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Obama Has Cut Taxes for 98.6 Percent of Working Households

obvious Child said:
So H.W. wasn't a Conservative when he raised taxes even though it was necessary to clean up the fiscal mess Reagan left?

So Eisenhower wasn't a Conservative when he raised taxes to build the highway system?

Tell me, is it fiscally conservative to cut taxes in a hyperinflationary period thereby increasing M1?

The problem with some people here is that they are too blind to their ideology that they fail to recognize specific incidents in which their mantra either utterly fails or makes the situation worse.

Is lowering taxes generally good? Yes. It lowering taxes always good? No.
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Where did all of this come from? SD claimed I was for cheap cigarettes because I'm a conservative and I responded with I'm not for cheap cigarettes, but lower taxes. Raising the federal tax on a pack of smokes from 39 cents to just over a buck is what I was hinting at. Next time, don't go so far out on a short limb when you are making such drastic assumptions. No one here wants to see you hurt yourself.
 
P/N said:
Where did all of this come from?
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See post #23.

Next time, don't go so far out on a short limb when you are making such drastic assumptions. No one here wants to see you hurt yourself.
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Perhaps you should review your statements before replying? This is the second time in the same thread you did not do so.

American Conservatives would do what is best for the country. If that means raising taxes, then raise taxes.
 
obvious Child said:
See post #23.
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You mean where I changed "cheap cigarettes" to "lower taxes" in his quote? I thought the topic was about Obama supposedly cutting taxes for the middle class. When I point out that he was cutting here and raising there, SD in all usually feeble attempt, tried to twist it around. When I corrected him, you then jump in the conversation from that short limb you climbed out on.

obvious Child said:
Perhaps you should review your statements before replying? This is the second time in the same thread you did not do so.

American Conservatives would do what is best for the country. If that means raising taxes, then raise taxes.
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Perhaps you should pick yourself off the ground and seek medical help before replying next time. You see, that short limb you climbed out on (see post 19 where you weren't specific at all in regards to my post), it broke (see post 25) and you fell and hit your head. I'll give you a couple of days to get to feeling better before I respond to you again.

Get well soon!

:2wave:
 
P/N said:
You mean where I changed "cheap cigarettes" to "lower taxes" in his quote? I thought the topic was about Obama supposedly cutting taxes for the middle class.
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Except that what you stated is not true. Unless you think increasing M1 during inflation is a good idea....

When I corrected him, you then jump in the conversation from that short limb you climbed out on.
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Short because you don't like me pointing out how your mantra is wrong? Got it.

You see, that short limb you climbed out on (see post 19 where you weren't specific at all in regards to my post)
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See post #24. I noticed you did not respond.

it broke (see post 25) and you fell and hit your head. I'll give you a couple of days to get to feeling better before I respond to you again.

Get well soon!

:2wave:
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Your smack needs work. Bailout levels.

1) Obama is doing what previous presidents have done
2) Your absolutest views are wrong

Class dismissed.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Thats absurd. If your effective tax rates are reduced, then it does not matter if its the result of a reduction in the stated rate, or a credit against it. Either way, you paid less in taxes as percentage of your income then you otherwise would have. The problem with reducing effective rates through tax credits rather than just a cut is that it can in some scenarios lead to an economically inefficient income tax.
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A tax credit is a set amount of dollars--an absolute value independent of income level. It reduces one's tax burden by a set amount.

The tax rate (or, if you prefer, effective tax rate) is a function--dependent upon income level--used to calculate one's tax burden.

Whether one would prefer a tax credit over a cut in the effective tax rate (however that might be legislated) is wholly dependent on what one's income level is. Those in lower income brackets benefit more from tax credits; those in higher income brackets benefit more from rate cuts. In fact, for the 30% of income earners who pay no taxes, a tax credit is free money. For those in higher income brackets, rate cuts save them from paying far more than what the value of the puny tax credit is.

But all this should be obvious: passing a tax credit is very different than passing a tax rate cut. It is different in essence, in who benefits/who doesn't, and
especially in how it shapes the incentive system of the economy.
 
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And can someone tell me how the rich are supposed to possible cover the increased costs of the Obama administration?
 
obvious Child said:
Please review your own statements:



Tell me, what president in the past 40 years has not done something public while screwing us in secret?
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Was Obama not supposed to be the candidate of change? who would get rid of the old partisan politics and take us into the promised land of a new way of government?
 
cmckinney said:
Was Obama not supposed to be the candidate of change? who would get rid of the old partisan politics and take us into the promised land of a new way of government?
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Perhaps, I didn't vote for him. I voted Libertarian. I do find it amusing how Bush backers are hammering Obama despite Obama being for most intensive purposes, a Bush Clone. What a bunch of hypocrites.
 
obvious Child said:
Perhaps, I didn't vote for him. I voted Libertarian. I do find it amusing how Bush backers are hammering Obama despite Obama being for most intensive purposes, a Bush Clone. What a bunch of hypocrites.
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Was that directed at me? If so, I would not consider myself a Bush backer.
 
cmckinney said:
Was that directed at me? If so, I would not consider myself a Bush backer.
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Partially. It was side commentary. A great many people in this world are walking contradictions. Consistency is like gold dust, especially here. I'm just here to point out the raging hypocrisy many people have. Furthermore, I do like pointing out to idiots who try to label me as an Obama backers that I didn't vote for him.
 
obvious Child said:
Perhaps, I didn't vote for him. I voted Libertarian. I do find it amusing how Bush backers are hammering Obama despite Obama being for most intensive purposes, a Bush Clone. What a bunch of hypocrites.
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More one sidedness from you... :lol:


Bobb Barr was no libertarian.... ironic you voted for him, no? :lol:
 
obvious Child said:
Better for a third party then for the single party system. It's a pity you got nothing to do but stalk my posts. What a sad life.
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No actually he wasn't, voting for Barr sent a message to them that you support them acting like the other two parties.


And please, there is no need to lie and accuse me of stalking your posts, this baiting is not neccesarry on your part. I responded to you here, and responded to you in a thread I started. FAIL
 
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Reverend_Hellh0und said:
No actually he wasn't, voting for Barr sent a message to them that you support them acting like the other two parties.
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Uh....and how exactly are you going to support such a claim?

And please, there is no need to lie and accuse me of stalking your posts, this baiting is not neccesarry on your part. I responded to you here, and responded to you in a thread I started. FAIL
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Sure you aren't. You just avoided my posts for weeks and now you are going after my posts in at least three different threads. :2wave: I believe you. lol.
 
obvious Child said:
Uh....and how exactly are you going to support such a claim?
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Lets see, I have been a registered Libertarian since before the 1st Gulf war....

If I prove it to you, you donate $50 to the forum?



Sure you aren't. You just avoided my posts for weeks and now you are going after my posts in at least three different threads. :2wave: I believe you. lol.
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Three? Wow, a whole 3? Please, don't flatter yourself, its two upstairs, One which *I* strarted. This is a debate forum. I will respond to any and all posts as I see fit, sorry that bothers you. :2wave:
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
Lets see, I have been a registered Libertarian since before the 1st Gulf war....

If I prove it to you, you donate $50 to the forum?
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And that proves what? How does your registration as a Libertarian prove that my vote for the 3rd parties in the 2008 election says I support them acting like the other two parties?

How? There's not even a tentative connection there.

Three? Wow, a whole 3? Please, don't flatter yourself, its two upstairs, One which *I* strarted. This is a debate forum. I will respond to any and all posts as I see fit, sorry that bothers you. :2wave:
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Except that every reply have been veiled person attacks on me, not my argument.
 
obvious Child said:
And that proves what? How does your registration as a Libertarian prove that my vote for the 3rd parties in the 2008 election says I support them acting like the other two parties?

How? There's not even a tentative connection there.
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Ahh my bad, I am watching my son tonight, let me rephrase.

Bobb Barr barged his way in from one of the "conservatives" you hate, a republican who was losing stature, to snag the libertarian nomination from actual Libertarians.....

I guess you missed that.



Except that every reply have been veiled person attacks on me, not my argument.
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*LIE*


please cut this out.
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
Bobb Barr barged his way in from one of the "conservatives" you hate, a republican who was losing stature, to snag the libertarian nomination from actual Libertarians.

I guess you missed that.
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Aside from the fact that you still haven't explained your argument. Just because you abandon the fake 2 party system doesn't mean that we support you acting like them. Hell the only reason I vote 3rd party is to at least provide some start for a real 3rd party.

*LIE*

please cut this out.
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Interesting coming from the one who lied about my initial postings on this thread.

All you did was attack me. Not what I said. In fact by your own admission, you didn't even read everything I wrote. How am I wrong when you admitted you didn't read what I wrote? How could you have responded to my argument with a reply on my argument when you didn't even read what I had written?

And when you say I'm lying, that's translation I'm as usual, right on the money.

You're like a guy I know who calls everyone an atheist because they disagree with him.
 
obvious Child said:
Aside from the fact that you still haven't explained your argument. Just because you abandon the fake 2 party system doesn't mean that we support you acting like them. Hell the only reason I vote 3rd party is to at least provide some start for a real 3rd party.
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You keep lying. Post my "Acting like them".....




Interesting coming from the one who lied about my initial postings on this thread.
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Quote and link.


All you did was attack me. Not what I said. In fact by your own admission, you didn't even read everything I wrote. How am I wrong when you admitted you didn't read what I wrote? How could you have responded to my argument with a reply on my argument when you didn't even read what I had written?

And when you say I'm lying, that's translation I'm as usual, right on the money.

You're like a guy I know who calls everyone an atheist because they disagree with him.
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YOu lie, I have asked you to show me the positions you lie about me having, instead its the typical OC tantrum to avoid intellectual discourse. it is rather pathetic, no offense... :lol:
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
You keep lying. Post my "Acting like them"
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And how did the Libertarian party do that? Furthermore, how was voting for them because they are a third party sending that message?

You made a big claim and then utterly failed to back it up. In fact your first argument didn't even make sense. Your second assumes things you have not proven.

Quote and link.
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My Bad. You lied about my position in the deficit thread.

Citing things from the basement is against the rules. You know that. You know for a fact that you should not request people to cite things against the basement rule.
 
obvious Child said:
And how did the Libertarian party do that? Furthermore, how was voting for them because they are a third party sending that message?

You made a big claim and then utterly failed to back it up. In fact your first argument didn't even make sense. Your second assumes things you have not proven.



My Bad. You lied about my position in the deficit thread.

Citing things from the basement is against the rules. You know that. You know for a fact that you should not request people to cite things against the basement rule.
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Not talking about the basement. only you are.

YOu accused me of lying, upstairs. You failed.


Post my:

OC said:
Just because you abandon the fake 2 party system doesn't mean that we support you acting like them
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Show my posts where I am "acting" likethe 2 partiy system.
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
Not talking about the basement. only you are.

YOu accused me of lying, upstairs. You failed.
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Huh. I mentioned three posts. There are two upstairs. Do we need to count again?

http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaking-news/55014-w-h-hikes-deficit-estimate-2-trillion.html

Huh. Imagine that. You accuse me of not addressing the subject despite quoting me doing just that. But then again, you did admit you didn't read the post which I suppose doesn't make you a liar. Just a bad debater.

Show my posts where I am "acting" likethe 2 partiy system.
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I did say that? You argued that my vote for 3rd party sends the message that I support them acting like the two parties in office. Except it doesn't. And merely because the person who is the candidate jumped ship doesn't equate to them being the same party.

You have yet to even remotely back up your claims about the Libertarian vote in 2008.
 
Where to start...

So he extended the Bush AMT patch. He gave us the "make work pay" credit which cuts taxes mostly for people who don't pay taxes. He is taking our money and giving it back to us in manipulative credits. Buy a home, buy a new car (because you know the poor can afford that), and Obama will give you your money back and call it a tax cut.

By the logic in this article, if Obama took 100% of your money, and then used it to buy your house, car, clothes, food and entertainment to the point where he was borrowing money from China to pay government employees to process it all, the author of this article would call it a 110% tax cut. Disingenuous, and basically worthless. Sorry.

You know what would be impressive, if Obama extended Bush's 2003 tax cuts next year. Then he could claim to have given 100% of working families a tax break.
 
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