partier9

Im sorry that i have to bring this back up but yes popular mechanics


now last time i brought this up there was a big denouncing of it, like there is of anything that says there is no conspiracy.

Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report - Popular Mechanics

also theres this:
Pentagon - Debunk911myths

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Travelsonic

IMO, these are not valid points, as they lack real solid research and a practical application of critical thinking.


Perhaps inside the pentagon? A Google image search shows plenty f wreckage pieces from fuselage to wheel/engine parts, to anything else. The video was low quality, and 1 frame / second, not something good for getting something flying in from far away.

[quote=Trinity;1057657344 ]The plane was 60 tonnes and it was carrying 5300 gallons of diesel on impact so where r all of it? [/UOTE]

First, your numbers are way off.

The 757 weights around 160 tons, not 60.

A trans-con flight requires tens of thousands of jet-a fuel, not diesel.


If the images are cropped properly, as proven with the "Spot the Plane" crocka crap, it is easy to not see much at all.

2) Airplane crashes leave wreckage.... they mess up the ground ... where r those wing parts? even if u remove those wing parts, those wing parts will show on collision impact with the walls of the Pentagon, or show on the ground and grass as it was broken apart.

[quote=Trinity;10576573443) The Boeing 757 was flying 530 mph 2 feet above the ground? How can it fly that low? Just thinking about it is absurd. It seemed more like a missile that hit the Pentagon. So many witnesses said they heard a whoosh sound like a missile rather than a plane. Noone saw the Boeing 757 of any evidence of a plane that hit it as well.[/quote]

1. There was evidence of a 757's presence, and 2) Many witness testimony support it either being a 757, or an American Airlines plane.

[quote=Trinity;10576573444) The hole shown in the video made by a circle r pretty small, not like those made by a wide-diameter Boeing 757, more like a missile made those instead of a plane, besides where r the wing part entry at collision? For the plane to hit the 3rd concentric ring of the Pentagon, logic assumes that the wings also hit the outer ring of the Pentagon and r left outside. So where r the wing part collision into the walls of the Pentagon?[/quote]

The hole was roughly 16 feet wide, and something close to 14 feet tall. The 757's fuselage is only 12.6 feet wide, and like 13.5 feet tall. Fitting in is not a problem. The wings are aluminum, and are not strong enough to stay together in a full force impact like at the pentagon. The fuselage is the same, but it also had more inside that was still moving, like the galley/lavatory components (modular parts), 188 seats, bags, cargo, bins, people, etc, etc, wiring and electrical parts, and more etc.



Simple. Since when did a missile have landing gear?

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RightinNYC

Nope, you're actually the first one to come upon this groundbreaking and controversial material.

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Pull My Finger

A rebuttal to the Popular Mechanics debunking…

911research: Jim Hoffman Rebuttal

A radio interview with one of the research editors/fact checkers from the PM debunking…

YOUTUBE: Popular Mechanics interview

Peace

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P/N

Yawn...

If Elvis were alive he'd get a kick out of all the conspiracy theorists. Oh wait...

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Pull My Finger

Length…

Some facts about the 9/11 Report:

• It took over a year to investigate 9/11 after much pressure.

• The investigation was originally allotted $3 million compared to $50 million for the Challenger disaster.

• Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton, (Chair, and Vice Chair of the commission) dedicated the first chapter of their book Without Precedent: The Inside Story of the 9/11 Commission to how the investigation lacked completeness. They cited these problems:

1. the late start of the Commission
2. the very short deadline imposed
3. insufficient funds
4. the many politicians who did not want the Commission formed
5. the continuing resistance by many politicians wishing to duck blame.
6. the denial of access by various agencies to documents and witnesses.

• They write that the 9/11 Commission was so frustrated with repeated misstatements by officials from the Pentagon and the FAA during the investigation that it considered a separate investigation into possible obstruction of justice by Pentagon and FAA officials

• The Commission was forced to use subpoenas to obtain the cooperation of the FAA and NORAD.

• Former FBI, NSA and other federal intelligence experts claim the 9/11 Commission report was fundamentally flawed because the Commission refused to hear, ignored, or censored testimony about the many pre-September 11 warnings given to the FBI and U.S. intelligence agencies.

• Pre 9/11 documents about the warnings Bush received were only viewed by 4 Commissioners, and not disclosed to the public. These commissioners viewed the documents in private and took notes. The Administration reserved the right to edit those notes.

• Bush’s Presidential Daily Briefing on August 6, 2001, entitled “Bin Laden determined to strike in US” was withheld by the White House from the 9/11 Commission Report. They cited executive privilege.

• Sandy Berger was convicted of destroying top secret documents describing how Clinton handled pre 9/11 terrorism in an apparent attempt to erase any evidence of Clinton mistakes. He is now advisor to the Hilary Clinton campaign.

• The Commission states in their report that "[their] aim has not been to assign individual blame." The whole point of the investigation was to find out how, where, and when America’s multi-billion dollar defence, and intelligence system failed so incredibly. Not one person has been held accountable.

• Before it was released, the final public report was screened and edited, including an entire chapter detailing the Saudi’s that was blacked out. Most of the alleged 9/11 terrorists were from Saudi Arabia.

• Clinton, Gore, Bush, and Cheneyall refused to testify under oath. Bush & Cheney insisted on testifying together. Their testimony was given in private, and edited. Condoleezza Rice was also not required to testify under oath. Bush ordered other aides not to testify despite subpoenas.

• Building 7 imploded, yet the building was not mentioned at all.

• Six or more of the alleged terrorists were known to be alive, but not included in the report.

• The official flight manifests of the hijacked planes that were released to the public did not include the alleged hijackers’ names, or even an Arab name. This didn’t show up in the 9/11 report.

• The Administration was not required to provide proof that the alleged hijackers had ties to AQ.

• Hani Hanjour’s flying instructor testified that Hanjour was not skilled enough to perform the extraordinary flying feat required to hit the Pentagon. His testimony was ignored.

• All mentions of pre-9/11 warnings from foreign governments were left out.

• There are approximately 80 known videos of the Pentagon attack that the FBI confiscated. Repeated attempts to have them released have been denied. The report did not mention the tapes or the struggle to have them released.

• Dozens of testimonies indicated that multiple explosions went off at ‘ground zero’. Large amounts of molten metal were found in the debris at WTC 1,2 and 7 up to six weeks after the collapses. The report failed to acknowledge any of it, nor did any investigation pursue the possibility of explosives.

• The report did not mention that all of the crash sites were illegally cleaned up before an investigation of the wreckage could be done. Nobody was reprimanded for the crime.

• Bush was in a publicized location during the attacks. The Secret Service exhibited a complete dereliction of duty in not ‘whisking’ the President away to safety. His motorcade and plane were not protected. The report ignored this. Nobody in the Secret Service was reprimanded.

• There are significant ties between the Bush family and security at WTC, Dulles airport, and United Airlines. This was not reported.

• The Report refers to the interior columns as a ‘hollow steel shaft’. In fact, there are 47 massive steel columns in the core of each tower.

• The Report explains the collapse of WTC 1&2 as a ‘pancake theory’. This theory was based on the non-existence of the 47 steel columns, and is not feasible when the columns are taken into account. It has since been retracted.

• There were war games that replicated similar scenarios taking place at the same time of the 9/11 attacks. This greatly confused the different agencies responsible for responding. Not one commissioner could answer who was in charge of these war games, nor did the report detail this.

• When noting the above, it should also be remembered that the Administration claimed they had no idea that planes could ever be used as ‘missiles’. In fact, the scenario was rehearsed before (not including the 9/11 war games), and a report was done detailing such an attack. This wasn’t in the 9/11 report either.

• There is strong evidence to suggest that Cheney lied about activities on Sept 11. Contrary to all testimony, the Commission insisted Cheney had been truthful.

• The report ignored the idea that anyone besides Al Qaeda could have had prior knowledge to 9/11 when dealing with the highly suspicious insider trading that preceded the 9/11 attacks. They did not investigate the company found to have made some of the trades (AB Brown). AB Brown was formerly headed by CIA head “Buzzy” Crongard.

• The commission described the specific warnings given to officials not to fly on Sept 11, as a broad and general heightened alert. This still demonstrates foreknowledge of possible attacks involving airplanes, which the commission ignores, or fails to acknowledge on any other occasion.

• Larry Silverstein placed an immense insurance policy on the WTC six weeks prior to 9/11 in which he made billions of dollars after the attacks. Silverstein himself said they decided to “pull it” (building 7), which is the demolition term for a controlled demolition. The report did not detail this matter.

• The Report officially deemed the financing of the attacks to be “of little significance.”

• The CIA funded, and trained members of Al Qaeda (before they were AQ) during the Afghan Soviet War. There are reports (CBS, Newsweek, & US Senators) that show the hijackers may have had links to the FBI, CIA, and domestic US Navy bases prior to 9/11. There are reports (Guardian, LeFigaro) that Bin Laden was staying in an American hospital in Dubai in July of 2001, where he was visited by a CIA official. None of this was detailed or investigated. The CIA offered a blanket denial.

• The commission came to the conclusion that because of the incredible ineptness of the FAA, the military didn’t have enough time to respond – based largely on the military’s testimony. The military had been shown to have lied repeatedly from 2001, to 2004 regarding their actions on 9/11.

• In a paper entitled ‘Air War Over America’ the US Air Force confirmed that the FAA responded accordingly.

• The 9/11 Commission's report stated they were "unable to locate the source of the mistaken FAA information."

• No one from the FAA was reprimanded.

Cooperative Research
Scholars for 911 truth

The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions by David Ray Griffin

Without Precedent: The Inside Story of the 9/11 Commission by Thomas Kean
and Lee Hamilton

Peace

Pull My Finger

Who Warned the US Prior to 9/11?

• Indonesia – 1998
• Britain – 1999
• Germany – 1999
• Italy – 2000
• Italy – Jan, 2001
• Italy – Mar, 2001
• Bin Laden – Summer 2001
• Germany – June, 2001
• Egypt – June, 2001
• India – July, 2001
• Britain – July, 2001
• Argentina – July, 2001
• Taliban – July, 2001
• Egypt – July, 2001
• Jordan – Late Summer
• Morroco – Aug, 2001
• Russia – Aug, 2001
• Persian Gulf Informant – Aug, 2001
• Britain – Aug, 2001
• Israel - Aug, 2001
• The Mossad – Aug, 2001
• Cayman’s – Aug, 2001
• France – Aug, 2001
• Egypt – Sept, 2001
• The Mossad – Sept, 2001
• France – Sept 7, 2001
• intercepted Bin Laden call telling wife to go back to Afghanistan – early September

These warnings were withheld from the official investigation.

Bush’s Presidential Daily Briefing on August 6, 2001, entitled “Bin Laden determined to strike in US” was withheld from the 9/11 Commission Report. They cited executive privilege.

Robert Wright, an FBI Special Agent had this to say when his attempt to investigate certain individuals was repeatedly thwarted by FBI bureaucrats.
This is what he had to say after 9/11.
Wright sued the FBI for gagging his efforts to publish a book about the matter.

John O’Neill, FBI special agent, was the expert on UBL & AQ. He too was frustrated by the FBI’s behavior regarding specific internal threats. He died at WTC, the first or second day of his new job as head of WTC security, at the hands of his nemesis, UBL. Investigating his death brings up some interesting connections…

Here's one documentary/movie that explores it.

Who Killed John O’Neill

Cooperative Research
Scholars for 9/11 truth
Scholars for 9/11 truth & justice
PBS FRONTLINE: John O’Neill the man who knew

Peace

Pull My Finger

Project for the New American Century (PNAC) is a neo-conservative think tank based in Washington, founded in1997. Co-founders include William Kristol, Robert Kagan (CFR), Paul Wolfowitz (CFR), Dick Cheney (CFR), and Donald Rumsfeld.

PNAC establishes 4 Core Missions for the US military in its document Rebuilding America's Defenses: Strategies, Forces, and Resources for a New Century (2000)

• Defend the American Homeland
• Fight and win multiple, simultaneous major theatre wars
• Perform ‘constabulary’ duties associated with shaping the security environment in critical regions
• Transform US forces to exploit the ‘revolution in military affairs’

Other outlines include:

• Maintain nuclear strategic superiority
• Restore personnel strength
• Reposition US forces
• Modernize current US forces selectively
• Cancel ‘roadblock’ programs
• Develop and deploy global missile defenses
• Control the new ‘international commons’ of space and cyberspace
• Exploit the ‘revolution in military affairs
• Increase defense spending

They write:

“Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor"

After Bush took the White House, PNAC members became the men who run the White House, the Pentagon, and the Defense Department.

PNAC members in the Bush Administration

• Elliott Abrams – Held positions inside the National Security Council
• Richard Armitage – Deputy Secretary of State
• John Bolton – US Ambassador to the United Nations
• Dick Cheney – Vice President
• Eliot Cohen – Member of Defense Policy Advisory Board
• Seth Cropsey – Director of International Broadcasting Bureau
• Paula Dobrianski – Undersecretary of state for Global Affairs
• Francis Fukuyama – Member President’s Council on Bioethics
• Zalmay Khalilzad – Ambassador to Afghanistan, Iraq, UN
• Lewis ‘Scooter’ Libby – Chief of Staff to VP
• Richard Pearle - Chairman of the Board, Defense Policy Board Advisory Committee
• Peter Rodman – Assistant Secretary of Defense for International Security
• Donald Rumsfeld – Secretary of Defense
• Randy Scheunemann - Member of the U.S. Committee on NATO
• Paul Wolfowitz – Deputy Secretary of Defense
• Dov Zakheim – Department of Defense Comptroller
• Robert Zoellick – US Trade Rep, Deputy Secretary of State

PNAC: Official site (suspended account)
PNAC: Rebuilding America’s Defenses (suspended account)
WIKI: Project for the New American Century

Peace

partier9

um that it way to much to go over, im not sure why we should continue to debate with you, your obviously completly into the belief of 9/11 being a inside job. So the fact that there is no way to convince you to see logic, than what is the point of this? For you to convince others?

Pull My Finger

I realize there is a lot of information there, and many will not take the time to go through it. Trinity asked a lot of questions about 9/11. I posted a summary of the facts I have come across. I posted it for people who are a little new to the 9/11 controversy.

I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything. If you had read the information in my posts, you’d see my opinion hasn’t been given. It’s just a bunch of facts… If one concludes that I am skeptic or that 9/11 was possibly an ‘inside job’ from that information, it says a lot about the facts…

Peace