• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Cover Crops, a Farming Revolution With Deep Roots in the Past

Threegoofs said:
I scrolled back but don't see any refs posted about shortages.
Click to expand...

I could've sworn I posted it, but scrolling back I see I didn't

Demand growing for non-GMO corn seed | The Organic & Non-GMO Report
Tim Schneider, a sales representative for Tom Eischen Sales (515-320-3431) in Algona, Iowa, said he is selling 20 times as much conventional, non-GMO corn seed as GM this year. “Demand has been steadily going up,” he says.

“Demand has never been higher. We are growing faster than what we can handle,” says Will Trudell, vice president of De Dell Seeds (Non GMO Corn Seeds | De Dell Seeds).

Though based in Ontario, Trudell says he is getting many calls from US farmers wanting non-GMO corn seed.
Click to expand...

One reason for the increased interest in non-GMO corn seed is higher yields. “Yields of non-GMO are comparable if not better (than GM),” Eischen says.”

“The market is growing, and farmers are beginning to realize they can get the same yield levels as they would with GM corn in many situations and increase their profitability,” says Ben Benson, President, B&M Seed (Big Cob Hybrids ? That's Yield, That's Big Cob).
Click to expand...

The non-GMO corn seed market faces several challenges, including shortages, lack of investment by major seed companies, and the threat of GMO contamination.

Inadequate supply of seed was cited by several suppliers. “The major see companies are mainly selling GM seed with traits and only selling non-GMO as an afterthought,” Hostetler says.

“The supply is not adequate,” says Howard Vlieger, president of Verity Farms (Verity Corp - Putting life back into the soil).
Click to expand...

Glad you recognize that the GM vs GE distinction is pretty stupid. I'll use GE instead of of GMO if it makes you happy, though, even though it just serves to make nomenclature confusing.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's a stupid distinction. Non-GE techniques of genetic manipulation have a proven track record that goes back thousands of years to the very beginning of civilization. GE techniques have a 20 to 30 year record of over-promising and under-delivering.


Still mystified at why you think there are shortages yet the cost of non GE seed is half that of GE seed. And even more mystified why farmers would plant very pricey seed that does absolutely no good. Doesn't make any sense.
Click to expand...

See the article I link to above. Here's another
https://www.organicconsumers.org/news/demands-non-gmo-corn-remains-steady-organic-increasing

Here's an article about a shortage of seeds for non-GE sugar beets
http://www.rodalesorganiclife.com/food/gmo-sugar

One of the main reasons for the shortage is because the companies that sell the seeds (mainly Monsanto and other large businesses) make more money selling GE seeds so they stopped selling non-GE seeds. Smaller suppliers can't produce enough to meet the demand that already exists, nevermind producing enough to supply the majority of farmers
 
sangha said:
I could've sworn I posted it, but scrolling back I see I didn't

Demand growing for non-GMO corn seed | The Organic & Non-GMO Report








I don't think it's a stupid distinction. Non-GE techniques of genetic manipulation have a proven track record that goes back thousands of years to the very beginning of civilization. GE techniques have a 20 to 30 year record of over-promising and under-delivering.




See the article I link to above. Here's another
https://www.organicconsumers.org/news/demands-non-gmo-corn-remains-steady-organic-increasing

Here's an article about a shortage of seeds for non-GE sugar beets
USDA: Farmers Need to Feed Americans More Sugar

One of the main reasons for the shortage is because the companies that sell the seeds (mainly Monsanto and other large businesses) make more money selling GE seeds so they stopped selling non-GE seeds. Smaller suppliers can't produce enough to meet the demand that already exists, nevermind producing enough to supply the majority of farmers
Click to expand...

So what you're telling me is that non GE seeds are in high demand with widespread shortages, yet still are half the price of non GE seeds.

That's nonsensical.

Kinda like the GMO-GE distinction. Heck- with that distinction, you and me are GMOs!
 
Threegoofs said:
So what you're telling me is that non GE seeds are in high demand with widespread shortages, yet still are half the price of non GE seeds.

That's nonsensical.

Kinda like the GMO-GE distinction. Heck- with that distinction, you and me are GMOs!
Click to expand...

:doh

Why is this so hard for you to understand? When demand increases faster than the supply does, there will be a shortage. It doesn't mean there's a "high demand" or that "everyone wants it", etc. Nor does it mean that the item with a shortage will be more expensive than its' alternative for which there is no shortage.

All it takes is for demand to increase faster than supply
 
sangha said:
:doh

Why is this so hard for you to understand? When demand increases faster than the supply does, there will be a shortage. It doesn't mean there's a "high demand" or that "everyone wants it", etc. Nor does it mean that the item with a shortage will be more expensive than its' alternative for which there is no shortage.

All it takes is for demand to increase faster than supply
Click to expand...

Which usually is easily resolved with higher prices for the good in scarcity.

Unless that good is demonstrably less desirable.
 
Threegoofs said:
Which usually is easily resolved with higher prices for the good in scarcity.
Click to expand...

"Usually" <> "always"

What you dont seem to understand about the agricultural sector (aside from "Just about everything") is that Monsanto has an effective monopoly on seeds. Free market slogans do not work for a monopoly
 
sangha said:
"Usually" "always"

What you dont seem to understand about the agricultural sector (aside from "Just about everything") is that Monsanto has an effective monopoly on seeds. Free market slogans do not work for a monopoly
Click to expand...

Yet somehow this monopoly allows other non GE seeds to be sold, yet magically sells them for less despite 'shortages'.

It's not free market slogans, it's basic, fundamental economics. What idiot pays twice as much for seed that is inferior or equal?

What idiot SELLS noninferior seed at half the price despite so much demand that there are shortages?

It makes no sense.
 
Threegoofs said:
Yet somehow this monopoly allows other non GE seeds to be sold, yet magically sells them for less despite 'shortages'.
Click to expand...

There's no magic about it

It's not free market slogans, it's basic, fundamental economics. What idiot pays twice as much for seed that is inferior or equal?
Click to expand...

No, it's free market myths which don't apply to a monopoly
 
sangha said:
There's no magic about it



No, it's free market myths which don't apply to a monopoly
Click to expand...

Yet there's no monopoly, farmers can even supply their own seed if they wish.

And I didn't realize the supply/demand/price relationship is a 'myth'.

This is completely nonsensical- surely you can see that, right?
 
Threegoofs said:
Yet there's no monopoly, farmers can even supply their own seed if they wish.
Click to expand...

In some cases, they can't

And I didn't realize the supply/demand/price relationship is a 'myth'.
Click to expand...

It's myth that free market rules can be applied to monopolies

This is completely nonsensical- surely you can see that, right?
Click to expand...

It makes no sense to you, just as computers make no sense to insects
 
sangha said:
In some cases, they can't



It's myth that free market rules can be applied to monopolies



It makes no sense to you, just as computers make no sense to insects
Click to expand...

I guess you've just given up on providing a rational explanation, huh?

I'm quite curious to know if there could be any, given your rationale flies in the face of logic. Scarcities of goods that can be grown by farmers is almost a definition of an industry that cannot be monopolized.


Oh well. I thought you were better than this.
 
Threegoofs said:
I guess you've just given up on providing a rational explanation, huh?
Click to expand...

I've given up repeating the explanation. In your own words, you've admitted that you can't understand it.

I'm quite curious to know if there could be any, given your rationale flies in the face of logic. Scarcities of goods that can be grown by farmers is almost a definition of an industry that cannot be monopolized.
Click to expand...

Farmers can't grow food without seeds.


Oh well. I thought you were better than this.
Click to expand...

I thought you could and would read the links I've posted which document the truth of my claims.
 
sangha said:
I've given up repeating the explanation. In your own words, you've admitted that you can't understand it.



Farmers can't grow food without seeds.




I thought you could and would read the links I've posted which document the truth of my claims.
Click to expand...

I looked at them.

It still makes little sense.

I especially liked the one about the guy who now sells more non-GMO seed than GMO seed because it's cheaper, yet it mentions nothing about shortages- just that he's having trouble keeping up with the demand- assuming he needs to buy seed from outside sources at higher prices- but not as high as GMO....
 
Last edited:
Threegoofs said:
I looked at them.

It still makes little sense.
Click to expand...

Reality can be confusing.

But the articles document shortages. No matter what argument you come up with for why it's impossible for such shortages to exist, the shortages do exist in reality.
 
Fearandloathing said:
I am having a hard time seeing a "revolution" on what my family practiced for decades. It is not rocket science to plant **** so it doesn't erode by wind and water. Duh.

What will happen when they "discover" crop rotation...call it a miracle "breakthrough".

Seriously, I have no idea how anyone can like erosion control with genetically modified foods.

The more I think about it, this is right out of "Idiocracy" where they all suddenly realize that plants need water
Click to expand...

I'm waiting for the great revelation about contour plowing. I read an article in Mother Earth News that I found in my dentists waiting room that said that it could be the next big thing...
 
faithful_servant said:
I'm waiting for the great revelation about contour plowing. I read an article in Mother Earth News that I found in my dentists waiting room that said that it could be the next big thing...
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention that.

Google "swales"
 
faithful_servant said:
I'm waiting for the great revelation about contour plowing. I read an article in Mother Earth News that I found in my dentists waiting room that said that it could be the next big thing...
Click to expand...

Did you last see the dentist in 1978?
 
faithful_servant said:
It was a small joke about the age of the magazines in some waiting rooms..... (I hate it when I have to explain jokes)
Click to expand...

Mine was a small joke clarifying yours but bringing in the issue of dental hygiene (always funny) and punctuating it with a date reference that is clearly absurd in the context of our last dental appointment, yet right on the spot when it comes to MEN likely last story on contour farming. (I hate it when I have to explain jokes!)

Edit: Reflecting on it, a smiley emoji or something similar would have been a useful addition to punctuate the joke and assure it would be understood as such.

I deeply regret the error.
 
Threegoofs said:
Mine was a small joke clarifying yours but bringing in the issue of dental hygiene (always funny) and punctuating it with a date reference that is clearly absurd in the context of our last dental appointment, yet right on the spot when it comes to MEN likely last story on contour farming. (I hate it when I have to explain jokes!)

Edit: Reflecting on it, a smiley emoji or something similar would have been a useful addition to punctuate the joke and assure it would be understood as such.

I deeply regret the error.
Click to expand...

I hate it even more when I had to explain the joke to someone who got it.... :3oops:
 
Positive effects of CO2
[h=1]Study: increased carbon dioxide is greening deserts globally[/h] Enhanced levels of carbon dioxide are likely cause of global dryland greening, study says From the “inconvenient truth” department and INDIANA UNIVERSITY: Enhanced levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide are a likely key driver of global dryland greening, according to a paper published today in the journal Scientific Reports. The positive trend in vegetation greenness has…
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom