The government debt is not a debt.[W:484]

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

Who issued the CDs? If it was GE, the capital position of the bank has changed, as money that was with the bank to use is now with GE. But even if the CDs are bank paper, the maturity is probably different, which also impacts the capital position.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

That is not true. The govenment does not pay interest on dollar bills and does not have to redeem them. It does have to do so, when the note matures.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

:lamo

Fed Chair:

Fed Chair: ‘Deficits Will Rise to Unsustainable Levels’

(CNSNews.com) - Federal Reserve Chairman Janet Yellen, referencing the Congressional Budget Office's long-term budget projections, told the Joint Economic Committee of Congress today that under current policies the federal government’s deficits “will rise to unsustainable levels.”

Between you, me and that article you posted, I prefer to listen to the federal reserve chairperson.

DEBT is slavery.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

joG said:

That is not true. The govenment does not pay interest on dollar bills and does not have to redeem them. It does have to do so, when the note matures.

Click to expand...

That is exactly how a CD works as well.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

:lamo

Fed Chair:

Fed Chair: ‘Deficits Will Rise to Unsustainable Levels’

(CNSNews.com) - Federal Reserve Chairman Janet Yellen, referencing the Congressional Budget Office's long-term budget projections, told the Joint Economic Committee of Congress today that under current policies the federal government’s deficits “will rise to unsustainable levels.”

Between you, me and that article you posted, I prefer to listen to the federal reserve chairperson.

DEBT is slavery.

Click to expand...

Well she uses a very subjective term, she is not actually saying anything of substance here.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

joG said:

That is not true. The govenment does not pay interest on dollar bills and does not have to redeem them. It does have to do so, when the note matures.

Click to expand...

Yes they do pay interest on dollar bills that are made from nothing.

It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.

Henry Ford

Read more at It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary... - Henry Ford at BrainyQuote

The federal reserve is a private bank and is above our government.

Here is a video that explains how our banking system works. Yes it is animated it is dumbed down on purpose so everyone can understand it. 30 mins video if you have never seen it i urge you to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGk5ioEXlIM


THIS NEXT VIDEO is about three hours long and it explains it all! Its called money masters and this is a MUST WATCH if you dont watch it its your own fault for being ignorant of how our money system works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H56FUHgqRNE


THE MONEY MASTERS is a NON-FICTION, historical documentary that traces the origins of the political power structure. The modern political power structure has its roots in the hidden manipulation and accumulation of gold and other forms of money. The development of fractional reserve banking practices in the 17th century brought to a cunning sophistication the secret techniques initially used by goldsmiths fraudulently to accumulate wealth.

With the formation of the privately-owned Bank of England in 1694, the yoke of economic slavery to a privately-owned "central" bank was first forced upon the backs of an entire nation, not removed but only made heavier with the passing of the three centuries to our day. Nation after nation has fallen prey to this cabal of international central bankers.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

Well she uses a very subjective term, she is not actually saying anything of substance here.

Click to expand...

Are you effing kidding me? /palmface nevermind

Do you even know who she is?

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

Except that the government has no savings account and no CD's.

A better analogy:

You have $12,000 in your checking account. You use it to make a down payment on a future consumable. Now you have $ 0 in your account, and must borrow money to eat.

Then you write a IOU for the balance and hand it to your kids.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

Yes, a dollar is a form of IOU, and, yes, government bonds are IOUs. And one IOU can be swapped for another, just as the types of liabilities on a bank's balance sheet can change when people move their money around within the bank. But here's the problem: the value of those IOUs relative to other assets can and does change. So if you sign up for a CD today that you know will be repaid in dollars that will be worth significantly less next year or five years from now because the bank's interest rates suck you're likely to pull your money from that bank and put it somewhere else. Meanwhile, the bank still has to pay the light bill and salaries for all of those tellers who now stand around doing nothing but their nails and trading gossip because all of its customers have pulled their money out. You see the problem? It's kind of analogous to all of those Japanese corporations that are now liquidating Japanese assets and shopping around the planet for suitable investments as they've seen JGBs pay squat while the yen has lost more than one-fourth of its value in a year-an-a-half. Only a moron would keep his money in such a bank.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

Are you effing kidding me? /palmface nevermind

Do you even know who she is?

Click to expand...

Yes, I am an economics journalist I know exactly who she is. Most people in office are clueless on government finance, including Yellen.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

Are you effing kidding me? /palmface nevermind

Do you even know who she is?

Click to expand...

Yes, I am an economics journalist I know exactly who she is. Most people in office are clueless on government finance, including Yellen.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

joG said:

That is not true. The govenment does not pay interest on dollar bills and does not have to redeem them. It does have to do so, when the note matures.

Click to expand...

they do pay interest on dollar bills created from nothing, the private banking cartel that controls are money gets all of our income taxes.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

Umm this is totally incorrect.

A bond or even a CD is a loan to the bank or in this case the government. when someone buys treasury bonds it is a loan.
the basic definition of a loan is a borrowed sum of money paid over time with interest.

in this case bonds and CD's have a maturity rate. you will get the full amount of the bond or CD plus interest when it matures.
it is in essense a loan.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

Yes they do pay interest on dollar bills that are made from nothing.

It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.

Henry Ford

Click to expand...

While I share some of the reservations about our money system, I'm not sure that arguments from authority are of much use, especially comments made almost 100 years ago....

votemout said:

The federal reserve is a private bank and is above our government.

Click to expand...

While I realize and have argued to many that the Fed is not a government institution, it's clearly not a "private company" the way that Goldman Sachs is a private company. Having said that, I think that the system is too much under the control of private individuals who's motivations for profit don't always align with what's good for the public at large.

votemout said:

Here is a video that explains how our banking system works. Yes it is animated it is dumbed down on purpose so everyone can understand it. 30 mins video if you have never seen it i urge you to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGk5ioEXlIM

Click to expand...

I've watched this vid as well as a very long series, Money as Debt by Paul Grignon.

Paul's series is very interesting and one that has made me want to understand more about our financial system.

I think the most interesting point Paul makes is something he calls "the twice spent dollar". The idea that money loaned into the system can be captured and loaned over and over, which can cause serious problems. He also suggests that the system builds in a guaranteed amount of defaults. Which if you think about it, a loan made from thin air is secured with items of real value (a house for example). When people default banks get something of real value, which is only a problem if causing defaults is done as a way to capture real property for a fraction of it's original value.

votemout said:

THIS NEXT VIDEO is about three hours long and it explains it all! Its called money masters and this is a MUST WATCH if you don't watch it its your own fault for being ignorant of how our money system works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H56FUHgqRNE

Click to expand...

Bill Still's video's for the last 6 months or so. He makes a lot of interesting points, but recently I've caught some things that have really unsettled me about Bill. He jumped onto a conspiracy about "Thorium powered" cars..... He's since deleted it after I pointed out how silly the idea was.....

Here is a generic vid on the topic,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lQTuvUJdAA

Bill jumped all over this, believing that the reason that we don't have these cars is all a big conspiracy....This is just foolish non-sense.

He also thinks that the JFK assassination was a hoax and thinks that the video was doctored and points out why.....

Now he's spent weeks covering the Malaysian flight that disappeared.....

So what who cares? I just don't trust Bill, he might be right about lots of things, but he hurts his own credibility, when he clearly doesn't vet his own stories and often speaks about things he has little to no knowledge of.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

ludin said:

Umm this is totally incorrect.

A bond or even a CD is a loan to the bank or in this case the government. when someone buys treasury bonds it is a loan.
the basic definition of a loan is a borrowed sum of money paid over time with interest.

in this case bonds and CD's have a maturity rate. you will get the full amount of the bond or CD plus interest when it matures.
it is in essense a loan.

Click to expand...

The government is not in search of USD and doesn't actually need USD. IT simply offers up TS's as a way to drain reserves. It is an archaic policy that was once used in war days to finance the government. IT is no longer financing anything. It is just a practice.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

Yes, I am an economics journalist I know exactly who she is. Most people in office are clueless on government finance, including Yellen.

Click to expand...

:lamo:shock:

I assure you Yellen knows more about our .gov debt and financing then most of our elected officials.
Yea your right her 30+years working in the banking system, most of which was for our federal reserve banking masters, means nothing.

Can i ask who it is you write for? did YOU WRITE THAT PARTICULAR ARTICLE?

You need to watch those videos i posted just saying.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

:lamo:shock:

I assure you Yellen knows more about our .gov debt and financing then most of our elected officials.
Yea your right her 30+years working in the banking system, most of which was for our federal reserve banking masters, means nothing.

Can i ask who it is you write for? did YOU WRITE THAT PARTICULAR ARTICLE?

You need to watch those videos i posted just saying.

Click to expand...

None of this is a loan. The government prints it's own money, and most of that eventually comes back to them when savers exchange their dollars for government bonds. I understand that this is a very hard thing to get past - we have all heard for so long that the "national debt" is something that needs to be paid back that few people stop to consider what is actually happening. But if you just examine the mechanics behind money creation and bond sales, you will soon understand that nobody is loaning the U.S. government anything.

The government is not at the mercy of bond auctions. First of all, they are in close communication with dealers and know ahead of time what to expect, so they can adjust the volume of bonds accordingly. Second, they can and do buy up their own bonds when necessary, which drives the price of the bonds up, and therefore the interest rate down.

What happens if nobody buys a bond? Then those parties continue to hold their dollars, and the government steps in to buy them. Since the government prints up dollars, this operation costs them nothing. But demand hasn't been a problem - rates are hovering around 1% or so, and that's without any government interference. Even 1% beats the 0.25% paid on reserve balances, so banks are reliably buying them up. But bond sales are not necessary for funding operations, only printing is.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

votemout said:

they do pay interest on dollar bills created from nothing, the private banking cartel that controls are money gets all of our income taxes.

Click to expand...

the federal reserve is not a private bank it is a GSE and is reportable to congress.

it doesn't keep any money at the end of the year if any money is made it is returned to the treasury.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

None of this is a loan. The government prints it's own money, and most of that eventually comes back to them when savers exchange their dollars for government bonds. I understand that this is a very hard thing to get past - we have all heard for so long that the "national debt" is something that needs to be paid back that few people stop to consider what is actually happening. But if you just examine the mechanics behind money creation and bond sales, you will soon understand that nobody is loaning the U.S. government anything.

The government is not at the mercy of bond auctions. First of all, they are in close communication with dealers and know ahead of time what to expect, so they can adjust the volume of bonds accordingly. Second, they can and do buy up their own bonds when necessary, which drives the price of the bonds up, and therefore the interest rate down.

What happens if nobody buys a bond? Then those parties continue to hold their dollars, and the government steps in to buy them. Since the government prints up dollars, this operation costs them nothing. But demand hasn't been a problem - rates are hovering around 1% or so, and that's without any government interference. Even 1% beats the 0.25% paid on reserve balances, so banks are reliably buying them up. But bond sales are not necessary for funding operations, only printing is.

Click to expand...

:doh the government does print some money when neede by the federal reserve, but it also borrows money when it sells treasury bonds. those bonds are considered loans since they must be paid back when they mature with interest. it is considered a debt.

the government buying up bonds is called QE and is heavily frowned on. in fact the market reacts negatively when they do this. stocks and other financials started to jump up when the government stopped it's QE program. the dollar jumped in value and the hit to gold was substiantial.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

csbrown28 said:

While I share some of the reservations about our money system, I'm not sure that arguments from authority are of much use, especially comments made almost 100 years ago....



While I realize and have argued to many that the Fed is not a government institution, it's clearly not a "private company" the way that Goldman Sachs is a private company. Having said that, I think that the system is too much under the control of private individuals who's motivations for profit don't always align with what's good for the public at large.



I've watched this vid as well as a very long series, Money as Debt by Paul Grignon.

Paul's series is very interesting and one that has made me want to understand more about our financial system.

I think the most interesting point Paul makes is something he calls "the twice spent dollar". The idea that money loaned into the system can be captured and loaned over and over, which can cause serious problems. He also suggests that the system builds in a guaranteed amount of defaults. Which if you think about it, a loan made from thin air is secured with items of real value (a house for example). When people default banks get something of real value, which is only a problem if causing defaults is done as a way to capture real property for a fraction of it's original value.




Bill Still's video's for the last 6 months or so. He makes a lot of interesting points, but recently I've caught some things that have really unsettled me about Bill. He jumped onto a conspiracy about "Thorium powered" cars..... He's since deleted it after I pointed out how silly the idea was.....

Here is a generic vid on the topic,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lQTuvUJdAA

Bill jumped all over this, believing that the reason that we don't have these cars is all a big conspiracy....This is just foolish non-sense.

He also thinks that the JFK assassination was a hoax and thinks that the video was doctored and points out why.....

Now he's spent weeks covering the Malaysian flight that disappeared.....

So what who cares? I just don't trust Bill, he might be right about lots of things, but he hurts his own credibility, when he clearly doesn't vet his own stories and often speaks about things he has little to no knowledge of.

Click to expand...

Federal Reserve Bank Ownership

Federal Reserve Bank Ownership

Q: Who owns the Federal Reserve Bank?

A: There are actually 12 different Federal Reserve Banks around the country, and they are owned by big private banks. But the banks don’t necessarily run the show. Nationally, the Federal Reserve System is led by a Board of Governors whose seven members are appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate.

FULL ANSWER

The stockholders in the 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks are the privately owned banks that fall under the Federal Reserve System. These include all national banks (chartered by the federal government) and those state-chartered banks that wish to join and meet certain requirements. About 38 percent of the nation’s more than 8,000 banks are members of the system, and thus own the Fed banks.

The concept of "ownership" needs some explaining here, however. The member banks must by law invest 3 percent of their capital as stock in the Reserve Banks, and they cannot sell or trade their stock or even use that stock as collateral to borrow money. They do receive dividends of 6 percent per year from the Reserve Banks and get to elect each Reserve Bank’s board of directors.

The private banks also have a voice in regulating the nation’s money supply and setting targets for short-term interest rates, but it’s a minority voice. Those decisions are made by the Federal Open Market Committee, which has a dozen voting members, only five of whom come from the banks. The remaining seven, a voting majority, are the Fed’s Board of Governors who, as mentioned, are appointed by the president.

The Fed is a little defensive about the question of ownership.

Of course they are defensive think they want you to know our .gov is not in control of our money? you seen what happened to kennedy after he tried to create our own currency outside of the federal reserve.


As far as the money masters video goes.
It is just a history lesson watch it or dont i care less.

as far as Fords statement being over 100 years old, nothing has changed its the same system.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

ludin said:

:doh the government does print some money when neede by the federal reserve, but it also borrows money when it sells treasury bonds. those bonds are considered loans since they must be paid back when they mature with interest. it is considered a debt.

Click to expand...

Again we need to label it on how it behaves, not how we are taught or how our politicians and people in high office label it, that is just an appeal to authority argument, its fallacious.

If we stick to logic and reason, and reason dictates that the government doesn't borrow anything they simply create a savings account, you have to see it as a savings account, not a loan.

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

JP Hochbaum said:

"Here is the best analogy I have heard to illustrate this... You have $12,000 in a non-interest-bearing checking account at your bank. You only need $2000 available for checking, so you put $10,000 of your money in a Certificate of Deposit account at the same bank. The bank marks down your checking account by $10K, and marks up your CD/savings account by $10K. When it matures, the bank marks your CD account down by $10,000 and marks your checking account up by, say, $10,050. You were always in the same financial position - you had $12,000 (now, a bit more). And the bank was always in the same position as well. Nobody ever says that the bank is "in debt" for $10,000 just because you moved money from your checking account into a savings account. Saying that the U.S. government is "in debt" because people have exchanged dollars for government bonds is just as misleading. Government bonds are basically dollar equivalents - you can easily trade them for dollars, or vice versa. And the government creates them both from thin air."

The U.S. "National Debt" explained, MMT-style

There is no reason to fear the national debt as people fear it today. It is the greatest single fear that holds our economy back from becoming full employment and achieving higher growth numbers.

Click to expand...

OK.

Now, out of curiosity, is the FedGov never collected another dime of tax money then how much can your "CD" be redeemed for?

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

ludin said:

the federal reserve is not a private bank it is a GSE and is reportable to congress.

it doesn't keep any money at the end of the year if any money is made it is returned to the treasury.

Click to expand...

Federal Reserve Bank Ownership

Federal Reserve Board: As the nation’s central bank, the Federal Reserve derives its authority from the U.S. Congress. It is considered an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government, it does not receive funding appropriated by Congress, and the terms of the members of the Board of Governors span multiple presidential and congressional terms. However, the Federal Reserve is subject to oversight by Congress, which periodically reviews its activities and can alter its responsibilities by statute. Also, the Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government. Therefore, the Federal Reserve can be more accurately described as "independent within the government."

would you like to see how this oversight works?
bernie sanders ask bernanke who got bail out loans - AVG Yahoo Search Results


Here is where Bernie sanders asks the federal reserve to whom they lent 2.2 trillion dollars of"our" money and The bernanke flatly tells him NO!. Thats 2.2 trillion we have to pay interest on.



here is bernie sanders asking now fed head janet yellen are we an oligarchy? interesting how she answers. oppressive obama economic policies? lmao.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2Nk25C6mes

What Is an Oligarchy? (with pictures)


have fun researching

Re: The government debt is not a debt.

Lutherf said:

OK.

Now, out of curiosity, is the FedGov never collected another dime of tax money then how much can your "CD" be redeemed for?

Click to expand...

The amount of principle and interest that was initially agreed upon.