Gladiator

Do you have a link that describes the relationship of the Anti-Contraceptive and Anti-Choice Christian Right with the Neocons? Certainly there must be some overlap.


..

__________________
_______________________________
How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

Gladiator

Neocon, Christian Right and Zionist Partnership for War in Iraq:

How the Neocon-Christian Right Alliance Brought Down the House of Bush | War on Iraq | AlterNet


I searched: Neocons Chrsitian Right


"The most fervent supporters of Likud in the Republican electorate are Southern Protestant fundamentalists. The religious right believes that God gave all of Palestine to the Jews, and fundamentalist congregations spend millions to subsidize Jewish settlements in the occupied territories.

The final corner of the neoconservative pentagon is occupied by several right-wing media empires, with roots – odd as it seems – in the British Commonwealth and South Korea. Rupert Murdoch disseminates propaganda through his Fox television network. His magazine, the Weekly Standard – edited by William Kristol, the former chief of staff of Dan Quayle (vice president, 1989-1993) – acts as a mouthpiece for defense intellectuals such as Perle, Wolfowitz, Feith and Woolsey as well as for Sharon's government."


How Neoconservatives Conquered Washington – and Launched a War, by Michael Lind


"Although he makes valid points in his arguments, Horowitz is himself part of an “unholy alliance” that consists of secular neoconservatives and the Christian Right. While I am not going to defend those on the Left who harbor contempt for America, the alliance that I speak of has done considerable damage to our foreign policy.

This partnership between neocons and Christian fundamentalists is not some grand conspiracy to control the world. Rather, the relationship is symbiotic on several major levels, and adversarial on others. Although significant differences exist between and within the two groups, they are held together by two issues.

The first is that both believe America should dominate the globe as the world’s only superpower and its military should be used as an instrument for advancing the cause of democracy and free markets.

The second deals with the lopsided support that the groups give to Israel. Neocons and Christian fundamentalists oppose any move on Israel’s part to “scale back” in terms of territory or power, and attack those who disagree with them on this issue. For many of them, Israel’s interests come first, even if they conflict with U.S. policy. "


Unholy Alliance: Neoconservatives and the Christian Right - ToTheCenter


"the evolution has been quite steady, particularly since the end of the Carter administration, when you had the Likud government in Israel, which was strongly backed by what became increasingly known as neoconservatives in the United States, reached out to Christian Zionists in the hope that they would be a lobby that would favor the settlement movement in Israel or in the West Bank and Gaza as a way of defeating Carter, who had brought many, many Christian fundamentalists and evangelicals to the polls because he was a born-again Christian, but whose ideas about the rights of Palestinians to a homeland deeply threatened both Likud and traditional Christian Zionists within the larger evangelical and fundamentalist movement. In 1982, there was still a major debate within the Jewish community as to whether the organized Jewish community should be united strategically with Christian Zionists like Jerry Falwell, or whether that should be regarded as too dangerous, in a sense. And this debate was carried out in the pages of the commentary magazine, which was published by the American Jewish Committee and edited by Norman Podhoretz, the really founding figures of modern neoconservatism. Irving Kristol, also one of the major figures in neoconservatism, and father of Bill Kristol, now editor of The Weekly Standard, wrote a letter to the editor which kind of settled the debate, in which he argued that as objectionable as Jews might find Christian Zionist theology, in fact it was, quote, "It was their theology, but it is our Israel." And thus the strategic tie between Christian Zionists and neoconservatives was essentially forged."

The Real News Network - Story


So maybe Neocons assist with the Anti-contraceptive and Anti-Choice agenda, not from their own philosphy, but from ther alliance with the Christian Right; as simply back scratching, mutual support of an ally, a throw away issue for a Neocon.

So in one sense, Israel is allowing or backing more settlements, in Palestinian areas, to please the Christian Right, that believes the Palestinains should leave the Holy Land. This is news to me!



..

__________________
_______________________________
How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

section eight

That there were epic failures and miscommunications not that there were intentional actions to allow 9-11 to happen.

To most save for notable exceptions like Able danger.

I don't believe that neocons swear a blood oath and are a tightly affiliate group of characters, and I don't believe Rummie, Cheney, or Libby looked the other way on 9-11.

They supported the overthrow of Saddam through clandestine support of opposition groups, but I'm not sure about direct action I seem to recall a video of Cheney right after 9-11 saying that he didn't support overthrowing the Baathist regime, anyways why would they frame a bunch of Saudi's in order to attack Iraq?

A) If they didn't issue a shootdown order that only proves one thing that Cheney is a human being who didn't want to give the order to fire on a civilian airliner.

B) It was in fact a shoot down order that he gave not a stand down order.

The U.S. was working hard for a peace settlement, Arafat scuttled it, and again the U.S. was and is the largest benefactor to the Palestinians.

lol ya they only started trying to win the war in Iraq for political expediency, prior to that they didn't want to win because it wouldn't help them politically, right? :eyeroll:

So?

Who knows if it was or not?

And don't forget the surge.

Yes "facts" like the Republicans only wanted to start winning the war in 2006 for political expediency. :eyeroll:

The 9-11 report was co-authored by a bi-partisan blue ribbon panel.

Because your view of reality is laughable, much like most conspiracy theorists you enjoy conflating mistakes and miscommunication as intent.

section eight

O.K. then show me this actionable intelligence that was received prior to 9-11.

Gladiator

You accept the 9-11 Report.

A main point of hte 9-11 report was to fulfill the Neocon agenda for increasing survelance powers of teh US Government.

So the 9-11 report conclueds that there ws insufficient coordination of bits of precursor indications ofr 9-11. So the conclusion is that US citizen privacy should be compormised.

Bank and phone records

Eavesdrop on US citizen phone calls.

Integration of CIA and FBI and NSA data banks, for furhter crosschecking on US citizens and foreign nationals.

The Necons got Fisa amended, and got away witn ignoring Fisa. The Neocons won.

These were US Citizen privacy rights, and people who believe the 9-11 commission report have willingly given up their previously held rights to privacy.

Was that your goal?



..

__________________
_______________________________
How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

section eight

Most of it yes.

Again the 9-11 Commission was a bi-partisan blue ribbon panel not a neocon brainstorming session.

Banking and phone records are not protected by the 4th amendment and the 9-11 Commission didn't begin that precedent (see Smith V Maryland).

No they eavesdrop on foreign phone calls from suspected terrorists overseas they just don't discontinue the tap if one of these terrorists calls into the U.S..

You think that increased cooperation between our intelligence and law enforcement agencies is a bad thing?

Or here in reality the point of the 9-11 Commission Report was to find out what went wrong and give recommendations to solve the problems.

Furthermore; the "Right to Privacy" doesn't exist it is an invention of the SCOTUS in their decision in Griswold V. Connecticut through their policy of total incorporation plus. But hay why don't you show me some evidence that American citizens non-existent right to privacy has been infringed upon.

Gladiator

So you think it was a good thing that the US citizens gave up some of their privacy, that SCOTUS had given them?

The 19 Saudis were not Framed, they were Incited by the Necons, etc.

If the Neocons in decision and influence positions in Government deliberately ignored intelligence, and permissively allowed 9-11, would you still feel the US citizens were wise to give up a considerable chunk of their privacy rights?





..

__________________
_______________________________
How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

Gladiator

Nothing went wrong on 9-11. An action taken by Islamic militants in response to incitation against the Palestinians, resulted in retalliation by Islamic Militants, 19 Saudis. The American People became Fearful, because many commentators said the attack was a "Surprise." The Amercian People gave up a big chunk of their rights. Also increased Government and Military expenses were authorized. As well as increased discretion of the use of the US military to combat "Terrorism".

Army soldiers were prosecuted who took pictures of the degrading treatment recommended by the CIA, and authoirized by Atty General Gonzales. 9-11 gave the CIA an excuse to humiliate prisoners of war, supposedly to get "Intelligence."

What went Wrong on 9-11? Nothing.

Most people just take the 9-11 Commission report at face value. So the Neocons are winning.


...

__________________
_______________________________
How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

1069

Good post, Gladiator.
That is pretty much my understanding of the situation as well.
If I'm naive, well; at least I'm not alone in my naivete.
I thought you explained that perfectly.

section eight

I really don't think I've given up any of my privacy, and this country has far more civil liberties than at its founding thanks to the SCOTUS's policy of total/partial incorporation plus.

They wrote Milestones and started the movement to resurrect the caliphate and to bring dar al-Harab into the fold of dar al-Islam?

A) Evidence that they deliberately ignored intelligence and evidence for your LIHOP theory.

B) Again I don't really feel like I've given up any of my privacy, please list specific examples of the privacy you have given up.



.