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Thread: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

  1. #31
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post
    This statement is a little bit short sighted. What in Heavens name will we produce the electricity with, windmills?

    The leftist liberal, whackos want us to tear down the dams, have tried to kill the coal industry, have killed nuclear electric generation, have all but put oil bearing shale lands off limits, have prohibited offshore oil exploration and are trying to kill an economy that could hopefully come up with a new solution.

    Do you think that Big Brother's involvement developed the original coal industry that got the industrial revolution started, do you really think that Big Brother was responsible for the discovery and the developement of the petro-chemical industry that put the US on top of the world heap?

    I tell you that the proponents of this anti-oil business have another agenda. Case in point, Al Gore for starters. Taxing the one remaining source of reasonably priced energy then spending it to destroy the goose that laid the golden egg, is as foolhardy a perscription for this energy question as was ever proposed.
    What will we produce energy with? Coal, Nuclear power, and renewable energies. Coal is on the rise, and oil plants are declining. This is not about global warming, this is about US dependence on oil.

    Big brothers involvement have always been there, both good and bad. The government must make sure that the conditions for private enterprise to create renewable energy is good. Liberals want to force people, conservatives want to give incentives and remove unnecessary regulations. For instance government should try to remove health insurance from the employer and get rid of the labor unions, because they are destroying the automobile industry.
    You must take personal responsibility. You cannot change the circumstances, the seasons, or the wind, but you can change yourself. That is something you have charge of. ~Jim Rohn

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  2. #32
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Excuse me sir, but the sign clearly says, "Don't feed the troll."

  3. #33
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    Doesn't matter if you believe in global warming or not, but peak oil is going to happen.
    Peak oil has already happened in most oil producing countries around the world.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post
    This statement is a little bit short sighted. What in Heavens name will we produce the electricity with, windmills?

    The leftist liberal, whackos want us to tear down the dams, have tried to kill the coal industry, have killed nuclear electric generation, have all but put oil bearing shale lands off limits, have prohibited offshore oil exploration and are trying to kill an economy that could hopefully come up with a new solution.

    Do you think that Big Brother's involvement developed the original coal industry that got the industrial revolution started, do you really think that Big Brother was responsible for the discovery and the developement of the petro-chemical industry that put the US on top of the world heap?

    I tell you that the proponents of this anti-oil business have another agenda. Case in point, Al Gore for starters. Taxing the one remaining source of reasonably priced energy then spending it to destroy the goose that laid the golden egg, is as foolhardy a perscription for this energy question as was ever proposed.
    Your ranting aside, would you back a feasible energy plan that didnt involve fossil fuels or nuclear generation?
    I'm Done

    See my last post

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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post
    Yes but!!!! Why do you suppose this is? How about because we have let the whacko environmentalist and Liberals keep us from developing our own oil resources with phony pictures of Polar Bears dying from melting ice packs.
    A decade ago, yes, that would have helped. If it's economically feasible now, then the oil companies should do it.

    However, at the moment we're facing the demand of EU, US, India and China all at once vying for the same resource. The production of oil will increase, no doubt. But, the demand will skyrocket and will easily outstrip the supply. We're up a creek on this one and it's difficult if impossible to get out.

    Lastly, on issues of the environment, I'm going to side with the likes of Teddy Roosevelt and Green Republicans when it comes to how we should use our natural resources .
    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post
    And as far as not having lived in the Soviet Union? You don't think that the proliferation of material available on life in under Stalin, Lenin, et al, is sufficient to form a reasonable picture?
    Dude, I was born in the USSR (came to US in '92 when I was less than 10 years old.) I've read books about it and heard stories from family and friends. The USSR was a horrid ****-hole.

    Obama, as I've always say and will continue to say, is not a communist, muslim or fascist. In my eyes he is a naive and unprepared administrator who lacks a fundamental understanding of how an economy works (and what needs to not be done to make it work) that is trying to make things work, but failing badly at it. No, I don't think he's sitting around with others in his cabinet and actively thinking of how to turn the country into a socialist paradise of some sort. His policies suck and his VP choice made me think: Really? Biden? Bob the Dog Catcher could've been a better choice...

    Furthermore, it would be an insult to the millions that have died at the hands of Hitler and Stalin to compare Obama to those monsters. The left tried this **** back when Bush was still president (remember "BUSHHITLER!!! BUSHHITLER!!!") and compared him to all sorts of dictators and, in my eyes, pretty much dissed the millions of victims that died under Nazi oppression. Why would you make similarly poorly thought out comparisons that only offend those that have perished? I strongly dislike the left and the marchers that took to the streets when Bush was president and whined just about everything that they could think of and I'm not going to go down the same misguided path that they have by saying that Obama is a communist dictator.
    * Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil. --Thomas Mann
    * "Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. ... The slogan 'press on' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."... Calvin Coolidge 30th President of the USA.

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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    Peak oil has already happened in most oil producing countries around the world.
    Not really, it happen in some countries, but others it hasn't happen yet. This can be easily seen from this diagram
    Last edited by Camlon; 03-13-10 at 09:24 PM.
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  6. #36
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Penguin View Post
    A decade ago, yes, that would have helped. If it's economically feasible now, then the oil companies should do it.

    However, at the moment we're facing the demand of EU, US, India and China all at once vying for the same resource. The production of oil will increase, no doubt. But, the demand will skyrocket and will easily outstrip the supply. We're up a creek on this one and it's difficult if impossible to get out.
    It won't even matter, baring two exceptions. The problem with people like Boomyal is that they are exceedingly unaware of how oil actually works. They think that allowing US expansion of its relatively absolute production capacity will lower prices and ensure oil flows to America. That would be the case if we nationalized our oil production like Mexico and Venezuela. In the rest of the world, oil is traded like every other commodity. Bought and sold on exchanges. The US simply does not have the capacity or the ability to quickly expand production to the point where it can actually effect total supply and thereby prices. Unlike OPEC, Russia and other large producers, we are simply too small of a seller to have any real effect upon oil exchange prices outside of mass speculation in the oil futures markets.

    Analogously, the US is like a mom and pop grocery store and OPEC and Russia are WalMart Super Centers. There's no way we can materially change oil prices via production. Anyone who argues otherwise is completely ignorant to the basic understanding of exchanges and supply and demand.

    We really should see the oil untapped in the US as nothing more then a stop gap to buy us time to get off oil entirely.

    We really outta to be pouring billions of dollars into nuclear, both fission and fusion and upgrading our power system to carry electricity. We're in the last chapter of fossil fuels. It's just that some people don't see it.

    What always amuses me is that the people calling for expansion of oil under the presumption it will lower prices in the US are often always those who want government out without realizing the only way to get lower prices in the US is to nationalize.
    Last edited by obvious Child; 03-13-10 at 09:29 PM.
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    ....The problem with people like Boomyal is that they are exceedingly unaware of how oil actually works.
    Not so. The reverse, in fact, is true.

    Oil prices are based on speculation as well as demand. The thinner the margin between demand and production, the higher speculators bid up the price. Potential US production, thrown on the world market, would broaden that margin causing oil prices to stabilize at affordable levels.

    Undoubtedly, alternatives will someday become necessary but I say that the solution, like the energy sources to present, are not going to be squeezed out of massive, wasteful, inefficient government beauracracies.

    The fact of the matter is that you have lost site of the premise of this topic. And that is the fact the the leftists would take any opportunity to milk this economy, via engergy, for the furtherance of their own social agendas.

    As I said before, IMHO, Obama, et al, are not just a misguided, naive, inexperienced politicians. He hates this country, he hates capitalism and he would go as far to bring it down as the deluded citizenry will allow him. Social justice is just another term for mediocrity which would allow the Statist/socialists to step in with unfettered power.
    Last edited by Boomyal; 03-13-10 at 10:50 PM.

  8. #38
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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post
    Not so. The reverse, in fact, is true.
    Your next line betrays that argument.

    Oil prices are based on speculation as well as demand. The thinner the margin between demand and production, the higher speculators bid up the price. Potential US production thrown on the world market would broaden that margin causing oil prices to stabilize at an affordable level.
    Except that potential US production lacks the absolute quantities necessary to produce such an impact. Again, the Walmart super store vs mom and pop grocery analogy. Now, if we had another Saudi Arabia suddenly come online, that would likely result in absolute drastic changes to total quantity and thus would change the factors within the exchanges. The US does not have such a capacity nor the ability to ramp up to produce such capacity. You are explicitly arguing that small price setters can materially change the global price.

    Hence my earlier statement about your lack of awareness holds true.

    The fact of the matter is that you have lost site of the premise of this topic. And that is the fact the the leftists would take any opportunity to milk this economy, via engergy, for the furtherance of their own social agendas.
    How's the tin foil had coming along? Have you found financing to build your anti-liberal tin foil hat?

    He hates this country, he hates capitalism and he would go as far to bring it down as far as the deluded citizenry will allow him.
    Does someone who hates capitalism make a backroom promises not to renegotiate NAFTA?
    Does someone who hates capitalism send billions to private industry to prop them up?

    Take off your tin foil hat. It's bad for brain cells.

    And look, another person ignorant of what socialism actually is.

    You want cheaper gas? Nationalize.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    ..... Now, if we had another Saudi Arabia suddenly come online, that would likely result in absolute drastic changes to total quantity and thus would change the factors within the exchanges.....
    And if you had your way, we would never have the opportunity to know if this was the case. Let the Libs (of which you are no doubt one) drive the price of energy, thru taxes, to unaffordable heights and it will kill the economy and the energy sector that has the ability to prove your scepticism naive.

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    Re: $7 gallon gas to meet Obama's targets for emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boomyal View Post

    The leftist liberal, whackos want us to tear down the dams, have tried to kill the coal industry, have killed nuclear electric generation, have all but put oil bearing shale lands off limits, have prohibited offshore oil exploration and are trying to kill an economy that could hopefully come up with a new solution.
    Hhmm..what have we here boom.

    <President Obama to Announce Over $8B in Loan Guarantees for Nuclear>

    <President Obama today will announce $8.3 billion in federal loan guarantees to build the first nuclear plants in the U.S. in almost three decades. Southern Company will reportedly use the loan guarantees to build two nuclear plants in Burke County, Ga.>

    President Obama to Announce Over $8B in Loan Guarantees for Nuclear
    A reliable way to make people believe in falsehoods is frequent repetition, because familiarity is not easily distinguishable from the truth. -- Daniel Kahneman,

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