what it was saying? Any difficulties still?

DaveFagan · Mar 6, 2014

Why isn't NATO admonishing the USA for creating this monster spawn of a CIA implemented color revolution? It is quoting Euro/Atlantic alliances and threats and we are the ones that instigated this violent insurrection. Pravda always refers to NATO as the FUKUS (France, United Kingdom, United States) axisand I can certainly see why. If one wants to go after the root source of the problems in Ukraine, it is yours truly, right here in the good ol' USA. CIA, Big Banks, Big Energy, big Corporatocracy (better known as NWO) colluding to bring an energy distribution resource under its control. This has nothing, zip, nada, zero to do with those Mighty Wurlitzer buzzwords of "Freedom, Democracy, Liberty, and Justice," but real politik collusion and greed.

WCH · Mar 6, 2014

DaveFagan said:
Why isn't NATO admonishing the USA for creating this monster spawn of a CIA implemented color revolution? It is quoting Euro/Atlantic alliances and threats and we are the ones that instigated this violent insurrection. Pravda always refers to NATO as the FUKUS (France, United Kingdom, United States) axis and I can certainly see why. If one wants to go after the root source of the problems in Ukraine, it is yours truly, right here in the good ol' USA. CIA, Big Banks, Big Energy, big Corporatocracy (better known as NWO) colluding to bring an energy distribution resource under its control. This has nothing, zip, nada, zero to do with those Mighty Wurlitzer buzzwords of "Freedom, Democracy, Liberty, and Justice," but real politik collusion and greed.

I agree and Obama doesn't think we have the right to or has been not to interfere.

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

DaveFagan said:
Why isn't NATO admonishing the USA for creating this monster spawn of a CIA implemented color revolution? It is quoting Euro/Atlantic alliances and threats and we are the ones that instigated this violent insurrection. Pravda always refers to NATO as the FUKUS (France, United Kingdom, United States) axisand I can certainly see why. If one wants to go after the root source of the problems in Ukraine, it is yours truly, right here in the good ol' USA. CIA, Big Banks, Big Energy, big Corporatocracy (better known as NWO) colluding to bring an energy distribution resource under its control. This has nothing, zip, nada, zero to do with those Mighty Wurlitzer buzzwords of "Freedom, Democracy, Liberty, and Justice," but real politik collusion and greed.

I agree.....as the Trade Agreements paved the way.

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

DaveFagan said:
Why isn't NATO admonishing the USA for creating this monster spawn of a CIA implemented color revolution? It is quoting Euro/Atlantic alliances and threats and we are the ones that instigated this violent insurrection. Pravda always refers to NATO as the FUKUS (France, United Kingdom, United States) axisand I can certainly see why. If one wants to go after the root source of the problems in Ukraine, it is yours truly, right here in the good ol' USA. CIA, Big Banks, Big Energy, big Corporatocracy (better known as NWO) colluding to bring an energy distribution resource under its control. This has nothing, zip, nada, zero to do with those Mighty Wurlitzer buzzwords of "Freedom, Democracy, Liberty, and Justice," but real politik collusion and greed.

This might answer why DF.....and from Reuters about Putin and the West's Face off. Note the Option the Russian says is on the table.

The vote by Crimea's parliament gives Putin the upper hand in the crisis over Ukraine, but risks antagonizing pro-Western leaders in Kiev who have refused to resort to military action or fan tensions in Ukraine's Russian-speaking south and east.

Putin has in effect thrown back in Western diplomats' faces their argument that the ouster of Moscow-backed Viktor Yanukovich as Ukraine's president on February 22 must be accepted because his removal was the will of the people.

Now they will have to accept the will of the Crimean people.

Former KGB spy Putin looked serene as he chaired a meeting of his most senior officials in the Security Council on Thursday, seemingly oblivious to turmoil on Russian markets and Kiev's insistence that a referendum on Crimea's status would be illegal.

The 61-year-old appears to feel he holds all the cards.

"Now Putin is trying to assure that the situation remains under control, that someone has a grip on the situation there. But it is a very complicated situation - because from his point of view, whether he sends troops or does not send troops now - each decision will be seen by one group or another as a bad one," a Russian security source said.

"No, he does not want a war. He is perfectly well aware of all the problems and all the repercussions of such a decision. But if the situation gets worse and worse - where else to go? Use of military force will be considered only and if all else fails, but it is an option that is on the table.".....snip~

With Crimean appeal, Putin goes head-to-head with West over Ukraine
Reuters – 1 hr 58 mins ago

VanceMack · Mar 6, 2014

NIMBY said:
This is not about Putin and Obama.
It is about Russia invading Ukraine.
About the EU standing with the USA to stand against Russia's naked aggression .

"Standing against naked aggression"...that sounds serious. What if empty rhetoric and threats dont work as a means of "Standing against naked aggression"?

Linc · Mar 6, 2014

What if all Americans don't stand together against Putin?
What if Putin keeps Lying and Invading?
What if a large segment of each party fights over revisionist history versus having Present Moment Awareness ?

VanceMack said:
"Standing against naked aggression"...that sounds serious. What if empty rhetoric and threats dont work as a means of "Standing against naked aggression"?

VanceMack · Mar 6, 2014

NIMBY said:
What if all Americans don't stand together against Putin?
What if Putin keeps Lying and Invading?
What if a large segment of each party fights over revisionist history versus having Present Moment Awareness ?

Indeed. What if? So...what does it mean to be "Standing against naked aggression" when the rhetoric doesnt work? Then what? Super double secret probation?

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

VanceMack said:
"Standing against naked aggression"...that sounds serious. What if empty rhetoric and threats dont work as a means of "Standing against naked aggression"?

Heya VM. :2wave: Reuters says Putin was sitting, a man who looks like he is holding all the cards.

Reuters is saying the same thing Russias is working on a way that will confiscate US and European assets. Showing the US and the EU. That they aren't the only ones that can play the game with economics.

Russia works on law to hurt EU, U.S. companies as sanctions reply-RIA.....

Russian lawmakers are working on a draft law to allow the confiscation of property, assets and accounts of European or U.S. companies if sanctions are imposed on Russia over Ukraine, RIA news agency said on Wednesday......snip~

Russia works on law to hurt EU, U.S. companies as sanctions reply-RIA

VanceMack · Mar 6, 2014

MMC said:
Heya VM. :2wave: Reuters says Putin was sitting, a man who looks like he is holding all the cards.

Reuters is saying the same thing Russias is working on a way that will confiscate US and European assets. Showing the US and the EU. That they aren't the only ones that can play the game with economics.

Russia works on law to hurt EU, U.S. companies as sanctions reply-RIA.....

Russian lawmakers are working on a draft law to allow the confiscation of property, assets and accounts of European or U.S. companies if sanctions are imposed on Russia over Ukraine, RIA news agency said on Wednesday......snip~

Russia works on law to hurt EU, U.S. companies as sanctions reply-RIA

I suspect that at some point that 'red line' of "Standing against naked aggression" is going to be to allow him to do whatever he wants but claim victory by not inviting him to the annual Easter egg roll at the White House, followed by a chorus of "ewwwwwwwwwwww!!!Bern!!!! Yay Obama!"

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

VanceMack said:
I suspect that at some point that 'red line' of "Standing against naked aggression" is going to be to allow him to do whatever he wants but claim victory by not inviting him to the annual Easter egg roll at the White House, followed by a chorus of "ewwwwwwwwwwww!!!Bern!!!! Yay Obama!"

Some think the Bush CSG is on its way to the Aegean and it was being reported that we had the Taylor and two other headed for the Ukraine. Still thats only around 17 ships.

One question I have is.....can the Russian subs get thru the Bosphorus without the Turks knowing, as well as How many Subs do they have all over the place around there?

Putin is not crazy. Frustrating, unpredictable. Not crazy.

President Obama has called Vladimir Putin “the bored kid in the back of the classroom,” putting on an unsmiling, tough-guy “shtick.” Hillary Clinton just compared the Russian president to Hitler. The State Department says Putin’s reasoning on Ukraine amounts to “two plus two equals five.” Republican House Speaker Boehner branded him a “thug.” German Chancellor Angela Merkel reportedly said he is “in another world.” And George W. Bush complained that debating policy with him was “like arguing with an eighth grader with his facts wrong” and called him “cold-blooded” to his face.

He isn’t – at least not according to senior Obama aides, career military and intelligence officials, and Rep. Adam Schiff, a top Democratic member of the House Intelligence Committee.

At the same time, it doesn’t mean that we can predict everything he’s going to do,” Schiff underlined.

American officials like to quote Putin's claim that “the demise of the Soviet Union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.” They’re less keen to reflect on his comment just a few weeks later that “those who do not regret the collapse of the Soviet Union have no heart, and those that do regret it have no brain.”

That doesn’t sound like someone looking to put relations with the West back in the deep freeze of the Cold War, a unique clash of ideologies that ranged all over the world. But Putin hasn’t been shy about declaring that he wants to restore Russia’s badly eroded great-power status, calling for a “Eurasian Union” with the land of the tsars at its heart.

Is Putin “unhinged,” a reporter asked a senior administration official at a briefing late Tuesday? No, but he has a deep-seated sense of grievance against the United States, replied the official, who under the ground rules for the question-and-answer session could neither be identified nor quoted directly.....snip~

Putin is not crazy. Frustrating, unpredictable. Not crazy.

VanceMack · Mar 6, 2014

MMC said:
Some think the Bush CSG is on its way to the Aegean and it was being reported that we had the Taylor and two other headed for the Ukraine. Still thats only around 17 ships.

One question I have is.....can the Russian subs get thru the Bosphorus without the Turks knowing, as well as How many Subs do they have all over the place around there?

Putin is not crazy. Frustrating, unpredictable. Not crazy.

President Obama has called Vladimir Putin “the bored kid in the back of the classroom,” putting on an unsmiling, tough-guy “shtick.” Hillary Clinton just compared the Russian president to Hitler. The State Department says Putin’s reasoning on Ukraine amounts to “two plus two equals five.” Republican House Speaker Boehner branded him a “thug.” German Chancellor Angela Merkel reportedly said he is “in another world.” And George W. Bush complained that debating policy with him was “like arguing with an eighth grader with his facts wrong” and called him “cold-blooded” to his face.

He isn’t – at least not according to senior Obama aides, career military and intelligence officials, and Rep. Adam Schiff, a top Democratic member of the House Intelligence Committee.

At the same time, it doesn’t mean that we can predict everything he’s going to do,” Schiff underlined.

American officials like to quote Putin's claim that “the demise of the Soviet Union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.” They’re less keen to reflect on his comment just a few weeks later that “those who do not regret the collapse of the Soviet Union have no heart, and those that do regret it have no brain.”

That doesn’t sound like someone looking to put relations with the West back in the deep freeze of the Cold War, a unique clash of ideologies that ranged all over the world. But Putin hasn’t been shy about declaring that he wants to restore Russia’s badly eroded great-power status, calling for a “Eurasian Union” with the land of the tsars at its heart.

Is Putin “unhinged,” a reporter asked a senior administration official at a briefing late Tuesday? No, but he has a deep-seated sense of grievance against the United States, replied the official, who under the ground rules for the question-and-answer session could neither be identified nor quoted directly.....snip~

Putin is not crazy. Frustrating, unpredictable. Not crazy.

Meh...I figure its gonna do what its gonna do. I just think its funny watching the people that support der oneder jumping from one foot to then next re action in Ukraine. Its our fight...its not our fight. We must stand against...its not our business. Strength may mean armed conflict, you guys are a bunch of warhawks. Eventually, the final 'position' taken by the supporters will be offered after Obama finally makes up his mind on what to do.

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

VanceMack said:
Meh...I figure its gonna do what its gonna do. I just think its funny watching the people that support der oneder jumping from one foot to then next re action in Ukraine. Its our fight...its not our fight. We must stand against...its not our business. Strength may mean armed conflict, you guys are a bunch of warhawks. Eventually, the final 'position' taken by the supporters will be offered after Obama finally makes up his mind on what to do.

Well Obama did do the sanctions.....can't turn them back now. But then none of them include Putin. Moreover today someone sunk a ship at a port to keep the Ukrainians bottlenecked up.

Fallenangel · Mar 6, 2014

Russia Starts Massive Air Defense Drills Amid Crimea Standoff | Defense | RIA Novosti

MOSCOW, March 6 (RIA Novosti) – "Russia’s Western Military District has begun large-scale air defense drills at its southern testing range of Kapustin Yar on the backdrop of further escalation of tensions with the West over Ukraine.
Kapustin Yar, located some 450 kilometers (280 miles) east of the Ukrainian border, will host about 3,500 troops and over 1,000 units of military hardware for about a month. The exercise will culminate with live-firing drills, involving S-300, Buk-M1 and other air defense systems."

Cheers,
Fallen.

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

Fallenangel said:
Russia Starts Massive Air Defense Drills Amid Crimea Standoff | Defense | RIA Novosti

MOSCOW, March 6 (RIA Novosti) – "Russia’s Western Military District has begun large-scale air defense drills at its southern testing range of Kapustin Yar on the backdrop of further escalation of tensions with the West over Ukraine.
Kapustin Yar, located some 450 kilometers (280 miles) east of the Ukrainian border, will host about 3,500 troops and over 1,000 units of military hardware for about a month. The exercise will culminate with live-firing drills, involving S-300, Buk-M1 and other air defense systems."

Cheers,
Fallen.

Heya FA :2wave: .....I was just sitting here thinkin about what forces he has in Russia Right there on the borders outside of the 150k. That were sent back to base and are more than likely on alert.

Not to mention.....someone stopped the OSCE Observers from going in. According to Poland.

OSCE observers barred from entering Crimea: Polish minister

A mission of observers from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) has been stopped from entering Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula by unidentified men in military fatigues, Poland's defense minister said.

"The mission has been detained, they cannot go further. They landed in Odessa and they were travelling by car from Odessa towards the Crimean Peninsula, but they were detained by unidentified men in fatigues," the defense minister, Tomasz Siemoniak, told reporters.

Two Polish military officers are among the OSCE mission.....snip~

OSCE observers barred from entering Crimea: Polish minister

Fallenangel · Mar 6, 2014

MMC said:
Heya FA :2wave: .....I was just sitting here thinkin about what forces he has in Russia Right there on the borders outside of the 150k. That were sent back to base and are more than likely on alert.

Not to mention.....someone stopped the OSCE Observers from going in. According to Poland.

OSCE observers barred from entering Crimea: Polish minister

A mission of observers from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) has been stopped from entering Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula by unidentified men in military fatigues, Poland's defense minister said.

"The mission has been detained, they cannot go further. They landed in Odessa and they were travelling by car from Odessa towards the Crimean Peninsula, but they were detained by unidentified men in fatigues," the defense minister, Tomasz Siemoniak, told reporters.
Two Polish military officers are among the OSCE mission.....snip~

OSCE observers barred from entering Crimea: Polish minister

Hey,

Regarding Russia's forces...who knows :shrug:...well actually NATO supposed to know, large military forces movements are easily traceable and can be equally easily monitored.

They should watch some BBC as well, and other reports of lessening "Russian soldiers" presence on the streets.
BBC News - Ukraine crisis: Commander describes Russian withdrawal (Watch the video)

...and regarding people on the roads.
Ukraine: Gangs 'Smuggle Weapons Into Crimea' - Checkpoints (Watch the video)

Fallen.

Fearandloathing · Mar 6, 2014

Fallenangel said:
Hey,

Regarding Russia's forces...who knows :shrug:...well actually NATO supposed to know, large military forces movements are easily traceable and can be equally easily monitored.

They should watch some BBC as well, and other reports of lessening "Russian soldiers" presence on the streets.
BBC News - Ukraine crisis: Commander describes Russian withdrawal (Watch the video)

...and regarding people on the roads.
Ukraine: Gangs 'Smuggle Weapons Into Crimea' - Checkpoints (Watch the video)

Fallen.

While it is true that the BBC and it's poor cousin the CBC have done a far superior job of covering this, no one can say precisely what is going on.

As a Canadian we are also neighbors of Russia which has been a long standing feud, which we take to them on the ice in hockey. It may not be a joke that Putin is doing this to show his strength after being embarrassed by little Canada again in both women's and men's Olympic hockey.

The word out of Ottawa is that there has been NO pull back, that this is for optics only and to present a face in the meetings with John Kerry and the Russian foreign minister now taking place in Rome. It may be that because Canada has such a huge Ukrainian population, that Ottawa is more belligerent with the Russians, but no one is here is taking this as a positive sign; we believe in "trust but verify."

Crimea is Russian now.

Wait for the usual US arming of rebels and more cold war.

Wiggen · Mar 6, 2014

NIMBY said:
This is not about Putin and Obama.
It is about Russia invading Ukraine.
About the EU standing with the USA to stand against Russia's naked aggression .

The Far Right is trying so hard to make this Barack Obama's fault. Not Putin, you understand - hell, they have a lot in common with Putin. No, it's Obama.

Wiggen · Mar 6, 2014

DaveFagan said:
Why isn't NATO admonishing the USA for creating this monster spawn of a CIA implemented color revolution? It is quoting Euro/Atlantic alliances and threats and we are the ones that instigated this violent insurrection. Pravda always refers to NATO as the FUKUS (France, United Kingdom, United States) axisand I can certainly see why. If one wants to go after the root source of the problems in Ukraine, it is yours truly, right here in the good ol' USA. CIA, Big Banks, Big Energy, big Corporatocracy (better known as NWO) colluding to bring an energy distribution resource under its control. This has nothing, zip, nada, zero to do with those Mighty Wurlitzer buzzwords of "Freedom, Democracy, Liberty, and Justice," but real politik collusion and greed.

Well, the Far Left speaks! Guess the Guardian must have put out the politically correct position for you guys, huh?

DaveFagan · Mar 6, 2014

Wiggen said:
Well, the Far Left speaks! Guess the Guardian must have put out the politically correct position for you guys, huh?

Glad you asked the question, and here's your answer.

“Journalists” Follow Obama on Ukraine

"“Journalists” Follow Obama on Ukraine

The corporate media are a key component of the U.S. imperial machine. Although styling themselves as watchdogs, they are in fact the dogs of war, whose mission is to hide Washington’s aggressions behind a fog of lies.
"

MMC · Mar 6, 2014

DaveFagan said:
Glad you asked the question, and here's your answer.

“Journalists” Follow Obama on Ukraine

"“Journalists” Follow Obama on Ukraine

The corporate media are a key component of the U.S. imperial machine. Although styling themselves as watchdogs, they are in fact the dogs of war, whose mission is to hide Washington’s aggressions behind a fog of lies.
"

Uh oh.....you know you cant be telling it like it is. To Much reality and you will pop that cork.

Fallenangel · Mar 7, 2014

Fearandloathing said:
While it is true that the BBC and it's poor cousin the CBC have done a far superior job of covering this, no one can say precisely what is going on.

As a Canadian we are also neighbors of Russia which has been a long standing feud, which we take to them on the ice in hockey. It may not be a joke that Putin is doing this to show his strength after being embarrassed by little Canada again in both women's and men's Olympic hockey. .

Huh?

Fearandloathing said:
The word out of Ottawa is that there has been NO pull back, that this is for optics only and to present a face in the meetings with John Kerry and the Russian foreign minister now taking place in Rome. It may be that because Canada has such a huge Ukrainian population, that Ottawa is more belligerent with the Russians, but no one is here is taking this as a positive sign; we believe in "trust but verify."

Crimea is Russian now.

Wait for the usual US arming of rebels and more cold war.

Crimea would decide on whatever they want. ...and well... if US wants to arm the "rebels", they can try. :bringit

Fallen.

NATO Urges Russia to pull back troops in Crimea, will stand by Ukraine.....

MMC

MMC

Linc

NIMBY

MMC

DaveFagan

Iconoclast

WCH

Believer

MMC

MMC

VanceMack

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

Linc

NIMBY

VanceMack

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

MMC

VanceMack

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

MMC

VanceMack

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

MMC

Fallenangel

MMC

Fallenangel

Fearandloathing

How long is now?

Wiggen

Wiggen

DaveFagan

Iconoclast

MMC

Fallenangel