Thread: Are electric cars green

Originally Posted by flogger

For a mere fraction of the premiums being payed by people wanting to feel smug about driving around in these pointless statements of moral superiority over the rest of us . Wouldnt it make more sense to clean up energy production and manufacturing processes involved in making lean burn fossil fuel vehicles instead ? Many of these cars already have better mpg than the likes of the Prius.

I don't really care what people spend their resources on. Toyota is in the business of selling a product to customers - they're not an altruistic entity dedicated to solving global warming for the greater good. So, if they wanna make hybrids and people wanna buy em, good for them. I don't care.

As I've already said I don't own a hybrid, I don't want one, and I can't say I advocate anyone else getting one. They're not really a solution to any sort of problem, more like a small step in the right direction.

I'm defending them because the sort of intellectual dishonesty spewed by sawyer and others IS part of the problem.

Originally Posted by Deuce

South Park is not an accurate representation of reality.

Blasphemer. South Park is the best show on television.

Again, electric cars are just shifting from one fossil fuel to another one:

"Despite what most people believe, a high percentage of the world's electricity is produced using dirty fuels like coal. This isn't going to change anytime soon; in fact, the widespread introduction of electric cars will probably increase the world's reliance on coal in order to keep up with the increased demand for electricity."

"Claims that electric cars are 'emissions-free' are simply a lie; they merely transfer the pollution from the road to the power station. Not only will electric cars not reduce emissions, they may actually increase emissions, because burning coal to make electricity to power an electric car creates more pollution than if you simply powered the same vehicle using petrol."

Electric Cars Harm Environment - Report | Voxy.co.nz

Originally Posted by the_recruit

I don't really care what people spend their resources on. Toyota is in the business of selling a product to customers - they're not an altruistic entity dedicated to solving global warming for the greater good. So, if they wanna make hybrids and people wanna buy em, good for them. I don't care.

As I've already said I don't own a hybrid, I don't want one, and I can't say I advocate anyone else getting one. They're not really a solution to any sort of problem, more like a small step in the right direction.

I'm defending them because the sort of intellectual dishonesty spewed by sawyer and others IS part of the problem.

Where exactly was I dishonest?

Originally Posted by clownboy

Yeah, but the study doesn't appear to take into account that the environmental nightmare (production and disposal) that is the battery for the Prius has to be replaced every two years. At a high cost not only to the consumer, but the environment.

Where are you getting this "every two years" claim? A cursory google search indicates the Prius battery (the hybrid ni-mh battery that powers the motor, not the standard 12-volt lead acid battery every car has) lasts for around 100,000 miles or more. Besides ni-mh batteries are conducive to recycling.

Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon

Where exactly was I dishonest?

Intellectual dishonesty =/= dishonesty.

Intellectual honesty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But, to answer your question, in just about every post I've ever seen you make.

Batteries are expensive, so it depends what charges them. Engine break is a reasonable power source and the additional gear is not so much. Coal charging via an expensive battery is not so good. Whether fuel is burned in the car or for a battery charge is rather trivial. Solar panels don't work for cars, not even close.

Hybrids are generally positive, while pure-electric depends on the energy source.

Originally Posted by the_recruit

Intellectual dishonesty =/= dishonesty.

Intellectual honesty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But, to answer your question, in just about every post I've ever seen you make.

So you can't point to any particular post of mine and show where I was dishonest huh. That's what I thought.

Originally Posted by Porchev

Again, electric cars are just shifting from one fossil fuel to another one:

"Despite what most people believe, a high percentage of the world's electricity is produced using dirty fuels like coal. This isn't going to change anytime soon; in fact, the widespread introduction of electric cars will probably increase the world's reliance on coal in order to keep up with the increased demand for electricity."

"Claims that electric cars are 'emissions-free' are simply a lie; they merely transfer the pollution from the road to the power station. Not only will electric cars not reduce emissions, they may actually increase emissions, because burning coal to make electricity to power an electric car creates more pollution than if you simply powered the same vehicle using petrol."

Electric Cars Harm Environment - Report | Voxy.co.nz

Yes, but my initial reaction to the bolded claim is skepticism. Coal power plants are inherently significantly more efficient than gasoline internal combustion engines. It's possible that the ensuing chain of transmission losses in getting the electricity from the power plant to your car's electric motor negates the initial efficiency gain, but it seems unlikely to me. I could very well be wrong as the only way to determine it is to do the math and compare the numbers.

However the point is moot. The advantage of electric cars is that we can produce electricity from any power source we want. It doesn't have to be coal. It should be nuclear. But nuk-yoo-lar spooks the masses.

Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon

So you can't point to any particular post of mine and show where I was dishonest huh. That's what I thought.

Again,

intellectual dishonesty =/= dishonesty.

Intellectual honesty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Comprende? Didn't think so...