Thread: The Cheapest Cars in America to Fill Up

Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock

I don't know how the balance works out. Neither do you. But I think it is very telling that the cost of a battery replacement costs more than a complete replacement of engine and transmission for many conventional cars. It seems entirely plausible to me that with a normal car, you could get by on fairly minimal maintenance, completely replace the engine or transmission when it starts to fail, and still come out ahead on maintenance costs compared to replacing the battery in an electric vehicle. That's certainly not the most cost-efficient way to maintain such a car, of course.

But as you said, you don't know how this balance works out, so we cannot be certain that it will work in favor of the ICE car. We can be certain the miles per dollar cost will be roughly 3 times cheaper in the EV. And we can be certain we'll not be buying gas made from Saudi Arabian oil, and thus certain we're not helping fund terrorism. We'll not be buying gas made from Hugo Chavez's oil either. In fact, we can be certain all of the energy used by an EV will have been made by Americans for Americans and that the EV's demand for electricity helps maintain American jobs. That by far, is the greatest part of owning an EV.

Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock

I say your claims are outlandish and unrealistic, as they ignore a fairly major part of the cost of operating a car, and they ignore the initial cost of the car spread out over its expected usable life.

When espousing the mpg of an ICE car, no one EVER adds in the expected cost of maintenance for the engine. NOT EVER. Why establish a higher standard for EVs by requiring including maintenance costs and ONLY doing this for EVs?

Originally Posted by Andalublue

If you need a pick-up, I can't imagine why anyone would buy a gasoline engine. Diesels give better mileage, better engine life and, most important, vastly better torque than gas engines. Are most new US pick-ups now gas or diesel?

Diesel engines burn cleaner than IC engines as well, and as gas prices have climbed, more and more are now buying diesel trucks.

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who cares about the cost of filling a vehicle when you have a truck this awesome

Originally Posted by Dittohead not!

No one can say you don't walk the walk along with talking the talk. I applaud you, but am not ready to emulate that just yet.

That's just the thing with me though. I don't want to talk any talk, I get tired of people talking, and don't have any need for other people to choose to live the same way I do. If you want to drive a small car a hummer or a damn tractor it's your business.

I do, however, enjoy it when someone starts getting up on a high horse and I get to say something like "So... yeah, I agree we sure burn a lot of gas... so what kind of mileage does your sedan get anyway?"

Originally Posted by Andalublue

If you need a pick-up, I can't imagine why anyone would buy a gasoline engine. Diesels give better mileage, better engine life and, most important, vastly better torque than gas engines. Are most new US pick-ups now gas or diesel?

If I am not mistaken a diesel engine is not available on 1/2 ton pickups in the US. To get a diesel you have to go to a 3/4 ton or greater.
1/2 pickups make up the bulk of the pickup sales in the US. I agree that if you are hauling a heavy load/trailer, a diesel is the way to go. IMO, that is not the case for most 1/2T pickup owners.

Checking Ford's site, for a F250 it is almost $8K more for a diesel engine. So with the price of diesel being higher than gas, and the $8K upfront investment to get the diesel, how would you ever be money ahead? I can certainly purchase a lot of gas for my hemi Ram 1/2 for $8K. Another consideration is the diesel is more expensive to maintian in basic oil changes.

Diesel has its place. In the 1/2 Ton market I think what Ford is doing with the turbo V-6 (ecoboost) is a great way to go for power and mpg.
But, I will stick with my Ram hemi for many years. There is only about 3-4mpg difference between the two vehicles.


I

Auto industry about to go diesel crazy

"Diesels achieve about 30% better fuel economy than similar gasoline models. The latest generation — unfailingly called by automakers "clean diesels" — aren't smoky or noisy as were those of the past. But sales are being held down by diesel fuel prices, which typically top those of gasoline because of higher diesel taxes and greater global demand, and by worries about finding diesel filling stations.

Still, interest is rising. Auto parts maker Bosch said its own survey found 32% of U.S. consumers last year said they're willing to consider a diesel, up from 12% in 2006.

Automakers are answering the call:

"An avalanche of clean diesels coming into the market," should boost diesel vehicle sales, said Lars Ullrich, marketing director for Bosch Diesel Systems North America. "That makes us very optimistic."

"Overall, sales of diesel-powered cars and trucks for consumers rose 27% to 111,000 in 2011, compared with 2010, says Allen Schaeffer, executive director of the Diesel Technology Forum. While he thinks passenger diesel sales will be relatively flat this year — "the calm before the storm" — he forecasts a significant rise in 2013 when the new models arrive. Expect new diesels from:

Porsche. The Cayenne SUV diesel will get a showing in April.

Volkswagen. A diesel version of the Beetle is to be unveiled at the Chicago Auto Show, opening Friday. It'll be on sale in August, VW says. The Beetle TDI (VW-speak for diesel) joins the brand's diesel Golf, Jetta, Passat and Touareg.

Audi. A diesel version of the A8 flagship sedan is coming, and Audi also has confirmed diesels in the next Q5 crossover and A6 sedan.

Chevrolet. The Cruze compact is to offer a diesel option next year. General Motors CEO Dan Akerson disclosed that tidbit in an interview with Drive On last summer.

Jeep. Grand Cherokee adds a diesel version next year, prompting parent Chrysler Group to add 1,100 jobs at the Jefferson North factory in Detroit to build them.

Cadillac. The ATS, the brand's new, small rival to BMW 3 Series, gets a diesel during the car's first generation, GM President of the Americas

Mark Reuss says. ATS, at least the gas version, is coming this summer as a 2013 model. Reuss didn't say just when a diesel would join.

Mazda. A diesel is coming next year as part of its Skyactiv suite of fuel-saving technology. Mazda is being cagey about what vehicle will offer it.

Ram. A small or midsize pickup reviving the Dakota name is to get a diesel, Ullrich says, but he doesn't know just when.

Auto industry about to go diesel crazy

Why is diesel so much higher than gas when it needs alot less processing ? ...anyway babyboomers were totally turned off by diesel years ago when american auto makers made their first attempts at diesel vehicles..it was a disaster...the olds diesel is foremost in memory...because it was so bad I believe auto makers in the states just left it alone..realizing they couldnt get buyers confidence back...so were far behind in diesel.

Originally Posted by lpast

Why is diesel so much higher than gas when it needs alot less processing ? ...anyway babyboomers were totally turned off by diesel years ago when american auto makers made their first attempts at diesel vehicles..it was a disaster...the olds diesel is foremost in memory...because it was so bad I believe auto makers in the states just left it alone..realizing they couldnt get buyers confidence back...so were far behind in diesel.

yes diesel engines in america are still looked down upon in cars.it really doesnt help that alot of them in the 70's were converted gasoline engines never designed to handle the compression or high energy combustion of a diesel engine.

Originally Posted by beerftw

yes diesel engines in america are still looked down upon in cars.it really doesnt help that alot of them in the 70's were converted gasoline engines never designed to handle the compression or high energy combustion of a diesel engine.

Exactly and the oldsmobile was the poster car for it...to make it even worse...GM didnt know how to fix the problems and just pulled them and put new diesels back in and they just broke...it was a nightmare...

Originally Posted by lpast

Exactly and the oldsmobile was the poster car for it...to make it even worse...GM didnt know how to fix the problems and just pulled them and put new diesels back in and they just broke...it was a nightmare...

the army still uses redesigned versions of those engines just fine in humvee.back then they pretty much got a stock 350 raised its compression and threw a fuel injector pump and rails on it,not very ideal.

the 6.2 and 6.5 that gm used as a replacement was the same base block design,with the exception of adding thicker walls and higher grade cast iron to handle the compression better.the heads and all the internals were redesigned as well to be used for a diesel engine,rather than gas engine internals.

looking back at the failure of diesel cars i think it might take atleast a decade before we see them again,that is unless we start using german diesel engines,since they have been using diesel engines in everything,while america doesnt have much small diesel experience.