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Fed Moves Closer to Rate Hike

Now this is not so good news.

US ISM manufacturing at 48.6 in Nov vs 50.5 expected

'The U.S. manufacturing sector contracted in November, falling to its worst levels since June 2009, when the economy was still in the midst of a recession, according to an industry report released on Tuesday.

The Institute for Supply Management (ISM) said its index of national factory activity fell to 48.6, the first time the index has been below 50 since November 2012, after reading 50.1 in October. The reading was for expectations of 50.5, according to a Reuters poll of 77 economists.

A reading below 50 indicates contraction in the manufacturing sector; the ISM data is often viewed as a precursor to movement in the overall economy, though its contribution to U.S. economic activity has been in decline for decades. The ISM index fell below 50 in 2012 briefly, but the economy did not go into recession.'


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/12/01/us-ism-manufacturing-nov-2015.html
 
Well, the labor report was pretty good...especially the 25-54 age range.

So, my prediction is that the Fed will raise rates in December.
 
My prediction for 12/16: Hike (25 basis points)

1. Labor market conditions have been fulfilled (strong job creation continues, slack has diminished, the unemployment rate is moving toward a figure consistent with full employment which is hinted at in the recent pickup in wages)

2. The recent pickup in wage increases (most recent: 2.3% year-on-year basis), stability of trimmed PCE measures, stability of core PCE measures (excluding imports), and stability of inflation expectations, provides reasonable confidence that U.S. inflation will gradually rise toward the Fed's 2% target in the medium-term

3. The fundamentals underlying the ongoing moderate expansion remain reasonably sound meaning one can expect a continuation next year. Wage gains should help bolster consumer spending (nearly 69% of GDP). The services sector (65% of the economy; 84% of private employment) remains dynamic and highly competitive e.g., service-related exports continue to grow despite the stronger U.S. dollar. Recent weakness in manufacturing may be the proverbial blessing in disguise, as it reduces prospects of inventory overhang that has often triggered business cycle corrections. Some pickup in Europe and some Emerging Market economies should occur later next year (strengthening U.S. exports). Given this context, my guess is that real GDP growth of 2.5% seems quite reasonable for next year. The Fed's most recent prediction was 2.3%; the Conference Board: 2.4%; and, the IMF: 2.8%. Aside from Citibank, which believes the start of a recession is very likely (65% probability by its estimate), general thought is that the ongoing moderate expansion will continue.

In some, current conditions and expectations all favor a December rate hike. If all goes reasonably well next year, another 1-2 rate hikes may occur.
 
My prediction for 12/16: Hike (25 basis points)

1. Labor market conditions have been fulfilled (strong job creation continues, slack has diminished, the unemployment rate is moving toward a figure consistent with full employment which is hinted at in the recent pickup in wages)

2. The recent pickup in wage increases (most recent: 2.3% year-on-year basis), stability of trimmed PCE measures, stability of core PCE measures (excluding imports), and stability of inflation expectations, provides reasonable confidence that U.S. inflation will gradually rise toward the Fed's 2% target in the medium-term

...

In some, current conditions and expectations all favor a December rate hike. If all goes reasonably well next year, another 1-2 rate hikes may occur.

<I had to cut some of your post to make this post fit>

With respect, the Fed clearly has no idea what they are talking about when it comes to inflation (imo).

The reason there is no inflation - despite the government and the Fed dumping over $12 trillion dollars in deficits/QE AND ZIRP into the economy over the last 7 years - is primarily (imo) because of this:

fredgraph.png


https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/M2V

THE LOWEST M2 MONEY VELOCITY ON RECORD...and it is STILL falling. It is almost impossible to have inflation with a plunging money velocity...especially a record low ratio.

Few are spending - I assume because few but the rich has anything to spend except credit and b) most people do not have confidence in the economy.

And how is raising rates going to change that? I cannot believe people are sitting around going...'gee, I would buy that house, but I am waiting for interest rates to go a little higher so that it costs me more'. How on Earth can the Fed actually believe that people will buy more if things cost more and credit is harder to get? That makes no sense.
Even former Fed Chairman Bullard sees huge flaws in what the Fed has said in the recent past:

'"If oil prices stabilize at the current level and the dollar stabilizes and we still get no change in inflation, that will have disproved our story," he said.

Bullard's remarks came after a speech in which he discussed in detail the Fed's poor track record for forecasting central economic variables like growth, inflation and the unemployment rate.

That "hat trick" of mistakes has pulled the central bank in conflicting directions, with a too-optimistic outlook for growth and a rebound of inflation to the Fed's target, and a too pessimistic view of how fast unemployment would decline.

In setting policy, the misses on gross domestic product and inflation appeared to be given more weight, leading policymakers to keep rates near zero even as the economy neared full employment.

"The negative surprises with respect to real GDP growth and inflation carried more weight during this period than the positive surprises on labor market performance," he said.'


Fed's Bullard says post-liftoff attention to shift to inflation | Reuters


And thanks to these Fed policies (with the government's/Congress's help), the middle class is still a fraction of what it was before the Great Recession as the employment to population ratio of 25-54's has pretty much flattened out after a VERY tepid recovery even though it is nowhere near what it was in early 2007.

latest_numbers_LNS12300060_2005_2015_all_period_M11_data.gif

Bureau of Labor Statistics Data


And home ownership rates continue to fall overall and are now at 20+ year lows

united-states-home-ownership-rate.png


United States Home Ownership Rate | 1965-2015 | Data | Chart | Calendar


And the Fed seems COMPLETELY oblivious to the fact that food stamp usage is STILL roughly 60% higher now then before the Great Recession.

Food-Stamps-Monthly.jpg


Food Stamps Charts


How is ANY of this going to be helped by raising interest rates? How can trying to make things more expensive stimulate an economy...it makes almost no sense.


The Fed - as Bullard himself said - has made mistake after mistake.

I say they have virtually no idea what they are doing - that they are bean counters, not economists. These people are mostly career bankers. If you know bankers, then you know they are usually lousy economists but great at counting chips.
 
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With respect, the Fed clearly has no idea what they are talking about when it comes to inflation (imo).

The reason there is no inflation - despite the government and the Fed dumping over $12 trillion dollars in deficits/QE AND ZIRP into the economy over the last 7 years - is primarily (imo) because of this:

fredgraph.png

The Fed is keenly aware that the money multiplier has fallen to abnormally low levels. Reasons are complex and not fully understood. That low multiplier is part of the reason the Fed correctly understood that QE would not create a hyperinflationary outbreak and/or collapse of the dollar as envisioned by Peter Schiff, among some others.

Few are spending - I assume because few but the rich has anything to spend except credit and b) most people do not have confidence in the economy.

Consumer confidence has been running above the baseline normal for some time: https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/CSCICP03USM665S
Real personal consumption expenditures have also increased at an annualized rate of 3% or higher in 6 of the last 8 quarters: http://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/national/gdp/2015/pdf/gdp3q15_2nd.pdf

And home ownership rates continue to fall overall and are now at 20+ year lows

The home ownership rate from the late 1990s into the early 2010s was elevated, in large part, on account of the massive real estate bubble that developed. The rate is descending back toward more typical norms. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

And the Fed seems COMPLETELY oblivious to the fact that food stamp usage is STILL roughly 60% higher now then before the Great Recession.

This is a complex issue. Some share of unemployment became structural (note the U-6 rate is still well above where it was prior to the recession, even as the U-3 unemployment rate is beginning to approach the minimum figure prior to the recession. Benefit eligibility may also have changed. There are also income inequality issues at play.

I do believe policy makers need to take a closer look at this issue to understand it if they are to devise effective policy remedies.
 
The Fed is keenly aware that the money multiplier has fallen to abnormally low levels. Reasons are complex and not fully understood. That low multiplier is part of the reason the Fed correctly understood that QE would not create a hyperinflationary outbreak and/or collapse of the dollar as envisioned by Peter Schiff, among some others.
The Fed are usually the LAST to know. Remember the 2007 crash?

Federal Reserve was blind to crisis brewing in early 2007 - Jan. 18, 2013

They COMPLETELY missed a huge correction even though it was RIDICULOUSLY obvious that it was coming.

The Fed said from the very beginning that each QE would be the last...they were wrong every time.

And the reasons for the M2 falling is, with respect, not complex to me in the slightest...despite the government figures, people are NOT spending - they are just creating debt (in essence). Money is not changing hands that often. All people are doing is taking out huge amounts of debt with incredibly low interest rates.
When you create debt to buy a toaster (putting it on a credit card/line of credit), the money velocity is minimal as the money is 'created' at the point of purchase and that is where it stops (for now). But when you buy a toaster with money you earned, then you took money that you made and then spent it on a toaster. 'New' money is not created, just existing money and it is used again. That causes the money velocity to rise. Add in the fact that the banks are making solid returns on a virtual 'carry trade' with the Fed/others - they have no reason to lend out money at greater risk. Add in the fact that the home ownership rate is falling fast, even less money being circulated.

Look at employment since November 2007 (the month before the Great Recession began):

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/empsit_03072008.pdf Table A-6

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf Table A-9

By far the most important demographic is the 25-54 age range. They have by far the most dependants and buy by far the most big ticket items. They also make up roughly 60% of the workforce. They are the key to a healthy economy.
I already showed above how the employment to population ratio of that group has never remotely recovered since the Great Recession. But let's look at some raw numbers.
There are over 3 1/2 MILLION less 25-54's employed since then. In fact, in EVERY major age grouping, there are less people employed now then before the Great Recession (25-54, 16-19 and 20-24). ALL of those jobs (in essence) have gone to one group - the over 55's. Over 7 million newly employed 55+'s; and as the employment to population ratio proves, the cause is by no means just an ageing population. The middle class is stagnating and and youth are finding less work. And the elderly are having to delay retirement because the nest egg they thought they had is not enough to pay the bills now - largely thanks to the record low interests rates which so many seniors were counting on for a return on their savings.

Please do not tell me this was the Fed's intention when they started all this ZIRP/QE madness way back when? I guarantee you it was not.

They just - as usual - horribly miscalculated.

Consumer confidence has been running above the baseline normal for some time: https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/CSCICP03USM665S
Real personal consumption expenditures have also increased at an annualized rate of 3% or higher in 6 of the last 8 quarters: http://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/national/gdp/2015/pdf/gdp3q15_2nd.pdf
I cannot comment on those surveys until I see the actual questions. As you are probably aware, surveys can be skewed to force a certain outcome by changing the wording and sequence of the questions. And as for spending, it CANNOT be substantial if the M2 Money Velocity is at an ALL TIME LOW. People are generally not spending (except the rich) - they are charging.

The home ownership rate from the late 1990s into the early 2010s was elevated, in large part, on account of the massive real estate bubble that developed. The rate is descending back toward more typical norms. That's not necessarily a bad thing.
If you look at the chart I provided above, you will see that the home ownership rate has fallen below what it was in the 'late nineties'. It has fallen to where it was in the mid 80's. And considering the M2 money velocity is still falling fast (overall) there is little reason to suspect this trend will subside. Imo, this is not a good thing. Especially considering most Americans make the vast majority of their capital gains from their principle residences.
People are talking about wealth inequality. Well, that is a big (though not the only) reason.


Continued...
 
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This is a complex issue. Some share of unemployment became structural (note the U-6 rate is still well above where it was prior to the recession, even as the U-3 unemployment rate is beginning to approach the minimum figure prior to the recession. Benefit eligibility may also have changed. There are also income inequality issues at play.

I do believe policy makers need to take a closer look at this issue to understand it if they are to devise effective policy remedies.

With all due respect (and I do have some respect for you on this subject), I believe it is not complex.
The Fed has killed savings rates...that has hurt the elderly hugely as their savings are making them little now. Also, since ALL major age groups (except the over 55's) are less employed now then before the Great Recession, then naturally, there will be far more people in poverty now. Plus, those over 55 jobs are sometimes not the best paying....especially if they are over 65 aged jobs.
Imo, the refusal of food stamp usage to drop to anywhere near where it was before the Great Recession is proof positive that the number of poor in America grew massively after 2007 and refuses to decline.

So, this is what the Fed/government/Congress has done for America since the Great Recession...home ownership is falling, money is not changing hands, the elderly are forced to go back to work, all major age categories of workers (besides the over 55's) are lower in number.

HOWEVER, the stock market has boomed since the end of the Great Recession. And who has that helped? Well, since few Americans own stock, basically only the rich (which largely explains why the wealth/income gap is growing).


I say that the Fed does not know what they are doing and has done FAR more harm then good since the end of the Great Recession...EXCEPT for the rich who are LOVING what the Fed is doing.
 
Sold my bond mutual fund yesterday and probably will buy a CD. Rates go up bonds go down and this may be a substantial raise. I don't need to be in any of the market anyway at my age. This rise cold trigger a massive sell off in bonds. If you own bonds you better take a good look at hat they ae holding.
 
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It is my opinion that they will not do so until after the 2016 elections.
 
It is my opinion that they will not do so until after the 2016 elections.

A 25 basis point increase is already baked into the market. See the 52 week note yield change since Dec 1st for reference. It is the highest since Dec 2008.
 
Sold my bond mutual fund yesterday and probably will buy a CD. Rates go up bonds go down and this may be a substantial raise. I don't need to be in any of the market anyway at my age. This rise cold trigger a massive sell off in bonds. If you own bonds you better take a good look at hat they ae holding.

All the Fed are talking about is a raise to 0.25% (it's about 0.13% now apparently)...a very small raise.

Plus, they keep talking about 'one and done'.

Just sayin....
 
The DOW lost 500 points this week. If this keeps up, I wonder if it will scare the Fed out if raising rates?
 
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Well, the labor report was pretty good...especially the 25-54 age range...

First time I've ever seen you post something like that.
 
Well, if the DOW opens at it's present after hours trading level, it will have lost over 1,250 points since the Fed's post rate hike high.

I said above 'I say that the Fed does not know what they are doing and has done FAR more harm then good since the end of the Great Recession...EXCEPT for the rich who are LOVING what the Fed is doing.'

And I stand behind that.

An idiot should have seen that this was not the time to raise rates, that the conditions in both Ametica and the world were not good. American manufacturing continues to contract, spending is still declining, China is dropping fast right now, the EU is propped up and Japan is still a mess.

But no...the Fed is once again (like in 2007) seemingly virtually clueless as to what goes on outside of their building.
 
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...

An idiot should have seen that this was not the time to raise rates, ...

I agree that we shouldn't have raised rates, yet hords of people, many of them very conservative, were demanding a rate increase, blaming the slow growth on the i-rates being to low. The fed is wrong no matter what they do.
 
I agree that we shouldn't have raised rates, yet hords of people, many of them very conservative, were demanding a rate increase, blaming the slow growth on the i-rates being to low. The fed is wrong no matter what they do.

He's just ass-chapped because the gold trade has no traction without easy money.
 
I agree that we shouldn't have raised rates, yet hords of people, many of them very conservative, were demanding a rate increase, blaming the slow growth on the i-rates being to low. The fed is wrong no matter what they do.

Yes, but the Fed is stocked with doves/liberals. And Yellen was nominated by Obama. So I assume their decision was based on what they thought was best...not what Reps/Austrian Schoolers wanted.

I personally never thought rates should have been dropped so low and for so long. But now that they are where they are, people have to realize that so long as the economy is on precarious footing, that raising rates even a bit is going to have a potentially, very negative impact on the American economy.

Keynesians/Krugmanites cannot have it both ways. They cannot have ultra low interest rates and then be blissfully unaware of the consequences of raising those rates before the economy is sound. And it has been over 8 years and when they finally contemplate a pathetically small 0.25% rate hike, it takes them over a year of umming and hmming before they pull the trigger. Would they be doing all this hesitation were the economy strong? Of course not.

The record low (and still falling overall) M2 Money Veloctiy ratio (which mostly, imo, explains why inflation is so low), the refusal of food stamp usage to drop to anywhere near pre-Great Recession levels and the fact that all major age groups (except for over 55's) are less employed now then before the Great Recession. All these things point to economic stagnation.

I/anyone can see these things...why can the Fed not? Now was a stupid time to raise rates if staying out of a recession/keeping America strong right now is the Fed's main goal.


For the record (once again)...I have said for years that I do not think the economy will ever be sound for any substantial period of time so long as the government is running massive deficits AND the Fed is running some form of QE (which it still is) along with very low rates.

I think raising rates is a good move...but not for the reasons the Fed thinks.

I believe a huge correction is inevitable. Eventually the Fed will run out of ways to manipulate the economy - and when they do...look out. So the quicker that time arrives, the less painful it will be. But as Japan has shown, that could take decades. Meanwhile, America will go the way of the Japanese economy...slowly wilting on the vine under a mountain of ever growing debt.
 
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Probably.

Deficit Owl...that is a new one for me.

It's more or less a MMT thing. They came up with Owl because owls are thought to be wise. I think they are cool because they can turn their head nearly 360 degrees though.
 
Bloodbath.

DOW closes at 16,514.10, down 392.41 points.

'The Standard & Poor’s 500 Index capped its worst-ever four-day start to a year as turmoil in China spread around the world and billionaire George Soros warned that a larger crisis may be brewing.'

S&P 500 Caps Worst-Ever Start to Year on China Woes, Oil Slump - Bloomberg Business


The DOW has now lost over 1235 points since the post-Fed rate hike high.

Oh yeah, the Fed REALLY know what they are doing.

:roll:
 
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